I’ve never heard anyone claim that whalemeat is an aquired taste, tasted good the first time I tried.
Well, you might have eaten a different knd of whale than the Eskimos were eating.
This is not surprising, coming from someone who refers to themselves as DOGFOOD 
Guess I was wrong about the whales not being intelligent and capable of telepathic links to aliens. The overwhelming amount of links contrary to my earlier beliefs are evidence enough of their superiority. The search “telepathic link whales” turned up 550 pages. Heres a sample:
HIMALAYAN MASTERS LEARN NEW SONG
For several days after this linkage was established, I would check on how things were going when I mediated with the World Karma Crystal. My attunement afterwards was that both groups were very happy with the linkage and found it to be a mutually beneficial relationship similar to respected animal companions with a large caring family. Then since everything was going well, the immediacy of the linkage faded from my conscious mind. A little more than a week later, I was sitting in meditation with the World Karma Crystal when a cave yogi burst into my thoughts with an overwhelmingly joyful message. As the yogi explained to me how the whales had telepathically taught him a new song, I saw him standing outside his cave, singing with his arms outstretched to the surrounding Himalayan peaks. The resonance frequency of the planet is being upgraded exponentially as much as possible everyday and the whales are adjusting their songs accordingly and sharing their new repertoire of scared songs with the Tibetans.
Heres another one:
Not only do Cetacea represent a decided shift in Human intellect by accepting another sentient race on the planet, but with this new association, may also be considered to be emotional balancing and healing agents for the troubled hearts of mankind. Add to this the understanding that dolphins and whales represent a Spiritual manifestation on the physical plane, and it moves to establish an even higher consciousness connection for all to observe and become a participant.
Open up your minds and hearts to this new sensation and way of being. Feel the joy and peace of a Fifth Dimensional Awareness — Pod Mind Mentality. It awaits your acceptance and realization. We are no longer alone in this Universe. We are awakening to who we really are: Lightbeings connected to the Source of All That Is. The Cetacea have anticipated this moment for three thousand years, inviting us to rejoin them in this joyful recognition and new understanding of this liberated state of being. I’m grateful for such an opportunity and invite you to join me in celebrating.
Then there’s the alien - Whale connection. I didnt know about. Thats another chapter.
YourOldBuddy
The argument from the Norwegian government is that the population of minke whales is big enough that a limited hunting is sustainable. Norway plans to hunt 711 minke whales in 2003. That’s unabashed commercial hunting, not research.
Whaling isn’t an important part of Norwegian culture as a whole, but it helps the livelihood on the coast. (Take that site with some grains of salt - the statement “the meat … is a traditional part of the diet” is, um, exaggerated to put it mildly. These days, a ban on spaghetti hunting would be a much more serious blow against Norwegian diet 
)
My guess is that Norwegian whaling was resumed partly because it made a handy bait in fishing for votes. Briefly, the story is: Government party struggles in polls. Government is seen as spineless wimps who let Brussel dictate economic policy and Washington dictate foreign policy. Then government does something which is wildly unpopular abroad. Brave, stalwart government defends poor whalers against sentimental whale-cuddling foreigners. Common enemy makes Norwegians rally around the flag and print T-shirts with uplifting patriotic slogans like “Barbeque Willy”, “Big people need big food” and “Intelligent people need intelligent food”. Polls for government party improve - at least for a while.
Personally, I’m willing to believe that limited hunting doesn’t threaten the whale population (despite being sceptical when the conclusions of Norwegian scientists neatly support Norwegian interests, while scientists in other countries disagree), and I don’t see whales as that different from cows (except cows taste better), but I still think resuming whaling was a Bad Thing. If whaling really is that important economically, the coalition of the whaling should take the time to convince more of the scientific community, and even more importantly work on public opinion - make some documentary films about predator whales killing cute baby seals, perhaps arrange for an American celebrity to eat someone’s kitten
It sets a dangerous precedent when rogue nations set aside international agreements and ignore massive opposition in the global opinion, just because 1) Our experts know better than your experts and 2) It’s in our interest to do so, and we don’t care what you think. Next thing you know, someone might start a war based on that kind of reasoning.
Although I don’t endorse overfishing and suspect some conservation efforts (and use of a variety of fish stocks to a limited degree, rather than concentration on some at once) would be better, I don’t think the Japanese or Icelandic whaling will notably affect the world population, and possibly not the local population. I don’t believe they intend to take very many, and Minke are rather common.
Traditional doesn’t mean it’s eaten every day, but it has been eaten for a long time. And hey don’t eat smalahovud every day you know.
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The whole Brussel Washington thing hadn’t appeared yet. It was partly a way of getting votes by showing that they would support the whalers(and implied the fishermen) in spite of international outrage. But they didn’t get any voters from other parts of the country.
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If you think that the norwegian scietists are lying you should provide cites. Whaling is important only to a few people and they don’t have the resources to “work” on public opinion.
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It also sets a dangerous precedence when you listen to the global opinion who think that whales are special animals instead of scientists. Norway has the right to use its own resources in a responsible way.
I am not contesting that whales are an important part of the biosystem but:
Hmm…
Looking for the words, looking for the words…
Here we go:
The suggestion that any particular species of whale or that even whales as a whole play SUCH an important role in the ecosystem is absurd. You think they’re that important and that zooplankton would overtake the world? Just out of curiosity, ever hear of a little thing called dynamic equillibrium. Assuming that this statement is correct, wouldn’t this explosion of zooplakton make it insanely easy for the remaining 379,269 whales to survive? And have not whales shown amazing resiliency and ability to expand prolifically when hunting pressures decreased?
I just don’t get why whales are such a particularly difficult species to effectively and safely harvest in reasonable numbers without risking the viability of the species? I’ll grant that our oceans need significantly more protections from over-fishing, but things like cod, salmon, halibut, tuna, mackeral, whatever 98% of the world eats for sustinance be more inmportant than a few whales of which no one can credibly claim real risk too beyond emotional appeals to facts which have been largely disproven by this board.
Honestly, when I opened this thread, I expected the OP to go the other way.
Elliot
This vote working thing you guys, Dogfood and Hildea are talking about works both ways. Cheapshots at Norway, Iceland and japan for whaling are easy and cost-effective. Makes the politician in question look like he/she really cares about the environment without hitting any interests at home.
Not many ppl know that the main aim of many environmentalist organisations such as Greenpeace used to be on freeing Ceteans in captivity. Dolphins are quite often starved to death/submission in captivity, kept under bad conditions and there have been cases where caretakers insist the Dolphins have committed suicide (they are voluntary breathers apparently). This didnt sell because it hit too close to home and no one wanted to hear it. Greenpeace shut up about it and turned their gaze on Seals. Baby seals sold and Greenpeace was wildly successfull and effectively destroyed the self sufficient Inuit societies which depended on them. Now its time to bash some other “furrenners” namely Icelanders.
Much fewer ppl bash the US for its wild Dolphin killing (sideproducts of tuna fishing), the cemical shipments to Scottland, the arctic shipments to Asia or the whaling donne by its native American population (who are actually whaling endangered species at times).
Similar stories can be said about Germany, Italy and Holland where most of the anti whaling criticism comes from. Even England with its radiation spewing Sellafield and such joins the swarm. Hypocrisy at its best.
Iceland is probably THE most enviromentally sound western country in the world and still we get this pile of shit thrown at us. Just to name numbers we plant 50 trees per inhabitant per year, 80% of our energy is renewable (hydro, thermo) and we just opened the first hydrogen “gas” station in the world to the public.
I’m afraid I can’t speak for the flavour of whale meat, the Minke population, Norweigan culture, or many of these things. But I am still very interested in the discussion because it is a common one with reference to our natural resources.
The problem with debates like this is the uncertainty involved. It’s very hard to know things like “how many whales are needed for a healthy population,” or even “how many whales there are.” We wrecked 4the cod fishery (and many other fisheries, like the ones in the Great Lakes) because we thought we knew what we were doing and, as it turned out, we didn’t. I don’t have any cites for this handy, I learned it in undergrad a few years ago, I’m afraid, but if you’re really interested I can go home and pore through my books. But it’s meant as an illustrative example so the details aren’t too important.
We thought we knew how many fish there were, because we counted how many were caught and we extrapolated. We never realized that all the fish were concentrated in the area of our fishing boats (maybe because the fishing boats followed the fish?), and that we assumed they would be evenly distributed elsewhere.
We didn’t realize we were catching ever-younger fish so the population couldn’t sustain itself. We just thought they were smaller.
No one ever said “Hey, let’s fish the cod to extinction.” (And yes, I know they’re not extinct, but the population is not likely to recover)
And now it’s not just about cod any more :
from the BBC
Brutus: that’s exactly the problem with extinction. No one knows what the consequences will be, and if they’re bad it’s too damn late to do anything about it. I am uncomfortable believing Brutus’s Seafood Company when they tell me that there (probably) won’t be any bad consequences, because they have a vested interest in hunting and killing whales. Similarly, I won’t believe PETA either.
But I know that the ocean ecosystem has been doing fine with the numbers of whales it’s got (any problems it has probably come from another species I could name), so why go messing about with it on the chance that nothing bad will happen?
That being said, I am a rabid environmentalist and I honestly don’t think that taking 38 whales out of a known population of 43000 (provided that it is “known” and not arrived at with dubious methods) will play a large part in any planetary collapse. Just make damn sure that you always err on the side of caution and learn the lessons of history as re: fishery management.
Also agree with YOB (is that an insulting acronym?) about those glass house inhabitants pelting stones at other environmental offenders.
Barks’ dog food:
True, but by what authority does Norway (or any other nation) claim whales in the open ocean as their own resource? My understanding is that outside the 200 nmi economic zone, the ocean is not owned and not regulated by anyone.
I believe open-ocean resources would be much better managed if exclusive world-wide exploitation rights to specific species were assigned. (Assigned to nations, or companies, or international organizations: I don’t think it matters. These rights should be able to be bought, sold, and sub-licensed.) Thus, if owner X of minke whales overhunted and caused a population collapse, they have in effect reduced their own potential future wealth. If owner Y of cod managed the stocks sustainably, they could have reliable profits for a long, long time. If owner Z of bottlenose dolphins decides to forgo hunting them for ethical reasons, then so be it, they can.
YourOldBuddy:
This is not a good argument. Just because other people are doing bad things does not excuse your own bad habits.
Do you have any cite that says that whales are being hunted outside norwegian economic zone? Acording to the norwegian goverment we only hunt in our waters.
Wasnt my argument at all. I wasnt conceding that hunting whales is bad even though you make it look like I did. My argument was that the anti whaling movement isnt motivated by environmentalism at all. Most anti whale activists are just misinformed. Other such as the politicians and environmentalist organisations are motivated by vote grabbing and money leeching respectively.
As indirect proof I point at all the things that should mean a lot more to environmentalists in their respective countries but are ignored. Two of the worlds largest CO2 polluters in the world are also the most adamant against whaling. Pulling blinders?
I’m not sure I buy that anti-whaling activists are ``just misinformed’’. If they believe that whales are in a special class of animal that should not be hunted and consumed, at all, it is hard for me to see where information is involved. That is a different value system, plain and simple.
Although I suppose if they are arguing that the hunt is not sustainable, and in fact it is, then maybe there is some scope for information and being misinformed. In real life, there is probably some uncertainity about the numbers, but perhaps an objective view would consider a limited hunt to be sustainable.
But my suspicion is that deep down inside, the numbers of whales are irrelevant, and the controversy over whaling rests purely on value differences.
Actually, until the mid-70’s or so, whale meat was standard fare in school lunches in Japan, since it was so much cheaper than beef. I know a lot of people around my age (early 30’s) who ate it on a regular basis and remember what it tasted like. Most of them say it was pretty good.
The price has gone way up since the bans have gone into effect, and a dinner of whale meat now runs into the $50 range. There’s a restaurant that specializes in it not too far from my house, so I may give it a try sometime.
Viking.
I would argue that the misinformation often comes from thinking that Whales are somehow different from other animals. One poster in this thread even argued that whales could be considered superior or more intelligent than humans. That is not so.
You might be right in thinking that some ppl think of whales as different and superior because of some traits they posses. I think the overwhelming majority of ppl who think they are they are special are just misinformed about their intelligence, their "peacefullness, character, link to extraterrestrials/Tibetan monks… etc.
Apparently Norway does only hunt whales in its own waters. Cite: Norwegian whaling. I would agree that Norway’s whaling is primarily its own business. I haven’t been able to find any cites for where Iceland is whaling, although since their catch is so small, they should have no need to leave their own waters.
Pleonast said:
YourOldBuddy replied:
Let me rephrase slightly: The fact that other people do bad things does not mean that their criticism of you is incorrect.
I’m not disagreeing with your characterization of the anti-whaling movement (I don’t know enough to make a judgment either way). But even if they are hypocritical, you cannot invalidate their arguments by that fact. I’m only pointing out that this particular argument against the anti-whaling complaints is not valid.
Point taken.
I think that Iceland is doing “scientific” whaling because it allows it to catch a modest number of whales without entirely thumbing its nose at the international whaling commission, and as such take less crap from the international community and environmentalists then does Norway for its commercial whaling.
I think the moon is made out of green cheese.
- Rune