Omniscient, you’re correct about the OP. My error, I was caught up in the swirl of the variety of assumptions (other than the ones accounted for in OP) by subsequent posters.
But I still say one needs to limit geography (brown tree snakes in Guam as opposed to native range); and time frame, too: komodo dragons had predators (a larger varanid) - they just happen to be extinct now.
Pigeons are predated upon by falcons and hawks, and as these raptors expand into the cities… So the time frame works both directions. Although:
Apparently the growth of Szechuan restaurants and chicken nuggets has escaped notice.
I don’t believe Cecil has addressed this topic, but he probably will in the future. So - in anticipation of that - I think Nickrz should move this thread to the “Cecil’s Columns” board.
Jill
Just kidding!
Well more of the examples listed contradict the definition as I am applying it. Hyenas have attacked big cats, and big cats attacked one another, but I don’t consider it being preyed upon. They are typically just a rivalry for resources or protecting young. This is outside the definition as I chose to use it (if anyone wants to streamline a definition I’d like to hear it.) Same goes for dolphins and sharks (from what I understand dolphins swim circles around a shark and will humble it quite easily), and eagles and owls. None of these animals prey upon one another, but in certain situations (usually not by choice of either species) they will fight, kill, and sometimes eat the other. I am curious what animals killed horses in undomesticated times.
Does the existence of ‘predation’ imply that of a corresponding verb ‘predate’? My dictionary doesn’t mention the latter, merely equating ‘predate’ to ‘antedate’. I think targeted pigeons should only have “expiration” dates. Whaddaya think?
I thought horses were only found on the Eurasian land mass (maybe Africa to), while the coug/puma/mountain lion was only found in the Americas. I suppose ferral horses imported by settlers may have been preyed upon, but does that make them “natural” predators?
Horses are prey to big cats, wolves, and wild dogs. Modern horses are not native to the Americas, so their natural predators would be native to Asia and Europe. However, pumas, jaguars, wolves, etc. had no problem adapting to their presence in the Americas.
Since I have already been on a New Zealand thread this morning …
Prior to the introduction of pigs, rats, cats, dogs, etc. by humans (starting about A.D. 1000) the birds of New Zealand (the dominant fauna) had no natural enemies, at least in the sense of predators. The only mammals on the islands were bats and pinnipeds. None of the birds were carnivorous, so although they competed with each other for ecological niches they didn’t eat each other.
Two things resulted from this – 1) a lot of flightless bird species developed, and 2) the native fauna were easy picking for the introduced predators. IIRC, in the Chatham Islands (near NZ) the lighthouse keeper’s cat was personally responsible for the extinction of a number of species of small birds.
“non sunt multiplicanda entia praeter necessitatem”
– William of Ockham
I guess what I was getting at in the orginal post was what amimals can, say for example, pretty much go about their business without having to worry about getting attacked.
I mean Elephants pretty much always have the right of way. Hippos will walk into a river full of alligators (or crocs), Sperm Wales don’t worry about sharks. (Actually I was reading that the biggest preditor of a shark is a larger shark).
Well, then, you should realize at least two important ways in which the question isn’t a fair one: (1) NO animal is immune from being attacked for its entire life, even an elephant. (2) just because an animal has no living predators NOW doesn’t mean it’s always been that way. I’m sure that Dire Wolves, Saber-toothed cats, and other large Pleistocene predators preyed on a lot of modern animals before they became extinct - and other large modern predators used to occur over much larger areas than they now occupy.
Actually, cats don’t have natural predators. There are no animals that seek out or prey on cats. Cats are strict carnivores, coyotes are not obligate carnivores. If their paths cross, they will probably fight and kill eachother.
You would feel a little differently if you lived in Southern California. Coyotes actively seek out and kill cats (and small dogs, and will stalk large dogs).
Also, while I can’t say it’s never happened, I’ve never heard of a cat owner waking up in the morning to find her living, triumphant pet with the tattered carcass of a coyote.
[QUOTE=;94065]
Crows And Ravens? No, mink kill them, & I’ve seen it happen, so give me no shit.
Otters, however; they have no natural enemies.
We have met the enemy, and He is Us.–Walt Kelly
[/QUOTE]
Unnamed historical poster, I can tell you that otters do have natural enemies. I saw a Bald Eagle try to catch one once. (in your defense, it was probably a few years after you posted this)
I agree with Omniscient above, humans have no natural enemies at all if we are discounting viruses and bacteria, as we must because no animal would qualify if we didn’t. I’m sure humans had natural enemies in the past but now we sit at the top of the food chain as do lions, tigers, etc.
It really depends on how you define “prey on”. Polar bears certainly prey on humans by any definition. Nile crocodiles attack hundreds of people every year and kill and eat most of those they attack. Tigers kill many hundreds of people each year, although one might argue about how many of these attacks are really predation.
