We recently had an interesting discussion about this on a (dog) breed-related listserv I am on. One of the vets on it said that if the euthanasia solution goes outside the vein, it burns and thus causes pain. So, on smaller animals, she often sets an IV catheter into the vein first and then injects the euthanasia solution. For animals that are very frightened or may struggle, tranquilization prior to the euthanasia is also a choice.
I was glad to know this because it will help me make the best choices I can with my own pets.
And isn’t it remarkable that with all the amazing technology we have these days, you still have to cut off an animal’s head to determine if it had rabies or not? Good grief.
CrazyCatLady, do you know of a source where one can read about the rabies laws/rules in the state of NC? Our vet is recommending against giving our old dog another rabies shot and titering him instead, and I’d like to know what the legal implications of it are should he exposed to a rabid animal or bite someone. It’s a long shot that will happen, but I’d hate for him to end up in quarantine somewhere if it did. It’d probably kill him.
"No, really, this post contains stuff that is most definitely not for the squeamish. The very fact that it even occurred to me to put a TMI label on it means quite a bit. I mean, I’m the sort of person who thinks nothing of describing what we took out a dog in great detail at the table (there’s a reason no one ever invites us to have dinner), and have been known to talk about picking maggots out of something while eating rice. When I say it’s TMI, I’m not joking.
If you keep reading and get grossed out, it’s your own damn fault. I tried to warn you."
If you don’t see TMI coming in a TMI thread, or if you are actually eating while reading a TMI thread, you deserve whatever fate befalls you;)
FTR these things rarely, if ever, gross me out. I’d actually love to take a look at the dog in the OP. Then again, I watch surgery for fun.
At my old clinic, my favorite vet always set up an IV into the vein first. She gave the animal some valium/ketamine as a tranquilizer to ease the pain, and then injected the euthanasia solution. Well, except when she put down my mouse. (Cat got to her, broke her back.)
Actually, Avarie, I did know that. Most organs are sticky, really. I also worked with a lady who fished a lot, and for a while she saved all the ovaries, uteri, and testicles in the freezer for catfish bait. Apparently, catfish are real fond of dog testicles. It was great when the boss’s wife came in one afternoon and was in the freezer for something. “What’s in this baggie?” “Testicles Susan’s gonna use for bait.” “Oh, that’s nice.”
We standardly put in catheters if the owner’s going to be present, just to be extra sure everything goes smoothly. Otherwise, we don’t. The place I used to work for never did cathers for euths, and I never once saw a vein blow. Most animals who are sick enough to be euthanized are usually too sick to struggle, and once the first little jot of solution is in, the animal’s too sedate to struggle. For a cather, they have to be restrained through the whole taping process, and that’s often more stressful than a direct injection.
I don’t really find it so remarkable that we still have to cut the head off to test for rabies. The only definitive test is microscopic examination of the tissues the virus affects–the brain and spinal cord. Specifically, they need the entire brain stem. And there’s just no way to get the intact brainstem out without cutting off the head. I wish there was a better way, though. Hacksawing through a spine is a real pain in the ass.
AFAIK, having strong titres is considered as good as having a vaccine, but I’m not sure. We’ll have to look into that.
So someone was keeping the lynx as a pet? Are there laws about this sort of thing?
I went to an animal rehab place once, where they keep exotic animals that are no longer wanted. A number of tigers, a bear that had had its teeth pulled out (for “safety” we would have to assume, the poor thing looked very unhappy), owls, wolves, ostriches, that sort of thing.
The cruelty involved in trying to keep a wild animal as a pet is shocking and disgusting. I can’t believe people do it.
And, if there are laws against this sort of thing, isn’t it a bit cheeky to bring your lynx into a clinic?
About the coffin-when my cat Fluffy died, my father, who is a mortician, brought home a small sample coffin he had, about the size of a toolbox (which we actually ended up using, at this thing was too small for her).
However, he didn’t have to pay for it, and such, so I guess it’s different.
The subject came up because someone had had their dog euthanized and it screamed the whole time. Which, as you might imagine, was horrifying for the owner. The explanation was that the vein was probably missed (and in a large, short-coated dog too - don’t know how it happened unless the veins had collapsed, the dog was struggling or the operator was an idiot). No one wants to go through that so the subject of options came up. I wish I’d known about them earlier. I think the first dog I had to have euthanized probably would have benefited from it, as the vet had some trouble with his vein (we found out later he wasn’t such a great vet as we’d been told). Things would have gone smoother and faster for the poor old guy, and the one time you want things to go right is that time.
Hey, I’m new here, apparently misunderstand how to use the quote function. Text I blocked didn’t come up in the quote. My apologies to all.
Just have to say, to honorable CrazyCatLady, to whom my hat is off in regard to her general sanity, practical charity, and chosen field:
Uh, what was TMI about that?
For general information, you don’t have to cut the head off to get to the brain and spinal cord. I do it about once a month. Just make the usual circular skull incision, divide the brainstem at the bottom of the medulla, remove the brain. Replace the calvarium. Open the back of the neck (skin, muscle). Open the posterior arches of the vertebral column, unroof the spinal cord, cut the nerve roots, and take it out. Close the scalp and the skin.
Of course, I have access to a Stryker saw, which is so much easier than a hacksaw. Get into mechanized instruments, and watch your work effort decrease.
I was confused about quoting for a while too. You have to click on the “reply w/quote” button at the bottom right corner of the post. You’ll then get a new posting window with the whole message in quotes. Snip away! (But I try to indicate if I’ve snipped something, or bolded it - I think that’s common practice.) Or, use the command "[ quote ] blah blah blah [/ quote ] " (without the spaces, of course) if it’s a short quote. And Preview Is Your Friend!
Well in most mammals, the abcess is just a thin layer of skin stretched around a pocket of pus, like a rather icky water balloon. You pop the balloon, provide for drainage if necessary, and it’s all over. In rabbits, though, there’s apparently a lot more tissue involved. They fibrose, or something. The doc told me last night, but I was trying to do five other things and wasn’t paying close attention to the details. The upshot of it is that there’s no balloon to pop; the tissue and pus is all mixed together, and you have to take the whole thing out to get rid of the nastiness.
Sultana, you have to keep in mind that most people are not in the medical or veterinary fields, and have a much, much lower TMI threshold than you and I. They don’t want to hear about pus, or blood, or bits of tissue flying about, and they sure as hell don’t want to hear about decapitating a dead dog so you can cut its skull open and remove its brain.
As for using a Stryker saw, we’ve got one. We use it for a lot of things, and as such we aren’t about to risk contaminating it with rabies. And there’s not much point in getting one just for rabies suspects when we only send off six or seven samples a year. There’s not much point in routinely going to all the effort of removing the brain. It’s much cleaner, faster, and more efficient than dissecting the skull, and has a much lower risk of contaminating our equipment, facility, or personnel.
Cowgirl, apparently all types of big cat and big cat hybrids are legal for sale and ownership in North Carolina. You can’t have a pet deer, or tame a wild rabbit, but you can have a lynx. Don’t ask me why, I have absolutely no idea. I just know what the guy with the wildlife rehab license told me.
Trust me, we tried every tactic we could think of to divert the lynx to another emergency clinic since we really don’t know much about how hybrids are medically different from domestic cats. The kitten badly needed to be seen, though; if they’d waited any later to get help it would have certainly died. And it wasn’t any trouble last night, really. It’s just disturbing to have a 3 month kitten the size of my adult cats.
hee hee…Ichabod Frankendog…I have found the name for my next puppy. Thanks, Eats_Crayons.
CCL, how do these people FIND these wild animals that they seem to want so badly? I mean, do they go out hunting and try to separate them from the mother? (seriously dangerous!) Is there some online site, like: “Illegal wild animals for sale here?”
I just don’t understand. There are SO many reasons not to do this. I have to question the sanity…never mind. I just answered my own question, didn’t I?
Sounds like in every way a human E.R. I once worked with an intern NOONE liked. It had been a bad night. 8 codes, 3 didn’t make it. A friend laid down on a gurney, pulled a sheet over himself and waited. When said offending intern walked by, I said “Dr, the morgue hasn’t come for this guy yet.” Garcia let his hand drop. Intern reached to put hand back under sheet. Garcia grabbed hand of intern. Brown stain on floor. Worth the chewing out we got.