# What 1951-2000 U.S. Literature will endure? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 12, 2003, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406 "2003-06-12T18:45:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/1 "2003-06-12T18:45:30Z")
Meaning - NOT your personal favorites, per se, but the ones that high school kids will have to read in 200 years (actually, if humanity is still around in 200 years, books will probably be scanned or implanted or something, but that is another story…) Anyway - another way of asking the question might be: What U.S. Lit will have crossed over into the public consciousness? In the 1800’s, your average American will probably at least have _heard of_, if not read: Moby Dick (or The Whale) The Scarlet Letter The Red Badge of Courage Huck Finn, Tom Sawyer and maybe Prince and the Pauper or CT Yankee Little Women Poe’s short stories (Cask of Amontillado, Tell-tale Heart, etc…) but not much more. Sure, any reasonable _reading_ person will know about many more, but these few books are the ones that have “crossed over” and represent U.S. fiction for the 1900’s. (NOTE: I am sure I missed one or two obvious ones, but you get the point). So for the period of 1951 - 2000 - what has or will cross over and be required reading 200 years from now? The obvious ones to me are: Catcher in the Rye To Kill a Mockingbird Catch-22 The next ones are maybes: Portnoy’s Complaint Song of Solomon On the Road The Invisible Man (Ellison, not H.G. Wells, thank you!) World According to Garp Slaughterhouse-5 The Shining (don’t laugh, I’m serious!) A Separate Peace The Fountainhead (don’t laugh, I’m serious!) Cuckoo’s Nest Notice there is no Pynchon, Bellow, Updike, Mailer or a bunch of other highly respected and famous works and authors. I just don’t see those works “crossing over” - anybody with the least interest would learn about them super-quick, but I am talking about books that come to represent the 2nd half of the 20th century and are students are expected to read and know - notice by including the Fountainhead, which I think is poorly written, I am trying to acknowledge its persistent (cult?) status. And by including the Shining, I am acknowledging the sheer magnitude of popularity Stephen King has experienced, the fact that he has been gaining respect (e.g., regularly appears in the New Yorker now) and am willing to bet that some later academics will hold him up as an author that is to be studied… What are your thoughts - what are the top 3 core books? What are the next tier of books that could make it but you aren’t as sure? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/2 "2003-06-12T18:51:24Z")
**Lord of the Rings** I’m hard pressed to come up with anything else that will definately be remembered 200 years from now. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/3 "2003-06-12T19:07:45Z")
I hear ya, **Mahaloth** - but [nitpick] LOTR is British; I am looking for American. [/nitpick] That being said, I notice I didn’t include any sci-fi/fantasy… Foundation Trilogy? Stranger in a Strange Land? Dune? Neuromancer? Maybe Neuromancer, simply because it coined the phrase _cyberspace_. But while Dune is my fave sci-fi book, it is not in the same realm of public consciousness as Catcher or Mockingbird. Nor is Stranger or the Foundation Trilogy…I don’t know… ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/4 "2003-06-12T19:09:41Z")
The problem with this question is that most of the titles you list from the 1800s were not the books that most people thought most highly of then. Twain was enormously popular, but Huck Finn and Tom Sawyer weren’t thought of as more than children’s literature. Moby Dick had a cautiously positive response on its first introduction but a backlash soon appeared and it was savaged by the intellectuals. Poe legendarily had a greater reputation in France than in the U.S. And it’s just too soon to know which of the current crop of authors will make it big. After all, your own list doesn’t contain a single book written after 1982. **Mahaloth** , the OP was on U.S. lit. And what an embarrassment for our whole culture if LotR is remembered as the defining literature of our times. ---
**Author:** ![ElwoodCuse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/edb3f5/32.png) [@ElwoodCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElwoodCuse)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/5 "2003-06-12T19:12:45Z")
I vote for Hunter Thompson’s **Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas** or **Fear and Loathing: On The Campaign Trail 1972**. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/6 "2003-06-12T19:49:15Z")
Good call on Cuckoo’s Nest. And The Shining was to be my nomination. How about Watership Down? ---
**Author:** ![mobo85](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mobo85](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mobo85)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/7 "2003-06-12T19:55:28Z")
I know the OP didn’t mention kiddie lit, but I think Dr. Seuss will be remembered as one of the greats, almost the Lewis Carroll of his time. ---
**Author:** ![toadspittle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@toadspittle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toadspittle)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/8 "2003-06-12T20:08:24Z")
Ditto Seuss. I think Updike is already in there a bit–I was required to read his short story _A & P_ many times during my academic career. I can’t believe any sci-fi will make it, despite my love of the genre. No Asimov, Gibson, Heinlein, or Herbert. But judging by past “classics” (usu. popular dime novels of their day–like the Leatherstocking Tales), our grandkids can expect to read a lot of Grisham and Clancy. Bleck. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/9 "2003-06-12T20:15:11Z")
Oh poop. I just realized why I can’t say Watership Down. Don’t mind me… ---
**Author:** ![Antiquarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Antiquarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antiquarian)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/10 "2003-06-12T20:18:14Z")
I’ll second Dr.Seuss. Add. Celestine Prophecy Illusions. Adventures of a Reluctant Messiah Robert Frost Ernest Hemingway Scarlet Letter Catcher in the Rye Brave New World Animal House 1984 Outside American Literature as I do not think Literature must have a nationality even in the future. The Tibetan Book of the Dead Lord of the Rings Kalevala ---
**Author:** ![sickboy51](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@sickboy51](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sickboy51)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/11 "2003-06-12T20:20:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mahaloth \* > \*\ ***Lord of the Rings** > > I’m hard pressed to come up with anything else that will definately be remembered 200 years from now. \*\* I thought Tolkien was born in South Africa and then moved to UK (or was it viceversa?). Fight Club? On the Road? The Naked Lunch? Dunno, it´s hard to say. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/12 "2003-06-12T20:49:03Z")
I was going to say “The Great Gatsby,” but realized I was in the wrong half century. The Old Man and the Sea Good call on Frost, **Antiquarian** , but most of his best stuff is pre-1950, I believe. ---
**Author:** ![Antiquarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Antiquarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antiquarian)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/13 "2003-06-12T21:35:22Z")
I don’t want to hijack anyones post but why don’t we look at literature as a whole from the 20th century, instead of the parameters we have now. I can’t think of a reason Lit would be geocentric in 200 years. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/14 "2003-06-12T22:56:48Z")
_Atlas Shrugged_. _The Fountainhead_ was published in 1943. ---
**Author:** ![Booker57](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Booker57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Booker57)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/15 "2003-06-12T23:02:15Z")
If Literature can include a magazine, I vote for Playboy. Yes I read it. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/16 "2003-06-12T23:10:31Z")
[QUOTE] \*Originally posted by Antiquarian \* Celestine Prophecy \ 1984 [QUOTE] I do hope you’re not serious about that craptacular piece of shit, Celestine Prophecy? You might as well include Alchemist, Men are from Mars, Women from Venus, Real Men don’t eat quiche and Max Headroom’s Guide for life. Also, Orwell was born in Bengal, India, and a British national, so he should not be included. My take on such a list: It should include great literature and/or books that will tell people 200 years from now something about our society. I choose to exclude books written during these years, dealing with events outside these years. Tom Wolfe / The Bonfire of Vanities Don De Lillo / Underworld Norman Mailer / The executioner’s song (Or Harlot’s Ghost) Bret Easton Ellis / American Psycho J.D. Salinger / Catcher in the Rye Erica Jong / Fear of Flying James Ellroy / American Tabloid & The Cold Six Thousand There are more of course, these just off the top of my head. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f8ce5/32.png) [@The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Peyote_Coyote)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/17 "2003-06-12T23:14:37Z")
East of Eden & The Winter of our Discontent by John Steinbeck Invisible Man by Ralph Ellison The Long Goodbye by Raymond Chandler The Illustrated Man, The Martian Chronicles, and possibly others by Ray Bradbury The Crucible by Arthur Miller Possibilities: The Moon is a Harsh Mistress (SF will continue to be read if the story is good and the characters are believeable) by Heinlein Some of Sharyn McCrumb’s ballad novels, especially She Walks These Hills and The Rosewood Casket. Some of Updike’s work The poetry of Nikki Giovanni and Gwendolyn Brooks World Literature: One Hundred Years of Solitude by Marquez Jorge Luis Borges’ work the poetry of Seamus Haney (hope spelling is right) some of the mystery novels of P.D. James. To enlarge upon a statement of Chandler’s in The Simple Art of Murder, the reasons why we read mysteries ain’t going out of style any time soon. ---
**Author:** ![Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laughing_Lagomorph)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2003, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/18 "2003-06-12T23:18:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Antiquarian \* > \*\*I’ll second Dr.Seuss. > … > Animal House > … \*\* Yeah, the book was good but the movie is the definitive version. 😃 BTW Aldous Huxley, author of _Brave New World_, was a Brit. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2003, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/19 "2003-06-13T05:21:32Z")
I think _The Right Stuff_ by Tom Wolfe, because it’s a great book, but more importantly because it chronicles the beginning of the space age, and as we go into the future I think the dawn of space will be increasingly seen as almost mythic in nature. How about _The Princess Bride_? I know it seems a longshot, but I swear that movie is getting more popular with each successive generation. Most of my generation never read the book, and the movie only did mediocre business. But _everyone_ I know watches it regularly on DVD, and their kids universally love it. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2003, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406/20 "2003-06-13T05:22:37Z")
_The Princess Bride_? Interesting. But I doubt anything more than a tiny fraction of the movie’s viewers has read the book. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-1951-2000-u-s-literature-will-endure/181406.md?page=2)