# Whales drown in Great Flood **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [November 21, 2011, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669 "2011-11-21T19:00:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![G0sp3l](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c68b51/32.png) [@G0sp3l](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/G0sp3l)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/21 "2011-11-22T00:15:01Z")
> [@Count\_Blucher](#): > > Excuse me. But what does God need with a Whale??? > > Bones, stay here. Spock, you’re with me… What does god need with a bowl of petunias? ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/22 "2011-11-22T00:15:25Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > … the kidneys of a whale allow them to survive by excreting super-concentrated urine with a salt content higher than that of the surrounding sea water. I cannot find anything resembling this. Can you show anything like it? ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/23 "2011-11-22T00:40:16Z")
> [@SiXSwordS](#): > > I cannot find anything resembling this. Can you show anything like it? I found a [cite](http://faculty.clintoncc.suny.edu/faculty/michael.gregory/files/bio%20102/bio%20102%20lectures/excretory%20system/excretor.htm) from some professor’s class notes at SUNY in New York: > [@](#): > > Sea Mammals > > The kidneys of sea mammals (ex: seals, whales, porpoises) are able to maintain a constant salt concentration in their bodies by producing urine that has a high concentration of salt. > > They are able to drink seawater because the salt concentration of their urine is higher than that of sea water. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/24 "2011-11-22T00:56:11Z")
Here’s another [cite](http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/content/latest-questions/question/2379/) that says the same thing. _However_, the second site goes into more detail and points out a few things that cast a little doubt on my idea that their kidneys would be a problem, because whales just don’t take in that much sea water. I think my hypothesis still holds, but I’m not married to it. I wish I could find a cite about fresh water effects and possible Na deprivation, but I can’t seem to find one. ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/25 "2011-11-22T01:37:27Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > But again, I’m not a whale urologist. (Is that even a thing?) I’ve written to friend who’s a marine mammal physiologist. He may or may not come by to rescue us from this conversation. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/26 "2011-11-22T01:37:38Z")
> [@G0sp3l](#): > > What does god need with a bowl of petunias? …and why would they reply, “Oh! Not _again…!_” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/27 "2011-11-22T04:24:12Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > The great flood never happened, the earth is 4.5B years old… During those 4.5B years would there not have been a whole bunch of very significant floods? ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/28 "2011-11-22T05:02:26Z")
> [@Xema](#): > > During those 4.5B years would there not have been a whole bunch of very significant floods? That kinda gets me back to the problems with the OP. There are plenty of ways to make fun of creationists, but for God’s sake, don’t make up straw men. The article briefly referenced some vague “others” on “social media” that chalked up the non story to the great flood, and he took that as a license to just make crap up. He can’t point to a single person that said the whales were drowned or killed by rain. I don’t like creationists either, but, _damn_, straw men annoy me. Especially since if he thought about it for half a second he would realize that if the Great Flood actually happened, which it didn’t, it would beach a shit load of sea life. I hate idiocy, but I think I hate watching people arguing against idiocy with idiocy a little more. As to what actually happened, the whale skeletons are 2-7 million years old (not billion), but they were found less than a mile from the present coastline. I think it’s a safe bet that it was a region that whales tended to beach themselves and then the coastline moved out about a mile over a couple of millions of years. No plate tectonics are even necessary to explain that. (Plate tectonics are true, but this is only half a mile from the coastline, we don’t need 'em to explain it). And let’s not forget that the “slow news day” factor. ---
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/29 "2011-11-22T05:06:58Z")
But whales are air-breathers, and so in theory they **can** drown. However, in fact, I can’t imagine what conditions would cause them to drown. Even if the Deluge really did happen, could it have produced the necessary conditions by any stretch of the imagination? Some hyper-undertow? ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/30 "2011-11-22T05:27:30Z")
“Drowning” is irrelevant. Nobody said the whales “drowned” except the OP’s straw man. That’s kinda my problem here. ---
**Author:** ![Balance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Balance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balance)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/31 "2011-11-22T05:46:03Z")
> [@rowrrbazzle](#): > > But whales are air-breathers, and so in theory they **can** drown. However, in fact, I can’t imagine what conditions would cause them to drown. Even if the Deluge really did happen, could it have produced the necessary conditions by any stretch of the imagination? Some hyper-undertow? Well, consider just how much rain would have to be falling. In “forty days and forty nights”, it submerged _everything_. Even if we assume that “everything” only extends to peak of, say, Mount Ararat, leaving other pointy bits of rock like Everest quite exposed, that’s around 17000 feet of water. Spreading that out evenly gives us a rainfall rate of ~3.5 inches _per minute_ everywhere on the planet continuously over the entire period. You could probably drown just trying to breathe air with that much rain falling through it…and that’s without a giant nostril pointing straight up. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/32 "2011-11-22T05:50:42Z")
So if whales don’t drown, then somebody wanted to make it look like they drowned. I think what we have hear (take off sunglasses) is a killer, whale. Yeeeowww ---
**Author:** ![Lucretia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/13edae/32.png) [@Lucretia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucretia)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/33 "2011-11-22T06:00:03Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > So if whales don’t drown, then somebody wanted to make it look like they drowned. > > I think what we have hear (take off sunglasses) is a killer, whale. > > Yeeeowww Good luck narrowing down a suspect list…everyone knows whales are jerks. ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 9:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/34 "2011-11-22T09:55:19Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > That kinda gets me back to the problems with the OP. There are plenty of ways to make fun of creationists, but for God’s sake, don’t make up straw men. Actually, the presence of straw men could be strong evidence in favour of the biblical flood. They would float to the top, and could be deposited _anywhere_, which could explain why we keep coming across them. ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/35 "2011-11-22T13:47:27Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > That kinda gets me back to the problems with the OP. There are plenty of ways to make fun of creationists, but for God’s sake, don’t make up straw men. Thank you for the links above, but before you get too riled up and start throwing around terms like “straw men” please note that this is not Great Debates. I didn’t see this as a debate at all, and even if it becomes one, it’s not great by any stretch. I was a little glib in the OP, but what is the implication of this find that would lead anyone to claim that we should “accept the biblical account of the flood?” Again, I didn’t start this as a debate, so I don’t think the term straw man applies. I did say that the whales drowned, but I also said that blow hole umbrellas could have spared them their fate. Are you going to take me to task for the Joker’s Fallacy? I suspect you are trying to be ironic with your second sentence quoted above, but trying to make this into a formal debate where none was intended is a little pedantic, don’t you think? ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/36 "2011-11-22T15:33:46Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I think what we have hear (take off sunglasses) is a killer, whale. Well, according to [The Book of Fred 6:13](http://bit.ly/FRvSC)_…Look Out For the Killer Whale!!!_ ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/37 "2011-11-22T18:24:02Z")
> [@SiXSwordS](#): > > Thank you for the links above, but before you get too riled up and start throwing around terms like “straw men” please note that this is not Great Debates. You can’t make stuff up in _any_ forum, **SiXSwords**. MPSIMS is not a free pass. ---
**Author:** ![mac\_bolan00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b3f665/32.png) [@mac\_bolan00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mac_bolan00)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2011, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/38 "2011-11-23T01:50:03Z")
i bothered to read it. i will take in only three basic data from the report: 1. the remains (not fossils) were 1/2 miles from the sea shore 2. the site where the remains were found is presently desert 3. remains are 2-7 million years old. * * * they got beached, they were buried in loose sediments , the seas receded, the desert did a good job at preserving the remains. ---
**Author:** ![user\_hostile](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/user_hostile/32/474_2.png) [@user\_hostile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/user_hostile)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2011, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/39 "2011-11-23T04:24:26Z")
Having seen killer whales and dolphins perform in various marine parks, it seem to me that the tanks were fill with freshwater, not saltwater. YMMV. Per the OP’s link–puff piece with a brainless tie-in to the creationism. Yet another reason to hate the Yahoo home page for coming off with all the sincerity of a game show host. ---
**Author:** ![Filbert](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/filbert/32/3433_2.png) [@Filbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Filbert)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2011, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669/40 "2011-11-23T11:58:12Z")
> [@user\_hostile](#): > > Having seen killer whales and dolphins perform in various marine parks, it seem to me that the tanks were fill with freshwater, not saltwater. YMMV. I’ve only seen a few performing ones as a kid, ( there’s no captive cetaceans left in the UK I believe) but I did get close enough to get splashed, and it was definitely salt Thanks for the comments and suggestions so far! I’m not sure if there is a definite answer; I know whales occasionally go up rivers, but rivers are hardly the ideal habitat for animals that size; most of them appear to be ill or injured already, and often die shortly afterwards, probably from the injuries. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whales-drown-in-great-flood/603669.md?page=1)