# What are your electric vehicle plans? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 22, 2020, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614 "2020-10-22T18:45:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 60
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2023, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1206 "2023-10-30T22:31:02Z")
> [@The\_Librarian](#): > > Somebody is shamelessly making up shit to cover their buyers regret. (Or to justify destroying the planet to save a buck) Is that an accusation of lying on my part? I hope I’ve misunderstood that. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2023, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1207 "2023-10-30T22:42:40Z")
> [@Stanislaus](#): > > [Best MPG cars 2023 | Honest John](https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/guides/best-mpg-cars) > > @Novelty_Bobble 's figures are well in the realm of modern performance - the cite above quotes over 70mpg for the dinky Peugeot 208, and 61 for the selfsame Skoda Ocatavia, so real world 58/60 isn’t anything to be surprised about. > > (Oh, to be using litres/100km!) Yes, once i realized it was imperial gallons, not US gallons, the numbers made sense. A lot of the numbers looked ridiculously high to Americans used to seeing miles per US gallon. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2023, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1208 "2023-10-30T23:01:32Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > Our detached garage has a 240V outlet…not at home but I believe it is a 14-50. So, that should be all that is required for charging? I’ve got a 240V dryer outlet in my garage. My dryer is currently plugged into it, but lately I’ve been getting lots of ads in my Facebook feed for a smart switch that will switch the load between dryer and car charger depending on which is being used. It’s almost scary how Facebook showed me ads for _exactly_ what I’ll need. If I get an EV (and my next car almost certainly will be an EV), all I’ll need is one of those switches and a charger designed to work with a 30 amp dryer outlet and I will be good to go. ---
**Author:** ![echoreply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/echoreply/32/3641_2.png) [@echoreply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/echoreply)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2023, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1209 "2023-10-30T23:14:52Z")
> [@WildaBeast](#): > > all I’ll need is one of those switches and a charger designed to work with a 30 amp dryer outlet and I will be good to go That seems like a good solution, but depending on the exact details of your electrical wiring, tax, and utility rebates, it might not be much (or any) more expensive to add a second 240V outlet for the car. All I mean is, get some estimates when the time comes. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1210 "2023-10-31T00:00:49Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > If the stuff you want to haul is at the top of a mountain, you’re just consuming its potential energy. No free lunches involved. Heavy train goes down, light train goes up. If you can capture enough of the potential energy on the way down, you can pay for the trip up, or most of it. yep, a funicular, with “energy” instead of a cable connecting the 2 trains as transmission medium > **[Funicular](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Funicular)** > > A funicular (/fjuːˈnɪkjʊlər, f(j)ʊ-, f(j)ə-/) is a type of cable railway system that connects points along a railway track laid on a steep slope. The system is characterized by two counterbalanced carriages (also called cars or trains) permanently attached to opposite ends of a haulage cable, which is looped over a pulley at the upper end of the track. The result of such a configuration is that the two carriages move synchronously: as one ascends, the other descends at an equal speed. Th The te... a similar system is running in the mines in the north of chile (possibly the same owners as the australian mine (BHP, Rio Tinto, Antofagasta Minerals,…) ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1211 "2023-10-31T08:32:26Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > Although I think that’s an extremely skewed assumption. Well seeing as I’m making my decison on the costs to me based on the driving pattern that I know I’ll be doing, it is only skewed towards my personal experience. It isn’t really that much of an assumption. I do 12,000 miles a year. I take at least 2 major continental cruises of 2000 miles each, at least three 700+ mile roundtrips to the north-east of the UK and at least three 600+ mile roundtrips to Cornwall. (and perhaps more depending on where my son decides to go to university). That’s a minimum of half my yearly mileage being dependant on expensive public charging. I’ve done my sums for home tariffs and public charging and, as energy costs currently stand, the _average_ per kWh is going to be anywhere between 40-50p. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1212 "2023-10-31T11:36:10Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > If the stuff you want to haul is at the top of a mountain, you’re just consuming its potential energy. No free lunches involved. Heavy train goes down, light train goes up. If you can capture enough of the potential energy on the way down, you can pay for the trip up, or most of it. This is an excellent rephrasing of what I said. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1213 "2023-10-31T11:59:26Z")
Moderating: > [@The\_Librarian](#): > > That’s why I brought this up. > > Somebody is shamelessly making up shit… Please don’t accuse other posters of lying. If you are dubious of their numbers, there are polite ways to clarify, as several others have done in this thread. And, as you’ve probably noticed, in this case the discrepancy had a completely innocent (and honest) explanation. > [@The\_Librarian](#): > > Or to justify destroying the planet And this is attacking the poster. The whole post is inappropriate for IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1214 "2023-10-31T12:31:30Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > If the stuff you want to haul is at the top of a mountain, you’re just consuming its potential energy. No free lunches involved. Heavy train goes down, light train goes up. If you can capture enough of the potential energy on the way down, you can pay for the trip up, or most of it. There is an interesting twist on that being explored for the purpose of off-peak electricity storage. [Gravity Batteries](https://www.euronews.com/green/2023/03/29/gravity-batteries-abandoned-mines-could-store-enough-energy-to-power-the-entire-earth). In short, winch a big weight up high using spare off-peak power (e.g. from wind etc.) then let it drop during peak times and turn the kinetic energy back into electricity. I like the elegance of using abandoned mineshafts for that purpose. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1215 "2023-10-31T14:24:10Z")
> [@WildaBeast](#): > > It’s almost scary how Facebook showed me ads for _exactly_ what I’ll need. If I get an EV (and my next car almost certainly will be an EV) Showing you ads for something that is useless to you now but may be useful in the future is not FB hitting the mark in my opinion. If it were true, you’d see a lot more ads for caskets. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1216 "2023-10-31T15:34:09Z")
The Gravity Battery method gets used with water as well. Utilities will pump water up to a reservoir at night and let it fall through a hydroelectric generator when demand increases. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1217 "2023-10-31T15:56:38Z")
Absolutely, pumped storage has been used for nigh on a century and this is just an interesting twist on a theme. Though when you think about it, what is a pendulum clock other than a gravity battery of sorts? ---
**Author:** ![echoreply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/echoreply/32/3641_2.png) [@echoreply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/echoreply)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1218 "2023-10-31T16:13:24Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > What’s the initial outlay for each (I’m buying outright so that simplifies things) > ICE - £22,500 > EV - £39,400 > So for that 17k to be recouped With that kind of price differential you’ll have to really stretch things to make a scenario where the EV makes financial sense. Ten times gas prices or drive 150,000 miles per year, then sure huge price differences in the vehicle’s initial cost become trivial compared to operating expenses. This is part of the calculation that goes into EV delivery trucks and semis. I think an important thing to remember is you’re not comparing cars at the same market segments. That £22,500 ICE may be the minimum car that meets your needs, but the £39,400 is going to have lots of features you don’t care about. Compare the EV to an ICE car with similar features, and the prices will be much closer. For example, a Tesla Model Y and an Audi Q5 have similar dimensions and amenities, and are much closer in price. There is nothing wrong with your perspective of the minimum ICE that meets your needs compared to the minimum EV that could meet your needs. When the only EV you want is also higher equipped luxury car, then it is going to be out of your price range. You also aren’t considering getting a new Audi Q5. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1219 "2023-10-31T19:31:13Z")
> [@echoreply](#): > > I think an important thing to remember is you’re not comparing cars at the same market segments. That £22,500 ICE may be the minimum car that meets your needs, but the £39,400 is going to have lots of features you don’t care about. But if the £39k vehicle is the only one that fits the size criteria then that’s the only one that I can compare it to. Show me lower specced EV that fulfills my requirements at a much lower price and I’d compare that one instead. My research suggests that such a car doesn’t exist. But I’d disagree that I’m not comparing cars in the same segment. I chose a low-ish spec ICE from the same manufacturer as their low-ish spec EV. It isn’t branded as something particularly luxurious. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1220 "2023-10-31T19:52:47Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Though when you think about it, what is a pendulum clock other than a gravity battery of sorts? a pendulum watch gets its energy from the coil (mainspring) you have to wind with the key (or the crown on a mechanic wristwatch) … this compresses a coiled metal strip that wants to uncoil … and that is your source of energy - not gravity. A well documented example of this - the handwound Omega Seamaster used on earth, the moon and in between: [![](https://www.horobox.com/Cms_Data/Contents/SampleBusiness/Media/Haberler/Gecmisten-Gunumuze-Omega-Speedmaster-Part-2/omega-speedmaster-jack-swigert-.jpg) ](https://www.horobox.com/Cms_Data/Contents/SampleBusiness/Media/Haberler/Gecmisten-Gunumuze-Omega-Speedmaster-Part-2/omega-speedmaster-jack-swigert-.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1221 "2023-10-31T20:12:14Z")
> [@Al128](#): > > a pendulum watch gets its energy from the coil (mainspring) you have to wind with the key (or the crown on a mechanic wristwatch) … this compresses a coiled metal strip that wants to uncoil … and that is your source of energy - not gravity. What about the weight on a pendulum _clock_? ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1222 "2023-10-31T20:22:48Z")
yep, absolutely true (I brainfarted) … there the key actually brings up (raises) a rather heavy weight(s), whose kinetic energy drives the movement [![](https://www.rfcafe.com/miscellany/factoids/images2/grandmother-clock-weight-energy-calculation.jpg) ](https://www.rfcafe.com/miscellany/factoids/images2/grandmother-clock-weight-energy-calculation.jpg) … just like a gravity battery … 🤦‍♂️ ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1223 "2023-10-31T20:25:17Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > What about the weight on a pendulum _clock_? Yes, that’s what I was imagining. In a [long-case clock](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandfather_clock) you wind and it raises the weight, which then drops slowly and the pendulum regulates the movement. You can have a spring and a pendulum of course. ETA - now I think about it we have a rather nice poppy-motif french art nouveau clock downstairs. Left to my wife by her grandad. That has a wound spring and pendulum mechanism. ---
**Author:** ![Tride](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tride/32/13907_2.png) [@Tride](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tride)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2023, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1224 "2023-11-17T19:24:30Z")
Just got word that our Lyriq is built and waiting for shipment. Exciting! ---
**Author:** ![Tride](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tride/32/13907_2.png) [@Tride](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tride)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2023, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614/1225 "2023-11-28T19:22:54Z")
The Lyriq is still sitting in Tennessee. But we have a Leaf as a rental while the CR-V is in the shop. I like it! Surprisingly peppy, comfortable, good UI, decent stereo. If you can deal with the 200 mile range and FWD, Nissan kind of nailed it (which is rare for them these days). One pedal driving is awesome, especially when you have a right knee injury! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614.md?page=59) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-are-your-electric-vehicle-plans/923614.md?page=61)