# What, are we Americans wimpier than Europeans? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 13, 2001, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854 "2001-03-13T21:16:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![egkelly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/db5fbb/32.png) [@egkelly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/egkelly)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/21 "2001-03-14T17:41:04Z")
I am an American, and I used to work fopr a large European multinational, which had plants in countrys around the world\> Up untill the mid-90’s, it seemed that a beer or glass of wine was pretty common in most European countries-in England, the company cafeteria actually served beer. In France, wine was automatic with the meal. In Germany, the company cafeteria also served beer and wine. Then, things started changing-by 1996 the german plant had closed the executive dining room, and did away with all alcoholic beverages.Holland also. But France-you still were expected to have a glass of wine with lunch, in fact, afternoons were usually pretty mellow there! ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/22 "2001-03-14T17:44:13Z")
Well, back in December, the office had a holiday lunch, and wine was bought and enjoyed by most. Among other reasons, I usually don’t drink with lunch because I really don’t know what kind of wine goes with a Whopper. My budget isn’t really high enough to go to the sort of restaurant for lunch where people actually bring food to you. Occassionally, when I’m out with my friends, I will have a glass of beer or wine with my meal. As for the people you saw at the restaurant, maybe they don’t like alcohol, or maybe they have some sort of moral opposition to drinking, or maybe medical conditions, or maybe they just didn’t feel like it. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/23 "2001-03-14T19:04:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jonathan Chance \* > **Hey, I object to Americans being considered wimps for not drinking. Especially if it’s by Europeans who drive those little toy cars!** Crap. If it means being able to drink at lunch and not have those fucking SUVs around, I really must start looking into the apartment rental situation in Paris. **drop:** According to Lender and Martin’s DRINKING IN AMERICA: A SOCIAL HISTORY, the contemporary (well, the book came out in 1986) per capita consumption of hard liquor comes out to about two gallons for each U.S. citizen. In 1800, it was an astonishing TWELVE gallons. But I don’t think it was the Puritans who were drinking it…can’t picture Jonathan Edwards waving away the DT spiders. Most of it probably went down the gullets of those crazy westerners out in Kentucky and Tennessee, the snowbound northern New Englanders who preferred hard cider to water, and the Southern plantation owners who served up Juleps with breakfast. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/24 "2001-03-14T19:41:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ukulele Ike \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Jonathan Chance \* > > **Hey, I object to Americans being considered wimps for not drinking. Especially if it’s by Europeans who drive those little toy cars!** > > Crap. If it means being able to drink at lunch and not have those fucking SUVs around, I really must start looking into the apartment rental situation in Paris.\*\* You just knock yourself out there, Ike. I’ll be standing on the dock, waving my hanky. But when someone on the continent gives you a hard time about driving such a big, gas-guzzling car and you’re driving a **geo** don’t come running back here! 😃 > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ukulele Ike \* > \*\*But I don’t think it was the Puritans who were drinking it…can’t picture Jonathan Edwards waving away the DT spiders. Most of it probably went down the gullets of those crazy westerners out in Kentucky and Tennessee, the snowbound northern New Englanders who preferred hard cider to water, and the Southern plantation owners who served up Juleps with breakfast. \*\* Nice to see those of us in the mid-Atlantic are tee-totalers. Other than that, you covered the whole of the country in 1800 there, chief. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/25 "2001-03-14T19:52:30Z")
More observations: I think the tendency of Americans to equate drinking with drunkeness is definitely a factor. But I think there is another aspect that hasn’t been mentioned. When I was working in Germany I was amazed that federal law prohibits shops from opening on Sunday. When I would talk to the locals about it, I would spout, “Think of all the lost revenue!” They would respond, “You Americans are so greedy! We are more focused on a balanced life.” The gist of it for me is that we Americans idolize the rich, working long hours is a source of pride for many. We are constantly bombarded with messages that tell us we have to strive to achieve more, more, more! If we don’t, then the competition will bury us, dammit! So, do we want to have a little drink at lunch? Hell no! Do we want our staff to have a little drink at lunch? Hell no! The Europeans, on the other hand, just aren’t as maniacal about it. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/26 "2001-03-14T20:45:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jonathan Chance \* > **Nice to see those of us in the mid-Atlantic are tee-totalers** "Rum was a versatile spirit, being equally well-suited to mixing with water and fruit juice to make a refreshing long summer drink, and to warming with sugar and spices to make a fortifying winter one…It suited the extreme climate of the Middle Atlantic colonies which were, by European standards, very hot in summer and very cold in winter… “Benjamin Franklin became quite a drinker in his Philadelphia days, and even went so far on one occasion as to suggest that God had given humanity an elbow positioned just as it was for the sole purpose of making it possible to raise glasses of wine conveniently to the mouth.” – Andrew Barr; DRINK: A SOCIAL HISTORY OF AMERICA, Carroll & Graf, 1999. Happy now, **JC**? Pleasure doing business with you. ---
**Author:** ![teela\_brown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d9b06d/32.png) [@teela\_brown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teela_brown)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/27 "2001-03-14T21:03:47Z")
Old Ben had all his marbles. ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/28 "2001-03-14T21:11:42Z")
Damn I love being a computer nerd in Colorado. In every group I’ve worked in it kind of surprises everybody if you don’t grab a drink if your at lunching at a place that has it. Not much wine (a couple of the female types only) all the guys drink beer, usually a microbrew, (If you order a bud or coors everybody snickers). We have a bet on the each new guy who comes from a stuffy field, whether or not he has the guts to order one. Hell the CIO came into town for a meeting and bought lunch for us. He proceeded to drink 3 double scotches before giving a presentation to our local customers. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/29 "2001-03-14T22:41:47Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ukulele Ike \* > **But I don’t think it was the Puritans who were drinking it…can’t picture Jonathan Edwards waving away the DT spiders.** The reference I had gave the amounts in grain alcohol to provide a more standardized unit. And it was STILL in the 12-gallon neighborhood. Apparently, I have to go to the library to protect my honor. OTOH, my wife’s great aunt married into the Standish family (yes, I know Miles Standish was a hireling and not a Puritan) and they all seem to want to maintain the traditional buzz. ---
**Author:** ![TomH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/90db22/32.png) [@TomH](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TomH)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2001, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/30 "2001-03-14T22:57:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jr8 \* > On a similar subject, it’s not uncommon In England to see pregnant women drinking (wine, usually). This gives me the heebie-jeebies, but I have thus far restrained myself from committing a cultural _faux pas_ by shouting “Are you MAD, woman?!?” at the person in question. UK Government guidance on alcohol consumption in pregnancy is that one unit of alcohol per day (e.g. one glass of wine) is OK, up to a maximum of four per week. From the [Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists](http://www.rcog.org.uk/guidelines/alcohol.html): > [@](#): > > There is no conclusive evidence of adverse effects in either growth or IQ at levels of consumption below 120gms (15 units) per week. Nonetheless it is recommended that women should be careful about alcohol consumption in pregnancy and limit this to no more than one standard drink per day. ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2001, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/31 "2001-03-15T04:14:24Z")
One _more_ reason why any baby porpentines will be born on their dad’s side of the pond and not mine… ---
**Author:** ![Juniper200](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@Juniper200](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Juniper200)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2001, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/32 "2001-03-15T05:00:41Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by pugluvr_ > **If that were the case, it means that they would also have to assume that whole nations in Europe are too snockered to function.** I find it’s best to just operate under that assumption from the get-go. 😃 ::d&r:: ---
**Author:** ![oldscratch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ed655f/32.png) [@oldscratch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oldscratch)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2001, 8:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/33 "2001-03-15T08:07:03Z")
I agree pug. nice rant there. I had a british boss a while back, and he would always pull out the nice scotch for meetings of the employees. We frequently drank on the job there, as well as other things. Then I moved to my last tech job, no drinking. Though the CEO did it. sigh. nothing wrong with a beer at lunch. ---
**Author:** ![Badtz\_Maru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e36b37/32.png) [@Badtz\_Maru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Badtz_Maru)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2001, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/34 "2001-03-15T08:19:19Z")
Sigh, my company’s California office at one time had beer available for all the employees (FREE!) in the break room. Unfortunately, I work at the Dallas office. 8^( It seems like a good idea to me. You’ll really find out quick who is irresponsible if you have free beer available at work. ---
**Author:** ![Tansu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/67e7ee/32.png) [@Tansu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tansu)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2001, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/35 "2001-03-15T09:49:39Z")
I must sell that idea to my bosses. Remember, I have a fully functioning bar just downstairs. ---
**Author:** ![TomH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/90db22/32.png) [@TomH](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TomH)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2001, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/36 "2001-03-15T17:32:02Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Fretful Porpentine_ > One _more_ reason why any baby porpentines will be born on their dad’s side of the pond and not mine… I think the four drinks a week thing is a recommended maximum rather than a compulsory minimum. ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2001, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/37 "2001-03-15T17:46:42Z")
Well, seeing as how the recommended maximum over here is zero drinks in nine months, I’ll take what I can get… Just out of curiosity, does the RCOG have anything to say about caffeine consumption during pregnancy? I can’t seem to find anything on that site. ---
**Author:** ![TomH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/90db22/32.png) [@TomH](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TomH)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2001, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854/38 "2001-03-16T11:11:09Z")
IIRC, they suggest no more than two cups of coffee or three cups of tea per day. They also advise to avoid: soft cheeses, unpasteurised milk, raw or partially-cooked eggs, pates and rare meat. Caveat: I can’t find any of this on the site, either, so I’m writing from memory. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-we-americans-wimpier-than-europeans/57854.md?page=1)