# What can we do about Fox News? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 24, 2012, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693 "2012-10-24T03:20:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/121 "2012-10-26T13:46:51Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Not when they have a policy from up high to distort scientific news, and had it for years. > > [http://www.salon.com/2010/12/15/fox\_new\_climate\_memo/](http://www.salon.com/2010/12/15/fox_new_climate_memo/) > > That then leads to just a preponderance of misleading news: > > [Fox News Climate Coverage 93% Wrong, Report Finds | Live Science](http://www.livescience.com/23448-fox-news-climate-coverage-wrong.html) Just to note, you are now bringing up a completely different subject than the one I was discussing, However, most of what Fox (or any cable news channel) broadcasts is commentary, not hard news. As I said earlier, if you force FoxNews to change its name to FoxCommentary, you’ll score a huge victory for the folks who gnash their teeth on this MB about Fox being able to call itself “news”, but you won’t have changed a thing. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/122 "2012-10-26T14:06:48Z")
And \*\*BrokenBriton \*\*seems to make regulation the “no kind of option” IIUC that is just about the opposite to the regulation \*\*adaher \*\*is implying many here are proposing. Indeed those are BBC guidelines, and many here, including me, are not proposing regulation but that news sources use basic guidelines in accuracy in reporting, indeed, a self imposed check against false balance. As for the BBC, those guidelines are part of the big reason many on the internet, even in the USA, looks at the BBC for information and wile independent knowledgeable reviewers are telling us FOX is the pits, reviewers like that give good grades to the BBC **and the BBC does not ignore them, they actually make efforts to get better.** > **[BBC praised for science coverage](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-14218989)** > > BBC science coverage is "high quality" but the corporation must make a distinction "between well-established fact and opinion", a review finds. > [@](#): > > BBC science coverage is of “high quality and significant quantity”, an independent review has found. > > But the report, by genetics professor Steve Jones, said the BBC “must make a distinction between well-established fact and opinion”. > [@](#): > > Writing in a blog, head of newsgathering Fran Unsworth said she was delighted by the report’s praise for the BBC’s science coverage. > > She said Prof Jones’ findings did not mean that “in future we will, for example, not interview climate change sceptics”. > > She said some scientific stories “should be presented as a debate purely and simply within the scientific community”. > > “There will be others when it is appropriate to broadcast a range of views, including some from non-experts, because science cannot be divorced from the social, political and cultural environment in which it operates,” she added. > > On those occasions, the BBC must explain to audiences “whether they are scientists, policy-makers, lobbyists or whether they are taking an ethical stand”. > > She also confirmed the creation of the role of science editor “to bring a new level of analysis to science coverage, strengthen our contacts, and help us to take an overview of our coverage”. As FOX ignores those common sense guidelines one should then ignore FOX, or at least be aware of levels of willful deceit that news network is involved with. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/123 "2012-10-26T14:09:11Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Just to note, you are now bringing up a completely different subject than the one I was discussing, However, most of what Fox (or any cable news channel) broadcasts is commentary, not hard news. As I said earlier, if you force FoxNews to change its name to FoxCommentary, you’ll score a huge victory for the folks who gnash their teeth on this MB about Fox being able to call itself “news”, but you won’t have changed a thing. It is still evidence that indeed the excuse that “News organizations make mistakes all the time.” is a non operative one regarding FOX news, as Nixon would say. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/124 "2012-10-26T14:09:19Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Regulation of news is about the dumbest idea I can imagine. Do lies fall under your definition of “news”? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/125 "2012-10-26T14:15:38Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > It is still evidence that indeed the excuse that “News organizations make mistakes all the time.” is a non operative one regarding FOX news, as Nixon would say. Nope. Fox is going to make mistakes, as all broadcast media do, news or not-news. Teasing out the legit mistakes from the outright lies is simply not so easy to do. In the “D” instead of “R” case, we’re offered 2 examples over a 16 year period. I don’t know how many times it would have to occur before it was obviously a lie, but I’d think it would have to be a lot more than 2. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/126 "2012-10-26T14:18:07Z")
> [@](#): > > As for the BBC, those guidelines are part of the big reason many on the internet, even in the USA, looks at the BBC for information and wile independent knowledgeable reviewers are telling us FOX is the pits, reviewers like that give good grades to the BBC **and the BBC does not ignore them, they actually make efforts to get better.** Correction there: As for the BBC, those guidelines are part of the big reason many on the internet, even in the USA, looks at the BBC for information and while independent knowledgeable reviewers are telling us that FOX is the pits, reviewers like that give good grades to the BBC but there are some areas of concern like the false balance observed in some subjects, **the BBC does not ignore those bad items, they actually make efforts to get better.** ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/127 "2012-10-26T14:20:27Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Nope. Fox is going to make mistakes, as all broadcast media do, news or not-news. Teasing out the legit mistakes from the outright lies is simply not so easy to do. In the “D” instead of “R” case, we’re offered 2 examples over a 16 year period. I don’t know how many times it would have to occur before it was obviously a lie, but I’d think it would have to be a lot more than 2. I already know that, so: Nope, you are now trying to absolve FOX for the lesser deed and ignore the clear evidence for the bigger misdeed that indeed makes a mockery of the idea that what FOX news is doing is just innocent mistakes and after so many years. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/128 "2012-10-26T15:16:17Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Not even strict delineation between news and commentary? The only way to do that is for the government to decide what objective reporting of the news is. Take this recent article on Sandra Fluke: [http://www.rgj.com/article/20121020/NEWS19/310200053/Fluke-takes-center-stage-Reno?gcheck=1&nclick\_check=1](http://www.rgj.com/article/20121020/NEWS19/310200053/Fluke-takes-center-stage-Reno?gcheck=1&nclick_check=1) Sandra Fluke, the woman at the center of a media firestorm earlier this year after Rush Limbaugh called her a “slut,” spoke Saturday in front of about 10 people at the Sak ‘N Save in north Reno. A speaker speaking to 10 people is news? And check out the caption: “Social justice advocate”. REally? I wasn’t aware of Sandra Fluke being anything but an advocate for free contraception. We’ve got two kinds of bias in this article. First, choosing what to report, and second, being especially kind to Fluke by calling her a social justice advocate. In practice, of course, no free country gets this far down into the weeds to regulate the news. Which leaves cherry picking specific cases that are especially controversial or not pursuing cases at all. Most countries seem content to merely have a chilling effect on the free press. No thank you, not here. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/129 "2012-10-26T15:57:13Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > How many times did this happen in the ~16 years Fox has been in business? Maybe it was a lie and maybe it was a mistake. If you can prove it was a lie, please proceed. Just flashing it up there proves nothing. News organizations make mistakes all the time. > [@John\_Mace](#): > > In the “D” instead of “R” case, we’re offered 2 examples over a 16 year period. I don’t know how many times it would have to occur before it was obviously a lie, but I’d think it would have to be a lot more than 2. First, it was three examples: Mark Sanford plus the two below. Second, it wasn’t “over a 16 year period”; the Sanford, Stevens and Foley scandals were just three years apart. Third, you ignore the fact that it never happens the other way around; they’ve never misidentified a Democrat who was in trouble as a Republican, as far as I can tell, or a Republican who _wasn’t_ in trouble as a Democrat. > [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Seriously? Okay. How do [this](http://cloudfront.mediamatters.org/static/images/item/oreilly-foley-d-1.jpg) and [this](http://intershame.com/on/Fox_News/img/art/stevensD456465456475.jpg) work for you? Yes, it’s _possible_ that these are all innocent mistakes. However, since we are not privy to the inner workings of Fox News, it’s pretty ridiculous that you require explicit proof. How are we supposed to obtain that? [QUOTE=adaher] A speaker speaking to 10 people is news? [/QUOTE] It’s local news. You think the Reno Journal-Gazette is biased because it’s reporting things that are going on smack in the middle of its distribution area? This is either the worst attempt at false equivalence ever or… I don’t know, maybe they don’t have local newspapers where you live. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/130 "2012-10-26T16:48:16Z")
It’s not local news even. Do you know how easy it is to get 10 people to listen to you? I’ve seen more people gather round a homeless guy with a Bible doing some preaching. How come that isn’t a news story? There were probably many other events that day that drew more than 10 people and did not get reported on. Anyway, back to Fox, they’ve got a HUGE scoop which will bring down the administration if it’s true. > **[Fox News - Breaking News Updates | Latest News Headlines | Photos & News...](https://www.foxnews.com/)** > > Breaking News, Latest News and Current News from FOXNews.com. Breaking news and video. Latest Current News: U.S., World, Entertainment, Health, Business, Technology, Politics, Sports. And if it’s not, we can talk about that in this thread too. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/131 "2012-10-26T16:53:52Z")
No it won’t. FN has been trotting out Charles Woods all week and nobody cares. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/132 "2012-10-26T16:55:14Z")
Are you saying it won’t because it’s false, or it won’t even if it’s true? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/133 "2012-10-26T16:57:27Z")
Panetta seems to be confirming the Fox story: > **[Panetta: Military lacked enough information to intervene during Benghazi attack](https://www.foxnews.com/politics/panetta-military-lacked-enough-information-to-intervene-during-benghazi-attack)** > > The U.S. military did not quickly intervene during the attack on the U.S. Consulate in Libya last month because military leaders did not have adequate intelligence information and felt they should not put American forces at risk, Defense Secretary... “We didn’t have enough information!” Well excuse me, sometimes you can’t wait six months to do something. I know your boss likes to plan everything over a long period of time, but sometimes the job involves snap decisions. The snap decision made here was wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/134 "2012-10-26T16:59:05Z")
I was saying the latter, but the former works just as well. The article is not exactly balanced. It makes it sound as though it’s a foregone conclusion that the Pentagon could have sent in a gunship because they had one in Italy, for example. ETA: Do you _work_ for Fox News? Panetta is “confirming” the fact that the administration didn’t immediately send military aid. He said nothing about whether any was requested, or whether it was even possible. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/135 "2012-10-26T17:00:36Z")
The issue isn’t what they had available, it’s that they disallowed what was available from coming to his assistance. If this story is true, the CIA team that arrived to help Stevens was disobeying orders. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/136 "2012-10-26T17:03:53Z")
… and were killed, which suggests they probably should have followed them. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/137 "2012-10-26T17:24:24Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The issue isn’t what they had available, it’s that they disallowed what was available from coming to his assistance. If this story is true, the CIA team that arrived to help Stevens was disobeying orders. As Mediamatters reports, FOX is just reaching for new lows. > **[Fox's New Low: Accusing Obama Admin. Of Abandoning Americans To Die In Libya](https://www.mediamatters.org/sean-hannity/foxs-new-low-accusing-obama-admin-abandoning-americans-die-libya)** > > Fox News hosts and contributors repeatedly suggested that the Obama administration made a "political decision" to allow Americans to be killed in the September 11 Benghazi, Libya, attack on an American compound. But U.S. agents and the U.S. Embassy... And FOX’s own annalists are remarking on the low blows, pointing at the schizoid nature of FOX news. > **[Fox Military Analyst Counters Rest Of Network, Denounces "Second Guessing" On...](https://www.mediamatters.org/fox-nation/fox-military-analyst-counters-rest-network-denounces-second-guessing-benghazi-attack)** > > From the October 25 edition of Fox News' Happening Now: > [@](#): > > Fox Military Analyst Counters Rest Of Network, Denounces “Second Guessing” On Benghazi Attack Response > Former NATO Ambassador Adds: “Keep Politics Out Of This” ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/138 "2012-10-26T17:34:02Z")
And this time Crooks & Liars is more relevant than ever at pointing at who is one in this case, these FAUX news crooks do not care if they take whatever “fairness” they claimed they had into the toilet. > **[Fox Baselessly Suggests Obama ‘Traded’ American Lives To Appease Libya](https://crooksandliars.com/news-hound-ellen/fox-baselessly-suggests-obama-tra)** > > Fox’s Peter Johnson, Jr. – a legal analyst who also happens to be Roger Ailes’ personal attorney – visited Fox & Friends this morning to “ask” if President Obama deliberately allowed Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans to > [@](#): > > As the Fox Newsies beat their chests with showy patriotic concern for the deaths of the Americans killed in Libya, they seemed not to care a fig that Ambassador Stevens’ father has spoken out against the politicization of the tragedy and has said that it has no place in the presidential campaign. Apparently, that concern sits on the same dusty Fox News shelf as its concern for the thousands of “expendable” Americans in Iraq who died as part of George W. Bush’s Middle East policy. ---
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/139 "2012-10-26T19:59:55Z")
This is just another example of a manufactured story by Fox. They aren’t covering news, they are creating it. Does anyone think for a second they would have handled it the same way for a Republican president? It pretty much follows the pattern John Stewart talks about. The commentary side of Fox talks about an issue then the news side reports on the controversy. This would have been a noth9ng story if it had happened a year ago, but so close to the election Fox is looking for a gotcha of some sort. The “not calling it terrorism bit” fell flat so they are just trying a new angle. It will work of course, because some number of people will believe it. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693/140 "2012-10-27T15:53:22Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > And this time Crooks & Liars is more relevant than ever at pointing at who is one in this case, these FAUX news crooks do not care if they take whatever “fairness” they claimed they had into the toilet. > > [Fox Baselessly Suggests Obama ‘Traded’ American Lives To Appease Libya | Crooks and Liars](http://crooksandliars.com/news-hound-ellen/fox-baselessly-suggests-obama-tra) I don’t think that’s a valid argument. Stevens wasn’t the only person killed in the attack, and Fox News’ _cause celebre_ is the father of one of the other victims. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-can-we-do-about-fox-news/638693.md?page=8)