# What are these weird symbols in this church? Picture included. **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 4, 2015, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594 "2015-06-04T01:11:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/21 "2015-06-04T18:24:33Z")
Here is the clearest picture I have found yet, if it helps beyond what I’ve shown already. [Very good image of the symbols.](http://www.ctksouthgate.org/ClientData/1024/Assets/images/all%20school%20picture%20067.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/22 "2015-06-04T18:33:47Z")
I sent a message to the church using their contact form. ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/23 "2015-06-04T18:53:42Z")
In the latest picture, it looks kind of like a serpent to me. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/24 "2015-06-04T20:30:46Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > I sent a message to the church using their contact form. Which church? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/25 "2015-06-04T21:48:36Z")
> [@naita](#): > > Which church? I assume the church I posted about? ---
**Author:** ![No\_umlaut\_for\_U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ea5d25/32.png) [@No\_umlaut\_for\_U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/No_umlaut_for_U)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/26 "2015-06-04T22:23:07Z")
The crown is the top part of a heart; the symbols the rest. I can’t figure out the serpent squiggle, either. ---
**Author:** ![Cunctator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/43a26b/32.png) [@Cunctator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cunctator)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/27 "2015-06-04T22:37:48Z")
Perhaps they’re a Lutheran version of the 12 consecration crosses that Catholic churches have? In Catholic churches they’re generally spaced regularly around the church though, not all together in the one place. ---
**Author:** ![I.Dunno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9f8e36/32.png) [@I.Dunno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I.Dunno)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/28 "2015-06-04T23:31:31Z")
> [@Cunctator](#): > > Perhaps they’re a Lutheran version of the 12 consecration crosses that Catholic churches have? In Catholic churches they’re generally spaced regularly around the church though, not all together in the one place. Catholics have 14 Stations of the Cross spread around on the (usually side) walls. This does not appear to be anything like that. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/29 "2015-06-04T23:38:27Z")
I have been in more Lutheran churches than any other in recent years - for some reason, they are the go-to place for small concerts and performances when secular halls aren’t available. Even though I was raised in a Lutheran family, every one of these modernish temples has weird, abstract, non-representational decoration/symbols in them. I think the sect has a thing for avoiding the representational art of the Catholics but has a need for decoration shunned by the plainer sects, and likes Islam’s take on geometric art. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/30 "2015-06-05T00:44:23Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > Does St. John the Baptist hold any special significance in Lutheranism? That wavy sign makes me think it could be a symbol for “water” - and by extension, for St. John the Baptist. Except that John the Baptist was not one of the Twelve, so if the twelve stars represent the Twelve, then none of them represents the Baptist. On the other hand, if that symbol represents the Baptist, then what are the other eleven stars for? The wider shot posted by in post 12 shows the stars displayed around a big crown. A crown with 12 stars appears in scripture, in Rev 12:1 (“a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of 12 stars”). Any connection? On the other hand, since the church is the Church of Christ the King, there is a less apocalyptic explanation for the symbolism of the crown. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/31 "2015-06-05T00:56:47Z")
> [@UDS](#): > > Except that John the Baptist was not one of the Twelve, so if the twelve stars represent the Twelve, then none of them represents the Baptist. On the other hand, if that symbol represents the Baptist, then what are the other eleven stars for? Punctuality and attendance. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/32 "2015-06-05T01:01:10Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > In some Christian traditions, 11 of the Apostles (including Matthias, who was elected to replace Judas) were martyred for their faith. Only John died a natural death, although he had been exiled. > > But I’ll be damned if I know what the squiggle is supposed to mean, whether it represents John or Judas. These were my thoughts. Either Matthias, who was an alternate called up late or John with the tradition of not being martyred. My own leaning would be toward Matthias. I do not believe that any church would honor Judas, particularly with Matthias mentioned explicitly in Scripture. Baptism would only make sense if there were twelve specific rites paralleling the seven sacraments of Catholicism. Since the Lutherans recognize some, not all, sacraments, (meaning far fewer than twelve), that would seem to dismiss Baptism–particlularly as the other eleven symbols are identical crosses, while there are not eleven identical, or even equal, rites. It will be interesting if the church responds to the query. ---
**Author:** ![CraterLayer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/87869e/32.png) [@CraterLayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CraterLayer)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/33 "2015-06-05T02:14:25Z")
The small crosses actually look like plus signs, all sides are equal. Maybe stylized stars? The squiggly thing may be a fish or serpent. ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/34 "2015-06-05T02:57:51Z")
Mary was lying at the cross while the disciples stood around ? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/35 "2015-06-05T04:09:56Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > I’m sure i’s meant to be Judas. But if you do call the church, be sure and tell them to flip that horseshoe vertically. If they hang it _that_ way all the luck will run out. > > d&r Heh. Actually, though, that’s the Omega, which is the last letter of the Greek alphabet. It’s because God said in the Bible that he is the Alpha (beginning) and the Omega (end). Basically, it’s a symbol of God being [eternal](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha_and_Omega), or something like that. (It’s been a LOOOONG time since Catholic school) ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/36 "2015-06-05T05:13:52Z")
I like the Viking longboat (obviously right for Lutherans, ya sure, yabetcha), but you would think they could have at least added the sail and maybe tried a little harder making the keel look at least like a keel. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/37 "2015-06-05T05:30:54Z")
Looking again, it looks like a serpent or snake. So, Satan, for Judas? ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/38 "2015-06-05T09:11:31Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > I assume the church I posted about? Seesh! :smack: I thought I’d reread the thread thoroughly, but evidently missed you clearly identifying the church. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/39 "2015-06-05T11:51:04Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Heh. Actually, though, that’s the Omega, which is the last letter of the Greek alphabet. It’s because God said in the Bible that he is the Alpha (beginning) and the Omega (end). Basically, it’s a symbol of God being [eternal](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha_and_Omega), or something like that. (It’s been a LOOOONG time since Catholic school) Yeah, I think you got whooshed. The dude obviously knows what it is. They have an alpha on the other side, if anyone is curious. > [@naita](#): > > Seesh! :smack: I thought I’d reread the thread thoroughly, but evidently missed you clearly identifying the church. Heh, I’ve been there! No biggie. We will only mock you forever now. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594/40 "2015-06-05T12:30:49Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > It is a Lutheran church, if that helps. They have a cross up on the wall in the back of the _stage_… Ital added [Nitpick} Altar [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-these-weird-symbols-in-this-church-picture-included/721594.md?page=3)