# What can a straight man do a gay man can't? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 20, 2012, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849 "2012-07-20T13:44:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![PootyPi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PootyPi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PootyPi)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/102 "2012-07-26T01:26:25Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > Sorry, but the QC is a new deed. I bought a house before I was married, and some years later realized it would be a good idea to have my husband on the deed, so I did a QC. The form I used had two items–joint tenancy with right of survivorship and tenancy in common. It was a cheap do-it-yourself form, and you crossed out that one that didn’t apply. No need for lawyers, unless you needed someone to explain what JTROS meant as opposed to tenancy in common. It was not some magical condition of being married that did it. There are a few states–not Colorado, but a few–that are community property states and things may be different there, although I think not. I think even in one of those states if I bought the place before I was married I would have to take steps to share the ownership with my spouse, or anyone else. In some states, a QC has the choice. It varies. The main point he made was valid still. Most states use tenancy in common in their real estate contracts. A lawyer can often request a joint tenancy, but most people in most states don’t use lawyers, just the contracts. Generally that’s due to them being a boilerplate and the cost of a lawyer. From the same website as Dr Deth’s definition of joint tenancy (which does convey survivorship but is not the common/default tenancy in most states), this is the definition of tenancy in common- [http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/tenancy+in+common](http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/tenancy+in+common) There’s definitely a lot of differences state to state, but it’s safe to say that a marriage, common-law marriage, or civil partnership generally confers more survivorship rights than two single people in an unofficial partnership. Most of the time in most states, people have to redo their wills because it is at least partially nullified by a marriage. But even if a single person puts someone on their will, in many states, children or other family members may have a claim to the undivided interest in the tenancy in common (and other parts of an estate). Of course, it’s not all estates. There’s also the issue of dividing property after a breakup. If it’s a legal marriage/partnership being dissolved, there are laws in place to cover dividing the property. If not, it’s a free for all. That counts for heterosexuals as well, but the difference in many states is that gay people don’t have the option of a legal, official relationship. There’s also the issue of taxes, of course, and as mentioned numerous times, protection against unfair hiring and firing practices, etc. This is my first post. I like how the discussions here are actual discussions, not “You’re a troll! No, you’re a troll!” ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/103 "2012-07-26T01:29:54Z")
> [@Full\_Tilt\_Boogie](#): > > Voluntarily have sex with a woman? We can do that, not that we like too. > [@](#): > > Get married (in most US states)? yeah that’s true > [@](#): > > Have poor dress sense? One night at a gay bar will disprove that myth. ---
**Author:** ![Full\_Tilt\_Boogie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/2acd7d/32.png) [@Full\_Tilt\_Boogie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Full_Tilt_Boogie)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/104 "2012-07-26T01:42:25Z")
> [@boytyperanma](#): > > We can do that, not that we like too. Hence my italicised used of _voluntarily_. 😉 > [@](#): > > yeah that’s true I know. It’s shameful. Over here in Europe, it’s the norm. > [@](#): > > One night at a gay bar will disprove that myth. Apologies: I was being glib. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/105 "2012-07-26T03:29:23Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Probably should have clarified. I didn’t mention spouses 'cause we were talking about gay people. In six states they can get married. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/106 "2012-07-26T04:35:45Z")
I don’t know if it has been brought up already but immigration rights is an area where the difference between straight and gay is stark. In the USA and most countries there is no possible way to bring a same sex partner or spouse into the country to live together. You cannot sponser a same sex partner or spouse for permanent residency or citizenship period. You are simply totally out of luck, where as if straight just get married and follow directions on what forms to file. ---
**Author:** ![wiredbadger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/3be4f8/32.png) [@wiredbadger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wiredbadger)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/107 "2012-07-26T16:52:59Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > You know, I don’t have access to the resources at this moment to check all “civil codes,” but I doubt there are very many statutes specifically barring a person from doing any particular thing due to their sexual orientation. > > And that is a big part of the problem. > > Because, if there is no specific law against it, then any blocks or denial are personal and not institutional. Institutional discrimination is relatively easy to identify and fix, you just need to change the law > > Casual, personal discriminatio is much more difficult. Sexual orientation is not a protected class everywhere, and so it is perfectly legal to deny Gays access to or benefits from any number of things without legal repercussions. > > The problem is not so much that gay people are being legally denied rights, it is that the denial of their rights (based upon sexual orientation) is not specificaly illegal. so it is by the very transparency of this, that such bigotry or whatever word suits can be preformed with no fear. i find that fascinating. legally, loopholes such as this are always stunning. question: what if, say a judge were to rule , that employment were denied or say a service such as patronage at a public restaurant were denied. what if, the victim (lack of better word at the moment) were to demonstrate impeccable proficiency in ability or undeniable prestige, the judge says you are right. hits the mallet, the bad guy loses and the good guy wins. (being the gay person). so now we have precedent? but further to the question would it be necessary to go to that length? what if, by fate it were just somehow amended to female rights. thereby giving the machismo it’s big rush but still conforming to the precept of the law? would it be so vague in either situation? it seems that your idea, albeit probably right on course, would be an endless battle. would gender rights and law be an example template? in answer to the original posters question basically a straight man can assume that anything he is denied was not by sexual preference, other then that there is no difference. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2012, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/108 "2012-07-26T17:01:50Z")
Um… what? ---
**Author:** ![D-bear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@D-bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D-bear)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/109 "2012-07-27T05:45:04Z")
What can a straight man do that a gay man can’t? Live openly without having to worry about being gay-bashed, being a victim of discrimination, being called an abomination. Gay men _ **and** _ women are subject to scorn for being gay. No Straight person is subjected to widespread discrimination for being straight. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/110 "2012-07-27T07:32:22Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Probably should have clarified. I didn’t mention spouses 'cause we were talking about gay people. But that was exactly what my question was about. If you’re gay, yes, you can leave your stuff to your life partner, but it will be penalized vs leaving it to a spouse. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/111 "2012-07-27T13:07:07Z")
> [@D-bear](#): > > What can a straight man do that a gay man can’t? > > Live openly without having to worry about being gay-bashed, being a victim of discrimination, being called an abomination. Gay men _ **and** _ women are subject to scorn for being gay. No Straight person is subjected to widespread discrimination for being straight. Unless of course he’s black, asian, Polish, ugly, has a harelip, has mental issues, is physically handicapped… ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/112 "2012-07-27T13:18:18Z")
Or gets misidentified as gay. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/113 "2012-07-27T14:18:18Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > But that was exactly what my question was about. If you’re gay, yes, you can leave your stuff to your life partner, but it will be penalized vs leaving it to a spouse. In that case, okay, yes. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/114 "2012-07-27T16:12:05Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > But that was exactly what my question was about. If you’re gay, yes, you can leave your stuff to your life partner, but it will be penalized vs leaving it to a spouse. No. Not unless you’re a mutli-millionaire….. who doesn’t have enough brains to hire a good lawyer. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/115 "2012-07-27T16:29:29Z")
_What does a straight that a gay man can’t do What does a straight that a gay man can’t do What does a straight that a gay man can’t do Earl-aye in the morning?_ (Etc.) ---
**Author:** ![Emmalouise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/db5fbb/32.png) [@Emmalouise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emmalouise)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/116 "2012-07-27T18:09:55Z")
In the UK there’s no difference between straight/gay couples legally, and hasn’t been for ten years. I don’t know why it’s taking America so much longer. Well I do, but it’s rude to say. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2012, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/117 "2012-07-27T18:19:39Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Wear _those_ pants with _that_ shirt! Not a right. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2012, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/118 "2012-07-28T01:00:40Z")
> [@Emmalouise](#): > > In the UK there’s no difference between straight/gay couples legally, and hasn’t been for ten years. Straight couples get a legal label called “marriage,” and gay couples get a legal label called “civil partnership.” It might not be of huge consequence (at least domestically\*), but it’s still a legal difference (since it’s a difference created by a law) and it’s deliberately meant to place gay couples on a lower level. \*While it’s not a difference _in_ the UK, I don’t think a British “civil partnership” is treated as a marriage in every country that allows same-sex marriage. ---
**Author:** ![Emmalouise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/db5fbb/32.png) [@Emmalouise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emmalouise)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2012, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/119 "2012-07-28T02:35:22Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > Straight couples get a legal label called “marriage,” and gay couples get a legal label called “civil partnership.” It might not be of huge consequence (at least domestically\*), but it’s still a legal difference (since it’s a difference created by a law) and it’s deliberately meant to place gay couples on a lower level. Spose it could be taken like that, but government didn’t create marriage, it was always a religious union later afforded special rights by law. Government can’t force the church to perform gay marriages, and the church can’t force the government to ban gay partnerships (in the uk), so they compromised kinda with civil partnerships. I say kinda cos really all they got was the word “marriage”. ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2012, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/120 "2012-07-28T03:40:57Z")
> [@Emmalouise](#): > > Spose it could be taken like that, but government didn’t create marriage, it was always a religious union later afforded special rights by law. That statement is not true. Marriage has had legal property rights attached to it since it was first recorded. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2012, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849/121 "2012-07-28T04:02:48Z")
When marriage was first recorded there were no “legal rights” independent of those accorded under the tenets of whatever flavor of religion was prevalent wherever you lived. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-a-straight-man-do-a-gay-man-cant/628849.md?page=7)