# What atheists think, and why (in re: GEEPERS) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 27, 2012, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150 "2012-04-27T16:57:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 30
**Author:** ![GEEPERS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c89c15/32.png) [@GEEPERS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GEEPERS)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/581 "2012-05-23T20:24:26Z")
> [@Latro](#): > > You reap what you sow. > > Maybe if you had started out in a friendly and civilised manner? I did, and was insulted and ganged up on immediately. It’s quite natural to respond in a defensive manner under such circumstances. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/582 "2012-05-23T20:25:59Z")
If I started posting on a medical board and advertised that I believe in the healing power of crystals, I’d expect to be “insulted” (you haven’t been, it’ll against the rules to insult someone in GD) and for everybody there to be united in opposition to me. Consider that your reception is directly due to your claims and presentation. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/583 "2012-05-23T20:29:54Z")
> [@GEEPERS](#): > > I did, and was insulted and ganged up on immediately. In your estimation, what exactly constitutes an insult? This thread has been closely moderated. Insults are not allowed in this forum. If you think you have been insulted, report it to a moderator. ---
**Author:** ![GEEPERS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c89c15/32.png) [@GEEPERS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GEEPERS)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/584 "2012-05-23T20:34:27Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > No, you do not know what honesty is. I have not only explained my reasoning, you are evidently attempting to claim that if I’m _wrong_ in my reasoning, then I’m _dishonest_ in my argument. That’s just babble. As it is, I have perfectly valid facts to base my conclusion on, which is that \*they didn’t publish. \* Evidently you don’t understand the importance of that fact, but to put it in a nutshell: we have people whose claims would earn them, at a minimum, Nobel prizes, global fame, and riches beyond their wildest dreams. Instead, they don’t publish. It’s because _they have nothing to publish._ Your conclusion is based on your refusal to ever accept the possibility of a divine healing. Go to the conference, investigate the documentation. Then report exactly how it is flawed from a scientific medical perspective. But now you refused so I’m am correct that you refuse to accept evidence. I love how you atheists come off like you are the supreme experts in everything. Where did you get your medical degree from again? > [@FinnAgain](#): > > Look at your comments about atheists, then stop crying crocodile tears. > Further, if you can’t have the facts of your ignorance or logical errors pointed out to you, _then fix your position rather than asking to be treated with kid gloves._. I’m not crying. I’m yawning. You are full of hot air. > [@FinnAgain](#): > > The Bible contains no such “prophecies”. You’ve already been corrected on that error, and you’re coming back to it. Well see I live in the real world where the Bible does contain many fullfilled prophecies. Israel became a nation again. Score. Zephaniah 2:5 says: “the word of the Lord is against you; O Canaan, the land of the Philistines, I will even destroy thee, that there shall be no inhabitant” Did the Philistines get destroyed? Yep. The Philistines have now long since vanished and never returned. One of many many examples. And you are wrong yet again. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/585 "2012-05-23T20:47:39Z")
> [@GEEPERS](#): > > Your conclusion is based on your refusal to ever accept the possibility of a divine healing. Seeing as how I literally just explained what my conclusion was based on, and that it has nothing to do with babble about not accepting possibilities, I can only assume that you’ve constructed a strawman since you can’t address the actual argument. You can pretend that I ‘refuse to accept evidence’ (ironically, while you refuse to accept that not submitting work for peer review is evidence that one has no solid position in the first place), but you haven’t shown me refusing to accept any. I’ve debunked some, I’ve shown the limitations of other bits, but showing you’re wrong is hardly “refusing to accept”, well, anything. > [@GEEPERS](#): > > I love how you atheists come off like you are the supreme experts in everything. Where did you get your medical degree from again? What was that about bemoaning the terrible, terrible snarky tone? And simply because you’re so politely curious, I received a thorough training in research design and methodology at the University of Texas at Austin. > [@GEEPERS](#): > > Well see I live in the real world where the Bible does contain many fullfilled prophecies. Israel became a nation again. No, it didn’t. The nation of Israel in the Tanakh has only a passing similarity with the modern nation of Israel. Besides, if that’s your best argument, then it’s clear that your “prophecies” are boringly vacuous. “The nation of Israel will be re-imagined and will be established in 1948 by the following people who will fulfill the following roles…” would be an actual prophecy. You don’t have that, do ya? > [@GEEPERS](#): > > Did the Philistines get destroyed? You do realize that isn’t a prophecy, right? First off, the Philistines had already mostly, if not totally been absorbed into surrounding groups and ceased to exist as a distinct entity _before the ‘prophecy’ was written._ Second, “Ethnic group[sub]1000 BCE[/sub] will not exist as Ethnic group[sub]2000 CE[/sub]” is not exactly the sort of clairvoyant prediction we expect from an omnipotent, omniscient God. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/586 "2012-05-23T20:53:53Z")
Besides, my dad doesn’t like The Beatles. If he isn’t a philistine, I don’t know who is. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/587 "2012-05-23T20:54:47Z")
> [@GEEPERS](#): > > I’m not crying. I’m yawning. You are full of hot air. Familiarize yourself with the rules of this board, **GEEPERS**. You are not allowed to make insulting personal comments like “You are full of hot air.” You may not like the way people respond to your claims and characterize your beliefs and arguments, but for the most part you’re allowed to comment on people’s views or their arguments. I am too busy to check if this has already been explained to you because I’m pretty sure it has. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/588 "2012-05-23T20:56:23Z")
Not to mention the extremely dubious tactic of using a story from the bible as an example of the “fulfillment” of some prophecy from the bible. Let’s assume it’s true in order to prove it’s true. Terrific logic, that. But anyway, “…O Canaan, the land of the Philistines, I will even destroy thee, that there shall be no inhabitant.” As quoted, I would say that this prophecy was NOT fulfilled, seeing as there are in indeed still inhabitants of that land once known as “Canaan.” But seriously, using a prophecy that a small group of nomadic people won’t be around in a couple thousand years is what convinces you? That’s pretty weak beer. ---
**Author:** ![GEEPERS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c89c15/32.png) [@GEEPERS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GEEPERS)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/589 "2012-05-23T21:12:55Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > Not to mention the extremely dubious tactic of using a story from the bible as an example of the “fulfillment” of some prophecy from the bible. Let’s assume it’s true in order to prove it’s true. Terrific logic, that. > > But anyway, “…O Canaan, the land of the Philistines, I will even destroy thee, that there shall be no inhabitant.” > > As quoted, I would say that this prophecy was NOT fulfilled, seeing as there are in indeed still inhabitants of that land once known as “Canaan.” But seriously, using a prophecy that a small group of nomadic people won’t be around in a couple thousand years is what convinces you? That’s pretty weak beer. The problem on your end is you can’t demonstrate where a prophecy has failed. The point is it is a distinct characteristic that separates Christianity from Norse religion or your spaghetti monster. Furthermore, God said He would curse any nation that went against Israel and bless those that blessed Israel. Every nation that has gone against Israel has been crushed throughout history - Egypt, Babylon, Assyria, Rome, Nazi Germany The few nations that have befriended Israel such as the United States have enjoyed much prosperity. I find that pretty remarkable and strong beer. Now that my vacation has just started, and I certainly won’t be spending it here. Keep those claws sharpened for fruitless purposes. Maybe I’ll return in another month or so. haha ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/590 "2012-05-23T21:16:06Z")
> [@GEEPERS](#): > > Well see I live in the real world where the Bible does contain many fullfilled prophecies. Like Jesus returning before his aspostles died? Oh wait. That one didn’t happen. Interesting that you’re using a prophecy that comes from the Old Testament, which means it should count as a point for Jews _and_ Christians, but you’re saying it only counts for Team Christian… even though the Jews disagree about the entire Jesus deal and the New Testament contains a significant amount of effort designed to make Jesus fit into older Jewish prophecies (an effort that worked much better on non-Jews than on Jews). Meanwhile, whatever happened to the supernatural stuff? You’ve complained often that you are deluged with questions from atheists, but a lot of people are asking the same thing (nevermind that you sometimes don’t answer questions that have been asked many times). You wouldn’t have to deal with all these “demands” if you answered questions in depth and did not constantly change the subject when you either cannot answer a particular question or just don’t feel like answering it. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/591 "2012-05-23T21:25:18Z")
> [@GEEPERS](#): > > Norse religion doesn’t contain fullfilled prophecies like the Bible. Score one for Christianity! Well, my priest did say that once Loki stole Sif for his amusement, and kept her confined under his bed. But when Thor awoke from his drunken stupor, he found the other side of the bed empty, and he flew into a mighty rage ! He stroke his hammer at the walls, and the windows, and the doors of the village but no one had seen Sif. When he arrived at Loki’s door, he hammered once, he hammered twice, throwing sparks all over Creation and setting cottages on fire, and finally Loki came to open the door and say he had not seen Sif. But Thor wasn’t deceived, for he could see the tears of his beloved flowing between Loki’s toes and into the world below. He struck down his brother, and took back his wife. And so it is that every time you see Sif crying across the skies above (i.e. the rain), you hear Thor’s mighty hammer crashing down (thunder), and throwing sparks (lightning) in a desperate search for his lady love. And every time he will find his beloved under Loki’s bed, and every time he will believe he just saved her from a ghastly fate (wink, wink). And you can take that to the bank, mister. Now. What about the previous holy story\* has not been realized as a prophecy ? What has ? And how do you know it’s not true ? Do you even understand why I’m giving this story, to you, in this thread ? \*Which I just made up. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/592 "2012-05-23T21:29:22Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Like Jesus returning before his aspostles died? Oh wait. That one didn’t happen. Interesting that you’re using a prophecy that comes from the Old Testament, which means it should count as a point for Jews _and_ Christians, but you’re saying it only counts for Team Christian… even though the Jews disagree about the entire Jesus deal and the New Testament contains a significant amount of effort designed to make Jesus fit into older Jewish prophecies (an effort that worked much better on non-Jews than on Jews). > > Meanwhile, whatever happened to the supernatural stuff? You’ve complained often that you are deluged with questions from atheists, but a lot of people are asking the same thing (nevermind that you sometimes don’t answer questions that have been asked many times). You wouldn’t have to deal with all these “demands” if you answered questions in depth and did not constantly change the subject when you either cannot answer a particular question or just don’t feel like answering it. Too late-he’s already flipped us off and left the building. Again. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/593 "2012-05-23T21:30:09Z")
> [@GEEPERS](#): > > Now that my vacation has just started, and I certainly won’t be spending it here. Yeah, we hear that everytime a true believer runs out of steam. You are not the first to break themselves on the rocks of reason and logic. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/594 "2012-05-23T21:30:58Z")
> [@GEEPERS](#): > > Every nation that has gone against Israel has been crushed throughout history - Egypt, Babylon, Assyria, Rome, Nazi Germany Yes, but then every non-modern nation that\* hasn’t\* gone against Israel has also been crushed throughout history, hasn’t it ? The Aztecs, the Picts, Novgorod. All except maybe China. But they’re commies, they bloody well don’t count. > [@](#): > > The few nations that have befriended Israel such as the United States have enjoyed much prosperity. I daresay American prosperity has more to do with the fact that the US spans a very rich, very \*large \*geographic location and has for the last centuries ; over its very recent “friendship” with Israel. ---
**Author:** ![Randvek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a6a055/32.png) [@Randvek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randvek)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/595 "2012-05-23T21:54:30Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > Remind us all, did you have to email an admin to get permission to post here? Are you relegated to a “lol christians!” forum? > No? Unless you maintain that the Straight Dope Message Board is an atheist message board, I don’t see how this is relevant. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/596 "2012-05-23T21:55:18Z")
> [@Randvek](#): > > Unless you maintain that the Straight Dope Message Board is an atheist message board, I don’t see how this is relevant. **GEEPERS** maintains that this is practically or actually an atheist message board. ---
**Author:** ![FixMyIgnorance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7feea3/32.png) [@FixMyIgnorance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FixMyIgnorance)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/597 "2012-05-23T22:09:30Z")
Heh, I didn’t insult GEEPERS at all in my post (perfectly civil response… that is, after all, what he’s thirsting for, according to him) and he chose to ignore my (IMO, strong) points entirely. Hhhmmmmmm. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/598 "2012-05-23T22:16:38Z")
> [@FixMyIgnorance](#): > > Heh, I didn’t insult GEEPERS at all in my post (perfectly civil response… that is, after all, what he’s thirsting for, according to him) and he chose to ignore my (IMO, strong) points entirely. Hhhmmmmmm. Same here… and no response when I PM’d him (in a neighborly way). ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/599 "2012-05-23T22:25:42Z")
I can only assume be him ignoring me as well that he doesn’t like The Beatles. Need we any say anymore? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150/600 "2012-05-23T22:28:51Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > … do you not understand what the word ‘honest’ means? > Do you really think I don’t actually hold the belief that they’re quacks, peddling woo, and not real scientists? Why on Earth would you actually think I’m lying about that? Seriously? **GEEPERS** didn’t actually answer your question, but I suspect he probably _does_ think you are lying. I think he probably belongs to the “everybody knows that there’s a God” faction of Christians who regard their beliefs as “obviously true” and thinks that everyone else _knows_ they are right but opposes them as a deliberate rejection of the “truth”. > [@Marley23](#): > > **GEEPERS** maintains that this is practically or actually an atheist message board. \*\*GEEPERS \*\*appears to think that there are only two kinds of people in the world; “Christians” (defined as “people who agree with **GEEPERS** on all things”), and atheists. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150.md?page=29) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-atheists-think-and-why-in-re-geepers/620150.md?page=31)