# What acoustic guitar should I buy as a learner? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 19, 2016, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750 "2016-06-19T02:34:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![tim-n-va](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim-n-va/32/3001_2.png) [@tim-n-va](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim-n-va)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/21 "2016-06-20T15:12:07Z")
It might be tempting to go cheap until you know this is going to be a long term hobby. However, you want to get enough quality that the instrument won’t be the issue with your learning to play. Mostly that is decent tuners so it doesn’t slip out of tune. For that reason, the “take a friend” advice is really good. Guitars are generally made of wood by humans - both of those introduce the possibility of quality variation. caveat: applying experiences with other stringed instruments to the OP’s question. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/22 "2016-06-20T16:03:28Z")
> [@Gary\_T](#): > > I agree with this in principle but I’d suggest different price ranges. > > I think you’d generally be okay looking at the 200-300 range, especially for a decent used guitar. For new instruments, I think there are some good starter guitars that sell for around 300, but once you get down to the 200 area I question how good they would be. > > Note that every guitar store I’ve been to sells new ones for less than list price, off the top of my head I’d say in the neighborhood of 20% off. > > ETA: In other words, that new guitar you can get for 300 probably lists for 350-400. > > ETA part 2: If you buy a decent used guitar and end up not wanting to keep it, you can likely sell it for most of what it cost you. Guess it shows how long it has been since I have shopped for a new acoustic. Damn you Inflation! ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/23 "2016-06-20T18:58:48Z")
> [@tim-n-va](#): > > It might be tempting to go cheap until you know this is going to be a long term hobby. However, you want to get enough quality that the instrument won’t be the issue with your learning to play. Mostly that is decent tuners so it doesn’t slip out of tune. I dunno about the tuners specifically. Even the nice ones are sitting out there, sticking off the end of the headstock, just asking to be whacked against something. I’ve [broken/bent/made otherwise unusable] very nice, heavy duty bass guitar tuners. Replacing tuners is just part of the game, to me. Now, that bridge is a whole 'nother ball of wax, especially on an acoustic. Cheap acoustics often have terrible plastic for the saddle and nut, and they crack and wear accordingly. Additionally, the tops are often inadequately reinforced under the bridge, causing your flattop to morph into a terrible archtop; and/or, the bridge doesn’t have enough glue area to keep from separating from the body. I have had expensive (more than $500, less than $1K, in the eighties) acoustics that had the problem of slowly morphing into an archtop. Since that’s the case, I feel price isn’t really a clear indicator of how durable that instrument may be. That’s the main reason I advise buying used guitars, if you can. If they’ve got those kind of wear issues, it’s probably going to be easier to spot with a used guitar. Now, if your guitar develops these (or neck) problems after you buy it, they can all be fixed by a competent repairman or luthier. But, it can run more than the cost of a replacement. > [@tim-n-va](#): > > For that reason, the “take a friend” advice is really good. Guitars are generally made of wood by humans - both of those introduce the possibility of quality variation. > > caveat: applying experiences with other stringed instruments to the OP’s question. I’ll echo the “bring a friend” recommendation, too. If you don’t have any friends that play guitar, try to hire a teacher to go to the store with you. However, if a guitar speaks to you, try to have the wisdom to know when to ignore their advice. Finally, I don’t really want to make you focus on a brand, but I’ve had great fortune with buying used Yamahas for a song, getting them playable with minor repair work, and giving them as gifts. If the store you’re in has one, try it out. ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/24 "2016-06-20T19:07:29Z")
I’ll second the Taylor GS Mini, or the Seagull. I have both and they are wonderful guitars for the money. I’ll also reiterate what has been said here; go to a good guitar shop and try a bunch out. You’ll find out pretty quickly what appeals to you and what doesn’t. If you can find a good second hand shop all the better. ---
**Author:** ![scoots](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b77776/32.png) [@scoots](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scoots)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/25 "2016-06-20T21:44:30Z")
OK, thanks for all the advice so far. Very helpful. I’ll go and have another look in the music shop when I next get a chance armed with a bit more knowledge. Looks like it has to be steel strings. The idea is to play along to folky rock tunes (say Dylan or acoustic Led Zep like Tangerine or That’s the Way) but also songs that use acoustic chords (eg Lola). Those songs are just examples of a type - there could be modern stuff too but can’t think of them right now. I love listening to classical guitar but I think that’s way above my level to actually play (or any level I’m likely to be for some time). I’m just wondering about the size. I’m an average size male (5’ 10") so presumably I can physically hold a full size guitar. And with a bigger sound box, does that mean a better, richer sound? ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/26 "2016-06-20T21:59:36Z")
A bigger sound box does mean a fuller sound. But many big stars play parlour or grand orchestra thickness guitars live and on record. Since you’re starting out you might want to just get the best value guitar you can and live with it for awhile. You’ll be at a great advantage if you want to really like your **second** guitar. For me I need to hear the full body guitar for general use, but I don’t own lots of axes. I’d love to have a thin martin too. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/27 "2016-06-20T22:13:26Z")
> [@scoots](#): > > OK, thanks for all the advice so far. Very helpful. I’ll go and have another look in the music shop when I next get a chance armed with a bit more knowledge. Looks like it has to be steel strings. The idea is to play along to folky rock tunes (say Dylan or acoustic Led Zep like Tangerine or That’s the Way) but also songs that use acoustic chords (eg Lola). Those songs are just examples of a type - there could be modern stuff too but can’t think of them right now. > > I love listening to classical guitar but I think that’s way above my level to actually play (or any level I’m likely to be for some time). > > I’m just wondering about the size. I’m an average size male (5’ 10") so presumably I can physically hold a full size guitar. And with a bigger sound box, does that mean a better, richer sound? A bigger box means you move more air. Doesn’t mean the air moved sounds better. A used Yamaha, or checking out a GS Mini sounds like great first steps in your research. Good luck! ---
**Author:** ![sleestak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@sleestak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleestak)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/28 "2016-06-20T22:44:03Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > Definitely metal strings. They just sound better. But that shouldn’t matter, because any quality guitar you buy should be able to handle either. This is false. Steel strings on a nylon string guitar will likely snap the neck, unless the guitar has a truss rod and most nylon strings do not have truss rods. Also, the top of the guitar is not designed for that much pressure and you can rip the body apart. If you have a nylon string guitar, use only nylon strings. Also, putting nylon strings on a steel string guitar isn’t going to work well. Slee ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/29 "2016-06-20T23:11:33Z")
Ah, I missed that post. Nice catch, **sleestak**. What he said. ---
**Author:** ![Taylorscar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3da27b/32.png) [@Taylorscar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Taylorscar)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/30 "2016-06-20T23:20:06Z")
If you want to buy a guitar at a cheap price then go for amazon and before buying a guitar you should take a guitar expert with you. ---
**Author:** ![minor7flat5](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/minor7flat5/32/258_2.png) [@minor7flat5](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minor7flat5)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/31 "2016-06-21T00:08:19Z")
> [@sleestak](#): > > This is false. Steel strings on a nylon string guitar will likely snap the neck, unless the guitar has a truss rod and most nylon strings do not have truss rods. Also, the top of the guitar is not designed for that much pressure and you can rip the body apart. > > If you have a nylon string guitar, use only nylon strings. > > Also, putting nylon strings on a steel string guitar isn’t going to work well. > > Slee Some numbers: A nylon string guitar has around 70-90 pounds of force pulling at the bridge and neck. A steel string guitar can have up to around 200 pounds of force pulling at the bridge. It’s not even close–this is a pretty huge difference, hence the advice above. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/32 "2016-06-21T14:58:19Z")
In any line of guitars made in the same factory by the same craftsmen, the larger body guitar will sound out fuller and louder. However, with different makes of guitar, it’s a matter of your own ears. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/33 "2016-06-21T15:15:49Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > In any line of guitars made in the same factory by the same craftsmen, the larger body guitar will sound out fuller and louder. > > However, with different makes of guitar, it’s a matter of your own ears. Simply not true. Depends on design, heaviness/lightness of build quality, etc. - Gibson J-200’s are Jumbos and nicknamed the Whispering Giant because many are simply not that loud. - Martin 00’s, a small-body, are known for being as loud as dreadnaughts and able to cut through the mix in ways that larger guitars can’t because the 00’s have a more balanced tone. At this point, for the OP, this is not an important issue - bigger and louder should not be important criteria. You should focus on a guitar that feels good in your hands and plays, sounds and looks like something that excites you and makes you want to play. If you think a bigger guitar is cooler for you, great! But something like a GS-Mini is smaller by design and holds up just fine vs. bigger guitars. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/34 "2016-06-21T17:27:07Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > Simply not true. Depends on design, heaviness/lightness of build quality, etc. > > - Gibson J-200’s are Jumbos and nicknamed the Whispering Giant because many are simply not that loud. > > - Martin 00’s, a small-body, are known for being as loud as dreadnaughts and able to cut through the mix in ways that larger guitars can’t because the 00’s have a more balanced tone. > > At this point, for the OP, this is not an important issue - bigger and louder should not be important criteria. You should focus on a guitar that feels good in your hands and plays, sounds and looks like something that excites you and makes you want to play. If you think a bigger guitar is cooler for you, great! But something like a GS-Mini is smaller by design and holds up just fine vs. bigger guitars. Since the OP asked about it I urge the OP to try it out for themselves and see. “Fullness” and “loudness” and “cutting through the mix” might be distinct, separate things, sonically, and might not make sense to a beginner. If you think you might be playing for a while my advice is to get a reasonable piece, make your mistakes and find out your preferences, and shoot for a keeper on the second guitar. ---
**Author:** ![ReticulatingSplines](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e274bd/32.png) [@ReticulatingSplines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ReticulatingSplines)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/35 "2016-06-21T18:29:13Z")
> [@scoots](#): > > - how much detail should I go into? Should I quiz a seller about the tree the wood for the guitar came from? The actual tree? The seller won’t know that. I can’t think of more than a few guitars for which the wood can be traced to a particular tree. If you mean the species, the top will mostly likely be Sitka Spruce. The back can be pretty much anything. Different woods have different tonal characteristics, but you won’t need to worry about that for a while. That said, if possible within your price range, you should look for a solid-wood topped instrument. Cheaper ones use laminate-wood tops, which IMO don’t sound as good. Solid wood backs and sides are a little less important. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/36 "2016-06-21T19:10:30Z")
> [@ReticulatingSplines](#): > > The actual tree? The seller won’t know that. I can’t think of more than a few guitars for which the wood can be traced to a particular tree. If you mean the species, the top will mostly likely be Sitka Spruce. The back can be pretty much anything. Different woods have different tonal characteristics, but you won’t need to worry about that for a while. > > That said, if possible within your price range, you should look for a solid-wood topped instrument. Cheaper ones use laminate-wood tops, which IMO don’t sound as good. Solid wood backs and sides are a little less important. Yep - what he/she said. A solid top is something you should target. For your needs a Yamaha or GS-Mini with laminated back and sides are just fine. Folks geek out about tonewoods, but you really, really (no, really) need not worry about that at this point, if ever. Besides a solid top, what you _should_ care about is whether the guitar you are considering is set up properly. Is the neck not warped and set up correctly? Is the action (distance from fingerboard to strings) good for clean chords and picking? Is it capable of holding a tune - i.e., do the strings have proper intonation, and are the tuners in decent shape? If you buy new or used at a shop, they should be able to assure you it is set up properly and be willing to adjust anything for free for a month or two after that. This is why having a Guitar Friend™ with you can be helpful; they can check out the basic set up of the guitar. If you don’t buy from a shop, assume you will invest another $50 - $75 for a setup and get it done yesterday. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/37 "2016-06-21T19:42:16Z")
Spend time in the “humidor room” at your guitar store. Use whatever chords you know and play Martins Gibsons guilds and others to see how good ones sound and how they feel, so you have a better idea of what would be acceptable as an intro axe. ---
**Author:** ![sleestak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@sleestak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleestak)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/38 "2016-06-21T21:59:34Z")
> [@minor7flat5](#): > > Some numbers: A nylon string guitar has around 70-90 pounds of force pulling at the bridge and neck. A steel string guitar can have up to around 200 pounds of force pulling at the bridge. > It’s not even close–this is a pretty huge difference, hence the advice above. When I read the steel string on nylon guitar bit, I pictured in my head someone dropping a mini black hole into the sound hole and the guitar slowly eating itself from the inside. Though I suspect it would happen a lot faster. My advice on beginning guitar. If you get lessons, ask your teacher to help you find a guitar. The teacher has good motivation to get you a good guitar, if you have a shitty guitar you will likely quit. And then the guitar teacher will have to go back to McDonalds\*. Learning guitar has a fairly steep curve. You are going to make noise for a bit. It isn’t like piano where you hit a key and it plays a nice note. It takes a bit to just be able to fret a note cleanly. Then it takes a bit to grab one chord cleanly. Then it takes a bit to change between chords cleanly. My advice to anyone wanting to learn is to a)get lessons and b) break your practice into two parts (or three, once you get a little better). The first part should be basic scales/chord work. Learning how to hold the chords or play a scale cleanly. Once you can change chords or play a scale reasonably well, get a metronome and practice to the metronome starting really slow. Do this for roughly the first half of your practice time. The second half, make noise. Guitar is supposed to be fun, take what you learned and have fun with it without worrying about how it sounds. Like The Who? Grab a g chord and go all Pete Townsend on the guitar (well, maybe not the smashy part). The third part, once you get a little better, is to jam. Make up stuff. Slee \*Joking. Kinda. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/39 "2016-06-21T23:25:03Z")
> [@Ranger\_Jeff](#): > > Oh, avoid any Ovation guitars (Ovation, Applause, Adamas). New, the Ovations and Adamas will be out of your price range, but used, there may be some deals on Applause and Ovations. Avoid them. It’s the round back. If you play one sitting, it’s going to start slipping and instead of the sound hole facing forward, it’s going to start facing up. That in itself may not be a serious issue, but it’s also going to change the angle of the fretboard and you’re going to have to adjust your grip for chording. And that’s no way for a beginner to create his muscle memory with his chording hand. I had an Applause 12-string and, while it does have a rounded back, I never had any trouble keeping it in one place. Just get used to putting your leg between the two ‘valleys.’ ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750/40 "2016-06-21T23:26:26Z")
> [@sleestak](#): > > This is false. Steel strings on a nylon string guitar will likely snap the neck, unless the guitar has a truss rod and most nylon strings do not have truss rods. Also, the top of the guitar is not designed for that much pressure and you can rip the body apart. > > If you have a nylon string guitar, use only nylon strings. > > Also, putting nylon strings on a steel string guitar isn’t going to work well. > > Slee Nylon guitars are $39 specials. I said quality. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-acoustic-guitar-should-i-buy-as-a-learner/757750.md?page=3)