# "Whale farming" -- possible? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 5, 2014, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449 "2014-10-05T12:26:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![vontsira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/51bf81/32.png) [@vontsira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vontsira)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/1 "2014-10-05T12:26:48Z")
I have an interest in nature and the animal kingdom; but with areas of ignorance on these topics. A thing recently came to mind, concerning which I’d be interested in thoughts from those better-informed than myself. I read, a long time ago, a book by a British guy who had been a ship’s doctor on a whaling factory ship in the 1950s. The author was a medical doctor, not a biologist or conservationist; the book wasn’t whale-centred as such, it was rather from a general-interest angle of recounting a long voyage to remote parts of the earth to harvest marine life, and the human dynamics of same. In the book, the author engaged in musing to the effect that oceanic whaling at that date in history, struck him as an instance of the human tendency to prefer entertainingly difficult and complicated ways of doing things, to simpler but duller ones. He postulated a notion of capturing alive a certain number of whales – of appropriate species for human use when dead – and relocating them to suitable inland lakes (he mentioned Loch Ness as one potential such), where they might live and breed, and be caught and killed as needed: this way, seeming much easier than seeking whales relatively at random, over huge areas of ocean, and bringing the products therefrom thousands of miles back to where it was needed. Any informed opinions on whether such a ploy could ever possibly work? Am thinking strictly in terms of what might be possible, practically – leaving economic / humanitarian / conservation aspects, aside. It occurs to me to wonder whether naturally ocean-dwelling whales could cope, in bodies of fresh water – one of many things which I don’t know. Might the thing ever be successfully done, if people were motivated to try it – or was the author totally talking out of the back of his neck? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/2 "2014-10-05T12:31:18Z")
! blue whale=4 tons of krill per day. And I doubt Purina will be making Whale Chow any time soon. And imagine the bag it would come in. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/3 "2014-10-05T13:10:27Z")
Baleen whales need huge areas of ocean to produce their food. There’s a reason no zoo in the world has a baleen whale display. From what I gather from all of one single google search, these two baby gray whales are the only baleen whales ever held captive: > [@](#): > > Because of their size and need to migrate, gray whales have rarely been held in captivity, and then only for brief periods of time. > > In 1972, a three-month-old gray whale named Gigi (II) was captured for brief study by Dr. David W. Kenney, and then released near San Diego.[96] > > In January 1997, the newborn baby whale J.J. was found helpless near Los Angeles, California, 4.2 m (14 ft) long and 800 kilograms (1,800 lb) in weight. Nursed back to health in SeaWorld San Diego, she was released into the Pacific Ocean on March 31, 1998, 9 m (30 ft) long and 8,500 kg (18,700 lb) in mass. She shed her radio transmitter packs three days later.[97] > **[Gray whale](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_whale#Captivity)** > > The gray whale (Eschrichtius robustus), also known as the grey whale, is a baleen whale that migrates between feeding and breeding grounds yearly. It reaches a length of 14.9 meters (49 ft), a weight of up to 41 tonnes (90,000 lb) and lives between 55 and 70 years, although one female was estimated to be 75–80 years of age. The common name of the whale comes from the gray patches and white mottling on its dark skin. Gray whales were once called devil fish because of their fightin The gray wha... ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/4 "2014-10-05T13:20:20Z")
Besides the obvious, whales live in salt water, which Loch Ness ( or most other lakes) are not. ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/5 "2014-10-05T14:05:10Z")
> [@vontsira](#): > > I read, a long time ago, a book by a British guy who had been a ship’s doctor on a whaling factory ship in the 1950s. Sounds like [_Of Whales and Men_](http://www.amazon.com/Of-Whales-Men-R-Robertson/dp/0671203517) by R. B. Robertson - a very interesting book. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/6 "2014-10-05T14:37:55Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > Besides the obvious, whales live in salt water, which Loch Ness ( or most other lakes) are not. Less obvious than you think. Humans can swim equally well in fresh water or salt, and so can whales, or any other air-breathing mammals… It is important only with respect to the food species that they depend upon. Some birds frequent the shores of fresh water and some salt, because of the presence of what they prefer to eat. But the salinity of the water would be of no relevance to an air-breathing organism that live in it. However, a whale would be more at risk in fresh water, because it has evolved no resistance to any fresh water parasites, and might be more prone to infections of surface wounds which would not heal properly in fresh water. Whale is just the word we use in the vernacular, to name large Cetaceans, and the smaller ones are called dolphins, which could certainly be farmed in captivity. Many dolphins live in fresh water, including the upper Amazon. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/7 "2014-10-05T14:54:28Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > Less obvious than you think. Humans can swim equally well in fresh water or salt, and so can whales, or any other air-breathing mammals… No that’s not true, whales have been observed to swim into fresh water environment for a week or two but after that they develop serious infections and either return to salt water or die. > **[Can Sea Mammals Live in Fresh Water](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=523995)** > > I was reading about the Lake Baikal Seals and got to thinking about this. If I took a walrus or whale or dolphin or manatee or any other kind of sea mamman that normally lives only in salt water and put it in Lake Michigan, for example, could it... ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/8 "2014-10-05T15:30:20Z")
The fresh water isn’t the big problem, per se. Dolphins have evolved to adapt to freshwater environments on several occasions, and manatees can live in freshwater as well, so clearly it can be done. Switching between fresh and salt water is a major problem for fish, but much less so for mammals, because we have a better ability to osmoregulate. Skin infections seems to be a problem, but no doubt it could be dealt with too. The big problem with farming whales (which would, really, make it impossible) is that they’re large animals with a concomitantly slow growth rate, and the rate at which you could harvest them sustainably (as well as the investment in time) would be uneconomical. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/9 "2014-10-05T15:44:55Z")
Whale milk is already thicker than Greek yogurt. And we know how successful that has been. Better to keep dairy whales than meat whales, for a number of reasons. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/10 "2014-10-05T15:57:44Z")
The op Is asking about whales. Not Dolphins or manatees. Whales Cannot live in freshwater so it’s a non issue. ---
**Author:** ![vontsira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/51bf81/32.png) [@vontsira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vontsira)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/11 "2014-10-05T16:00:57Z")
> [@Xema](#): > > Sounds like [_Of Whales and Men_](http://www.amazon.com/Of-Whales-Men-R-Robertson/dp/0671203517) by R. B. Robertson - a very interesting book. Thank you ! Seems very much, that that’s the book – I feel moved to acquire and re-read it. From the link, the whaling ship was a Norwegian one; but from what I recall, the author mentioned a fair number of Brits being among the crew: most especially, Shetland Islanders. With the Shetlands being as close to Norway distance-wise, as they are to Edinburgh, that is reckonably no surprise. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/12 "2014-10-05T16:20:00Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > The op Is asking about whales. Not Dolphins or manatees. Whales Cannot live in freshwater so it’s a non issue. Well, there are saltwater lakes, or you could close off some inlet of the sea, like a Norwegian fijord, for instance, or any deep bay with a relatively narrow entrance. But it is impractical for quite other reasons, as other posters have pointed out. Whales need a lot of ocean to roam in to live comfortably and to find their food (and a lot of food), and they grow very slowly. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/13 "2014-10-05T17:12:10Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > The op Is asking about whales. Not Dolphins or manatees. Whales Cannot live in freshwater so it’s a non issue. Dolphins _are_ whales. “Dolphin” and “whale” are common names and have no taxonomic significance, and are applied to different species mainly on the basis of size. Whether something is called a dolphin or a whale has no significance as to whether it can live in fresh water. Some marine mammals can live in both fresh and salt water. However, most live in either one or the other. Whales that eat fish or other marine mammals probably get most of the fresh water they need from their food, since fish and mammal body fluids have about the same salinity as the whale’s own blood. However, those that eat crustaceans such as krill or mollusks like squid have to deal with food that has a salt content similar to that of seawater. Their kidneys are probably adapted to deal with that level of salinity, and they might have physiological problems in fresh water. But as has been said, the real problem is food supply. The great baleen whales rely on the highly productive upwelling systems of the Antarctic and Arctic or other upwelling areas to provide the huge amounts of food they need. These systems are not duplicated in any freshwater system. Sperm whales and some other whales feed mostly on squid, a diet that could not effectively be provided in freshwater systems. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/14 "2014-10-05T17:44:28Z")
Instead of whale farmers, how about whale _herders_? Tag each of ‘your’ whales with a marking and a transponder, and just keep track of them as they move in the open sea? Anyone catching a marked whale without permission would be a whale rustler. Would be a way to cut down on random hunting… ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/15 "2014-10-05T17:54:48Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > Instead of whale farmers, how about whale _herders_? > > Tag each of ‘your’ whales with a marking and a transponder, and just keep track of them as they move in the open sea? Anyone catching a marked whale without permission would be a whale rustler. Would be a way to cut down on random hunting… Since anti-whalers problem with hunting isn’t the randomness of it, that’s not a real benefit. And I can’t see any other benefits either … ---
**Author:** ![JesterX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@JesterX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JesterX)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/16 "2014-10-05T17:55:57Z")
I know the Japanese still engage in whale hunting but what modern products do we still need to harvest whales for? ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/17 "2014-10-05T18:22:18Z")
> [@JesterX](#): > > I know the Japanese still engage in whale hunting but what modern products do we still need to harvest whales for? Whale meat. Other than that, nothing. Just as we don’t need to hunt deer, breed pigs, cut down mahogany, catch tuna, pick oysters, fish crab, grow corn, etc. etc. ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/18 "2014-10-05T20:24:25Z")
it was tried but the branding iron didn’t stay hot. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2014, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/19 "2014-10-05T21:52:12Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > Instead of whale farmers, how about whale _herders_? > > Tag each of ‘your’ whales with a marking and a transponder, and just keep track of them as they move in the open sea? Anyone catching a marked whale without permission would be a whale rustler. Would be a way to cut down on random hunting… First of all, I don’t see how you could possibly “herd” whales in the sense that cattle are herded. Cattle are herded to move them to good pastures, water, etc. Since there’s no way you could possibly care for and increase the market value of a whale at sea, what would be the point of marking one before you caught it? And since catching and processing a whale requires investment in a large ship, there would seem to be little economic incentive to “rustle” whales. Where exactly are you going to sell illegal whale meat? ---
**Author:** ![vontsira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/51bf81/32.png) [@vontsira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vontsira)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2014, 10:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449/20 "2014-10-06T10:02:32Z")
Thanks, everyone, for responses. I suspected that “farming whales in lakes” would not in fact be practicable; but recall from reading the book, that the author seemed an intelligent guy – even if no marine biologist – and that his ponderings about the lake option were basically serious, not taking the mickey. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whale-farming-possible/700449.md?page=2)