# What can a straight man do a gay man can't? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 20, 2012, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849 "2012-07-20T13:44:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/848f3c/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_Dunlop)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/82 "2012-07-23T19:07:16Z")
> [@fumster](#): > > “Aside from getting married what more do gays want” is like saying “Aside from that Mrs. Lincoln, how was the musical theater?” > > Marriage is what allows partners to make medical and funeral decisions, **or visit a sick partner in the hospital** , or automatically inherit an estate. In 2010 President Obama ordered the Department of Health and Human Services to stop any Medicare and Medicaid participating hospitals from discriminating against gay couples (by denying them visitation rights). That includes almost every hospital in the country, with exceptions being hospitals like the Shriner’s Hospitals for Children which don’t require payment and thus don’t participate in Medicare or Medicaid. I don`t mean to imply that gays aren’t discriminated against just because Obama fixed one small injustice but I don’t think it’s very well known so I like to point it out. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/83 "2012-07-23T19:18:45Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](#): > > In 2010 President Obama ordered the Department of Health and Human Services to stop any Medicare and Medicaid participating hospitals from discriminating against gay couples (by denying them visitation rights). That includes almost every hospital in the country, with exceptions being hospitals like the Shriner’s Hospitals for Children which don’t require payment and thus don’t participate in Medicare or Medicaid. > > I don`t mean to imply that gays aren’t discriminated against just because Obama fixed one small injustice but I don’t think it’s very well known so I like to point it out. That’s a good point - but it’s also only secure so long as Obama is president. There’s nothing stopping the next president from reversing it. ---
**Author:** ![D-bear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@D-bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D-bear)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/84 "2012-07-23T20:12:24Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](#): > > In 2010 President Obama ordered the Department of Health and Human Services to stop any Medicare and Medicaid participating hospitals from discriminating against gay couples (by denying them visitation rights). That includes almost every hospital in the country, with exceptions being hospitals like the Shriner’s Hospitals for Children which don’t require payment and thus don’t participate in Medicare or Medicaid. > > I don`t mean to imply that gays aren’t discriminated against just because Obama fixed one small injustice but I don’t think it’s very well known so I like to point it out. Just because it has been ordered, doesn’t mean that Hospitals aren’t turning people away who are not next of kin or immediate family. [CITE](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pR9gyloyOjM) ---
**Author:** ![LurkerInNJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ed655f/32.png) [@LurkerInNJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LurkerInNJ)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/85 "2012-07-23T20:38:35Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Really, though, the biggest issue is that a right of survivorship can only be created at the time of the conveyance. If your partner bought the property before you were together, it’s too late. Do you take “purchased with my partner” to mean anything other than they bought it together? _If I died,_\* the home I have purchased with my partner\*\* could be taken by my family, not my spouse.\* ---
**Author:** ![Kevbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e47774/32.png) [@Kevbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kevbo)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/86 "2012-07-23T22:01:23Z")
As a straight man, I can wear these socks with these pants. A gay man would die of embarrassment if he tried it…well he’d have nightmares and PTSD at least. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/87 "2012-07-23T23:35:26Z")
> [@Kevbo](#): > > As a straight man, I can wear these socks with these pants. A gay man would die of embarrassment if he tried it…well he’d have nightmares and PTSD at least. Psst! Post #20! ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/88 "2012-07-24T01:00:12Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Again, not true. You can leave your house to anyone in a will, and you can buy a house together without being married. (There’s no reason to bring in _named on the mortgag_e as it means nothing in this context). In any case, the exclusion is **$2MM** so, there’s no Federal Estate tax for the 99%. > > Now true, there is a extra exclusion, _on top of that $2MM_, for a primary residence will to a spouse. > > Estate tax is just not a problem for 99% of the people. Gay or straight. 2 million’s not bad. I was going on my experience in the uk, where the threshold is 250,000, which would get you a 2-bedroom flat in london.I have a feeling that it might well not be as simple as you make out in the US, though. I mentioned being named in the mortgage because I’m well aware that people are allowed to buy a home together if they’re not married - my example was of someone who had not bought the house with their partner. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/89 "2012-07-24T05:37:46Z")
> [@LurkerInNJ](#): > > Do you take “purchased with my partner” to mean anything other than they bought it together? > > _If I died,_\* the home I have purchased with my partner\*\* could be taken by my family, not my spouse.\* No, not if you leave it in a will or fix up the deed now so it is done that way. Sure if you die intestate, your partner may have problems. But I can leave my house to my second-best friends hairdressers cousin if I like. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/90 "2012-07-24T05:48:09Z")
> [@raskolnik](#): > > -I need to find a list for the ‘rights of gay men’ (women I’d think are similar but not my issue here) that they, the gay men want, that are denied There are 1,138 rights under federal law (so not including state law) that married heterosexual couples get that homosexual couples can’t because they cannot marry: > [@](#): > > There are 1,138 benefits, rights and protections provided on the basis of marital status in Federal law. [1] Because the Defense of Marriage Act defines “marriage” as only a legal union between one man and one woman, same-sex couples - even if legally married in their state - will not be considered spouses for purposes of federal law. > > The following is a summary of several categories of federal laws contingent upon marital status. > > SOURCE: [http://www.hrc.org/resources/entry/an-overview-of-federal-rights-and-protections-granted-to-married-couples](http://www.hrc.org/resources/entry/an-overview-of-federal-rights-and-protections-granted-to-married-couples) ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/91 "2012-07-24T12:57:42Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > No, not if you leave it in a will or fix up the deed now so it is done that way. Sure if you die intestate, your partner may have problems. But I can leave my house to my second-best friends hairdressers cousin if I like. But isn’t the tax a lot higher if you leave it to your second-best friend’s hairdresser’s cousin than if you leave it to a spouse or child? I have no idea how it is in the US and I’m sure it varies by state (I’ve seen the part about the 2M -let’s say either the house is worth more or there are local taxes with a lower limit), but in Spain the general recomendation is “if you want someone other than a spouse or relative up to second-degree to have something of yours, make it a gift while alive and not a bequest upon death” - because of the taxes. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/92 "2012-07-24T13:14:55Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > But isn’t the tax a lot higher if you leave it to your second-best friend’s hairdresser’s cousin than if you leave it to a spouse or child? I have no idea how it is in the US and I’m sure it varies by state (I’ve seen the part about the 2M -let’s say either the house is worth more or there are local taxes with a lower limit), but in Spain the general recomendation is “if you want someone other than a spouse or relative up to second-degree to have something of yours, make it a gift while alive and not a bequest upon death” - because of the taxes. Yes, but in general the estate has to be worth $2MM, and you can still put a partner on the deed while you’re both alive. Only if your estate exceeds $2MM do things get complicated. And if you think you’re going to have a $2mm estate- then you’re a idiot if you don’t spend some time with a dedicated professional who will fix you up with Trusts, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/93 "2012-07-24T13:17:27Z")
I’m not asking about complicated, I’m asking about expensive. The process to follow if I inherit my mother’s flat is the same as if I inherit my grandmother’s flat, but the first one carries 3% tax; the second one carries 16%. From a spouse it would be the same process, and zero (the registrar’s fee is the same in all three cases). ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/94 "2012-07-24T14:29:31Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Yes, but in general the estate has to be worth $2MM, and you can still put a partner on the deed while you’re both alive. > > Only if your estate exceeds $2MM do things get complicated. And if you think you’re going to have a $2mm estate- then you’re a idiot if you don’t spend some time with a dedicated professional who will fix you up with Trusts, etc. As I pointed out earlier, $2 million is the _federal_ exemption. State estate taxes can kick in as early as $400k (Ohio) or $700k (Rhode Island and New Jersey). > [@Nava](#): > > I’m not asking about complicated, I’m asking about expensive. > > The process to follow if I inherit my mother’s flat is the same as if I inherit my grandmother’s flat, but the first one carries 3% tax; the second one carries 16%. From a spouse it would be the same process, and zero (the registrar’s fee is the same in all three cases). US inheritance taxes are not adjusted based on who you inherit things from. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 9:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/95 "2012-07-25T09:08:51Z")
Thank you, **RNATB** ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 9:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/96 "2012-07-25T09:58:54Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > US inheritance taxes are not adjusted based on who you inherit things from. I’m not sure if I’m reading this wrong, or just misunderstanding the concept. There is a marital deduction for the federal estate tax, you can leave any amount to your spouse with no estate tax. Outside of the marital deduction, there’s no difference, but for a gay person, that difference could be huge. And, it’s a benefit that you can’t duplicate by paying a bunch of money to an estate lawyer. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/97 "2012-07-25T13:04:11Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > As I pointed out earlier, $2 million is the _federal_ exemption. State estate taxes can kick in as early as $400k (Ohio) or $700k (Rhode Island and New Jersey). > > . True, States vary. But Ohio just repealed it’s estate Tax, and NJ allows Same-sex marriage to be considered married for estates. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/98 "2012-07-25T13:07:04Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > I’m not sure if I’m reading this wrong, or just misunderstanding the concept. There is a marital deduction for the federal estate tax, you can leave any amount to your spouse with no estate tax. > > Outside of the marital deduction, there’s no difference, but for a gay person, that difference could be huge. And, it’s a benefit that you can’t duplicate by paying a bunch of money to an estate lawyer. Unlikely. How many people have Estates in the Multi-millions? I mean we start with $2MM, then what with Trusts and etc (which can make have that estate attorney help a lot), you’re getting into Fantasy-land. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/99 "2012-07-25T16:30:35Z")
> [@Montague](#): > > To the guy who pulled out the old saw about everyone being free marry someone of the opposite sex, the answer is I am denied the right extended to a woman to marry a man. Why should she be able to marry a man while I can not? Likewise, a lesbian is denied the right to marry a woman, as i would be able to. Because there is no “right to marry a woman” that is extended to a man but denied to a lesbian. There is only a right to marriage, which is extended to men and women equally. And the legal definition of marriage is “the union of one man and one woman”. Anyone can enter into a marriage as long as it winds up fitting the definition. If you want to change the definition, that’s fine, but don’t assume something is there when it isn’t. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/100 "2012-07-25T16:36:32Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > I’m not sure if I’m reading this wrong, or just misunderstanding the concept. There is a marital deduction for the federal estate tax, you can leave any amount to your spouse with no estate tax. > > Outside of the marital deduction, there’s no difference, but for a gay person, that difference could be huge. And, it’s a benefit that you can’t duplicate by paying a bunch of money to an estate lawyer. Probably should have clarified. I didn’t mention spouses 'cause we were talking about gay people. ---
**Author:** ![Full\_Tilt\_Boogie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/2acd7d/32.png) [@Full\_Tilt\_Boogie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Full_Tilt_Boogie)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/101 "2012-07-26T00:40:36Z")
> [@raskolnik](#): > > **What can a straight man do a gay man can’t?** Voluntarily have sex with a woman? Get married (in most US states)? Have poor dress sense? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849.md?page=6)