Is Second Cup dead in the US?
Australia has very few chains for coffee but EVERYone sells good coffee, even the local service station has a proper Italian espresso machine on the counter.
Always surprised when Hungry Jacks ( Burger King ) shows me their lovely espresso machine,
As a senior I get a free latte with any meal purchase.
So for brekkie ( ya ya Aussies are a lot on slang )
A good deal is bacon and egg wrap with a hash brown for $4.50 all in and the free latte…
Is Panera still a thing anywhere? I’ve never really heard anyone rave about their coffee, but in my area it’s definitely the place people go to sit and use the wifi, or have a meeting.
Good bread for sure. Did not go there much before I left Canada,
This article from 2023 says that:
So, I’m not sure that they were ever in the U.S. before (or, if they were, it was years ago, and on a small scale).
There are still a number of them in the Chicago area, and the article with the restaurant rankings lists them as the #11 restaurant chain in the U.S. I don’t view them as being primarily a coffee place (more about bakery and food), but I agree, they are definitely a “sit and use the wifi” place.
*Does this give away my age?
Maybe - because I see people saying this
I don’t know that there is a hard line between the two, but I believe cafes have wait service while coffee shops don’t.
and this
Starbucks is the dominant coffee shop here in NYC.
And I’m " What" ? A “coffee shop” to me is the sort of breakfast, maybe lunch restaurant that has counter service and maybe a couple of booths or tables. ( Not as many of these left in NYC as there used to be) Often a wall of doughnuts. It’s similar to a diner, except that diners usually have more tables/booths and serve dinner. A “cafe” to me , sells coffee and baked goods - not sandwiches or egg/pancake breakfasts. And not just donuts - that would be a “donut shop”. A cafe might or might not have table service or maybe not - but it’s basically the equivalent of a bakery that sells coffee and has some tables.
Starbucks and Dunkin are just fast food coffee places.
How bad is cellular data service in the U.S. that people are still willing to us public wi-fi?
Not that it’s bad (though it sometimes is); it’s probably more that (a) not everyone has an unlimited data plan on their phones, and (b) they are often using the wifi for their laptops.
I don’t know how pervasive “hot spots” are to pair your laptop to your cell network, so I’d assume laptop users are using the wifi.
I think also “using the wifi” is almost just a metaphor now for “sitting and staring at a screen.” The users might not actually be using the cafe’s wifi. But that’s what I’m going to call it.
I assume it’s because they want a comfortable place to sit and work, and that isn’t as boring as staying at home.
I regularly work in cafes (in fact, I’m typing this in one now), but maybe 1 in 4 has lousy wifi. In which case I use my phone’s 4/5G which is more than adequate.
Another reason to sit in a café for work rather than staying home is just for the socialization. Many of us work from home, so we don’t see others throughout the day. Working in a café may help.
I’m beginning to realize we Americans don’t have a better word for places like Starbucks than just “coffee place”. Coffee shops serve food made to order. Coffeehouse are counterculture performance venues from days of yore. And cafes are more akin to French bistros.
I remember Madison, WI having ZERO coffee places! Hard to believe, because the UW, the Capitol and businesses make for a busy downtown.
I’d just come from Harvard Square, where you’d be served your own french press, good for a couple of cups. I was surprised that Madison had nothing like this.
But this was the mid-'70s, when, if you wanted a cup of coffee, you’d order a meal at a diner.
Or a drugstore… the local Rennebohm’s (now Walgreen’s) would have a lunch counter that served breakfast. Ahh… I miss the Number Nine: Two eggs, toast and hash browns; with coffee, $1.05.
I think what you’re calling a coffee shop I would call a diner. I am familiar with this usage but consider it mildly archaic.
IME NYC has lots of diners, but I’ve never seen one that closes for dinner; indeed, very long hours are one of their defining features. I’m guessing maybe a few decades ago rents were cheap enough that a diner could afford to be open only half-time, but the world has moved on.
I would consider “coffee shop” (outside of Amsterdam). a nebulous catch-all term for places that primarily sell coffee. A drive-through Starbucks and a place with comfy couches selling $16 single origin tumeric lattes are both coffee shops, but only the latter is a cafe.
I don’t think it used to be that odd to go into a bar and order a coffee back in the day.
I agree with Elmer, “coffeehouse” signifies the sort of place where Ferlinghetti and Kerouac hung out listening to jazz and smoking reefers. I would consider anyplace trying to call itself that in 2025 unbearably pretentious.
I think at 57 and having grown up in a college town, I am JUST young enough to not remember the dark times when quality coffee wasn’t widely available. Thank Og!
As I say, at least less ambiguity than in british english. Where, if you see “Ren’s Cafe”, say, on a map, you have no idea what it is without checking the actual photos and reviews. It could be a fancy cafe with soft-lighting, bookshelves and other furnishing that would be fine for part of a first date. Or it could be the front room of what was originally a house converted into a bright, noisy “greasy spoon” restaurant (not to knock them, just it’s a pain when you arrive at the wrong kind of cafe).
In the UK, the majority of pubs, and even bars, serve coffee, but it’s probably because the majority of pubs sell food. It’s quite unusual for someone to just order coffee at such places though (I do it, but the bar staff are often a bit surprised, and it seems to mess with their rhythm).
Related question that I hope is not too much of a hijack. How to pronounce cafe vs café? I’ve heard cafe pronounced as the first syllable of cafeteria, while café is pronounced with a long A on the end. Do people use the unaccented spelling but pronounce as if the accent is there?
The Peet’s I know of around here originally opened as a Caribou Coffee. Outdoor seating and two big roll-up doors which are open when the weather’s nice.
This combination Irish-style chippie and bar had a stock of board games for patrons. The chippie was part of a local chain which is now out of business; that location is yet another Starbucks now.
But not in the UK.
But you can go to a pub and drink coffee or tea, eat a variety of snacks or even proper food. And have an alcoholic drink.