# What are the main cafes right now in the US? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 19, 2025, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799 "2025-03-19T00:05:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2025, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/121 "2025-03-19T22:24:08Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > I think that’s frowned upon at most diners. I think you are right. ---
**Author:** ![fedman1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e495f1/32.png) [@fedman1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fedman1)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2025, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/122 "2025-03-19T22:31:18Z")
I remember in Berkeley CA, there was a “student” that bought 1 cup of tea and then hogged the WiFi for hours–don’t know why mgmt allowed it ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2025, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/123 "2025-03-19T22:33:25Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > American diners serve some of the best hot food I’ve ever had. Much better than the standardized fast-food chains. This, so much this. And usually personable and/or intriguing people cooking or serving your food. Often like “Cheers”-“where everybody knows your name” and your usual order for the time of day. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2025, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/124 "2025-03-19T22:58:28Z")
If the shop is so busy that seating is limited, then that could be a problem. But if there’s plenty of seating, it might be considered valuable to have someone there to make it look busier. A totally empty cafe is also off-putting. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2025, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/125 "2025-03-19T23:03:02Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Before this thread, I always associated the word “cafe” with a place serving food rather than a place serving coffee I mean, “cafe” means “coffee” in about half the languages in the world. You never made the connection? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2025, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/126 "2025-03-19T23:59:56Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > And, yes, when I was younger, I never knew of any places that existed mainly just to serve coffee (as Starbucks does). Probably because they were exceedingly rare. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/127 "2025-03-20T00:03:41Z")
That’s true. When I was a child in New England, Dunkin Donuts was a doughnut chain known for good coffee. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/128 "2025-03-20T00:04:39Z")
ETA: @Alessan 3 posts up … To me, “cafe” has always been American for “simple (but not scruffy) casual restaurant, more lunch than breakfast or dinner, with zero specific association to coffee.” Meanwhile a “coffee shop” is a “diner specializing in breakfast and maybe lunch. And infinite refills of lousy coffee.” There never was a word in my flavor of American for “a place which specializes in serving nice coffee, small snacks, and being an inviting atmosphere designed to hang out in.” Such things simply did not exist in most of the USA until the 1970s if not later. There still isn’t IMO an unambiguous and well-recognized word for those kinds of places. Neither “cafe” nor “coffee shop” fit the bill; we need a new word. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/129 "2025-03-20T00:08:18Z")
The Starbucks website says that the company founder was inspired by a visit to Italy and seeing the coffeehouses there. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/130 "2025-03-20T00:09:39Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Neither “cafe” nor “coffee shop” fit the bill; we need a new word. Honestly, I can’t imagine a term that could possibly be more on the nose than those two. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/131 "2025-03-20T00:10:18Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > > [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > > > Before this thread, I always associated the word “cafe” with a place serving food rather than a place serving coffee > > I mean, “cafe” means “coffee” in about half the languages in the world. You never made the connection? Why are cafeterias named after coffee? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/132 "2025-03-20T00:11:40Z")
[cafeteria | Etymology of cafeteria by etymonline](https://www.etymonline.com/word/cafeteria#:~:text=1839%2C%20%22cafe%2C%22%20American%20English%2C%20from%20Mexican%20Spanish%20cafeteria,sense%20shifted%20by%201890s%20to%20%22self-service%20dining%20establishment.%22) The term “bistro,” BTW, is derived from the Russian word _bystro_, meaning “fast, quick,” or (in this case) “Hurry up!” It’s what Russian troops shouted to the staff of restaurants when they occupied Paris after the defeat of Napoleon. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/133 "2025-03-20T00:25:16Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > To me, “cafe” has always been American for “simple (but not scruffy) casual restaurant, more lunch than breakfast or dinner, with zero specific association to coffee.” Not here. And to double-check, I just did a Google Maps search for cafe, and they are overwhelmingly a Starbucks-ish experience: specializing in coffee/tea, with light food fare (pastries, pre-made sandwiches, etc.). Most of them are also tagged as “coffee shop”, which I’d consider synonymous. There are some exceptions here and there, but not too many. And surprisingly, still a few internet cafes (which of course mainly serve coffee and snacks, but also gaming systems)! ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/134 "2025-03-20T00:36:34Z")
We have “coffee house” maybe? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/135 "2025-03-20T00:44:15Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > > [@LSLGuy](#): > > > > To me, “cafe” has always been American for “simple (but not scruffy) casual restaurant, more lunch than breakfast or dinner, with zero specific association to coffee.” > > Not here. And to double-check, I just did a Google Maps search for cafe, and they are overwhelmingly a Starbucks-ish experience I wonder whether this is one of those language differences that vary by region. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/136 "2025-03-20T00:44:49Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > We have “coffee house” maybe? That’s the best word IMO. But as shown above, there’s not widespread agreement within the USA that “coffee house” means “What an old-style Starbucks hoped to be as they copied something ubiquitous in Europe.” ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/137 "2025-03-20T00:48:48Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > > [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > > > > [@LSLGuy](#): > > > > > > To me, “cafe” has always been American for “simple (but not scruffy) casual restaurant, more lunch than breakfast or dinner, with zero specific association to coffee.” > > > > Not here. And to double-check, I just did a Google Maps search for cafe, and they are overwhelmingly a Starbucks-ish experience > > I wonder whether this is one of those language differences that vary by region. My experience is the same as @LSLGuy . I believe we are both on the West Coast. Our Cafes are entirely different to what they call a cafe in Europe and nothing like Starbucks. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/138 "2025-03-20T00:50:17Z")
Could be, though I wonder if it’s an age thing as well. I do recognize **LSLGuy** ’s description to some extent, but it’s been decades since I’ve had that association. There’s also the occasional use of “cafe” as being short for cafeteria. Often in a corporate setting (including my own workplace). ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/139 "2025-03-20T01:06:24Z")
When I think of a “cafeteria,” I remember the place in the basement of my junior high where I had lunch. Mind you, there were some very good cafeterias in downtown Minneapolis that served real food when I was a kid. My mother often had lunch at a cafeteria and would take me along with her on occasion. The best one was turned into a disco nightclub in the '70s (“Scottie’s on Seventh”). My senior high didn’t have a “cafeteria” or a “lunchroom.” It was a beautiful brand-new school and had what would today probably be called a “food court” in the large open area on the ground floor. IIRC, we called it a “commons” back in the day. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2025, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799/140 "2025-03-20T01:12:07Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > When I think of a “cafeteria,” I remember the place in the basement of my junior high where I had lunch. And I think that’s why there’s some avoidance of the word. The campus cafeteria is pretty good, overall. Somewhere between typical fast causal fare and an actual restaurant. But “cafeteria” gives off the vibe of that awful food served in school (think Lunchlady Doris from The Simpsons). So they shorten it to “cafe”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-the-main-cafes-right-now-in-the-us/1015799.md?page=8)