# What cancelled 20th/21st Century military system would you have liked to have seen come to fruition? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 25, 2018, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268 "2018-08-25T20:13:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Hapax\_Legomenon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8c91f0/32.png) [@Hapax\_Legomenon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hapax_Legomenon)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/21 "2018-08-27T18:43:14Z")
[Project Habakkuk](http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Habakkuk), the meltable aircraft carrier! Not the world’s most workable idea, but I would have liked to see where commecial shipping went with that for inspiration. ---
**Author:** ![BlueInfinity](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BlueInfinity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlueInfinity)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/22 "2018-08-27T21:58:12Z")
Can I joke and say the bat bombs from World War II? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/23 "2018-08-27T22:01:19Z")
Death Ray. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/24 "2018-08-28T02:17:47Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Death Ray. They cancelled those in the 30s when they went out of style. ---
**Author:** ![Alpha\_Twit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alpha_twit/32/265_2.png) [@Alpha\_Twit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alpha_Twit)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/25 "2018-08-28T03:08:33Z")
Not even close to sexy but I always like the [YC-14](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_YC-14) ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/26 "2018-08-28T03:19:57Z")
> [@Alpha\_Twit](#): > > Not even close to sexy but I always like the [YC-14](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_YC-14) Oh, good memory. I actually saw one of those parked at Boeing Field when the program was underway. I seem to remember reading that the YC-14 was judged superior to the YC-15, but the Air Force decided not to buy either one. Some years later when they did start buying a new cargo aircraft, the C-17 looked like it shared some design DNA with the YC-15. There’s definitely some cool tech being mentioned in this thread. If they couldn’t be built, the next best thing would be to know the inside stories on why they weren’t built. How many of them were technologically sound but fell prey to budgets or politics, and how many of them just didn’t work? ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/27 "2018-08-28T03:33:23Z")
> [@The\_Vorlon](#): > > Just thought of another good one–Project Thor. > > Nothing says loving like a tungsten rod arriving from orbit. > > Rods from God. This is the one that wins. The rest are all just weapons and therefore not a real quantum leap forward. Metal rods spread over a division arriving at orbital speeds? That’s cool beyond the ability of man to comprehend. ---
**Author:** ![Sloe\_Moe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8797f3/32.png) [@Sloe\_Moe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sloe_Moe)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/28 "2018-08-28T03:51:28Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > There’s definitely some cool tech being mentioned in this thread. If they couldn’t be built, the next best thing would be to know the inside stories on why they weren’t built. How many of them were technologically sound but fell prey to budgets or politics, and how many of them just didn’t work? Nothing spurs weapons development more than a real shooting war. Aside from the super battleships I mentioned, the prop-driven fighter planes that would have come out in late 1945 are way up there, surpassing the P-51D and TA-152 by large margins. Example are the Spitfire Mk 22, the US P51 G with a speed of 495 mph, and the Japanese Reppu that could outfight any carrier-based fighter. But with the advent of the jet, development efforts shifted. ---
**Author:** ![Gray\_Ghost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c0e974/32.png) [@Gray\_Ghost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gray_Ghost)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/29 "2018-08-28T05:02:35Z")
> [@Sloe\_Moe](#): > > Nothing spurs weapons development more than a real shooting war. Aside from the super battleships I mentioned, the prop-driven fighter planes that would have come out in late 1945 are way up there, surpassing the P-51D and TA-152 by large margins. Example are the Spitfire Mk 22, the US P51 G with a speed of 495 mph, and the Japanese Reppu that could outfight any carrier-based fighter. But with the advent of the jet, development efforts shifted. The Republic XF-12 wouldn’t have been a shabby bomber/recon plane either. [Republic XF-12 Rainbow - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_XF-12_Rainbow) 400 MPH cruise, 40,000 ceiling, 4,000 nm range. The apotheosis of piston multi-engine propeller aviation. Unfortunately, jets did everything so much better. ---
**Author:** ![steepone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/977dab/32.png) [@steepone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steepone)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/30 "2018-08-28T09:19:15Z")
I would love to have seen the Russian winged tank developed further It probably would never have been practical but it would have been cool as hell > **[Antonov A-40](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonov_A-40)** > > The Antonov A-40 Krylya Tanka (Russian: крылья танка, meaning "tank wings") was a Soviet attempt to allow a tank to glide onto a battlefield after being towed aloft by an airplane, to support airborne forces or partisans. A prototype was built and tested in 1942, but was found to be unworkable. This vehicle is sometimes called the A-40T or KT. > Instead of loading light tanks onto gliders, as other nations had done, Soviet airborne forces had strapped T-27 tankettes underneath heavy bombers and l... ---
**Author:** ![GreedySmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a698b9/32.png) [@GreedySmurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreedySmurf)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/31 "2018-08-28T09:30:06Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > ha! the first thing I thought of in response to just your title was indeed the TSR-2. > > I’ve seen the realm thing at Duxford and it is indeed a badass piece of kit. Very fresh-looking for a 60 year old design. At least it flew though. I was actually at Duxford on Sunday, and it was the first time I’d heard of the TSR. In terms of not looking old, my first glance at it across the crowded hanger, I thought it might have been a B-1 Lancer. (Why it wouldn’t have been in the American hangar I didn’t know ) ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/32 "2018-08-28T18:53:58Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > I always wanted to see the RAH-66 Comanche fielded. There really hasn’t been a true scout helicopter for decades. > > [Boeing–Sikorsky RAH-66 Comanche - Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing%E2%80%93Sikorsky_RAH-66_Comanche) Interestingly, at the time the Comanche was conceived, the emphasis was on it being a one-seater, explicitly – that was part of what would make it a desirable addition to the two-seater helicopters already in service. Half the personnel at risk, half the human resources expenses, less weight, longer range, and the second operator’s workload farmed out to computers. But somewhere in the process it was decided to make it a two-seater – a decision which immediately called the entire concept into question. One of the crises the development program went through in 2000: > [@](#): > > During late 2000, it was revealed that an effort to reduce the Comanche’s empty weight by approximately 200 lb (91 kg) or 2.1 per cent in order to conform with its established target weight had been initiated.[6] Isn’t that roughly the weight of a second operator? ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/33 "2018-08-28T23:36:31Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The A-10B Thunderbolt II. The A-10A was supposed to only be the first generation of this plane. The follow-up design, which made it all the way through prototype flights, had two seats and a much more sophisticated electronic package. Now that I didn’t know, still for all its simplicity they still haven’t quite managed to kill the A-10A off yet. > [@Velocity](#): > > Maybe not in the vein of what the OP means, but it is a shame the YF-23 didn’t win the ATF. I agree with you on that, I’m sure the F-22 is a fantastic plane but look-wise at least its positively mundane compared to the YF-23. Coincidentally someone showed me this rather striking picture earlier today: [https://www.pinterest.co.uk/pin/450641506443605774/](https://www.pinterest.co.uk/pin/450641506443605774/) (Chuck Yeager and YF-23) And on checking wikipedia apparently he’s still alive! I wonder what he thinks of the current generation of fighters? > [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > ha! the first thing I thought of in response to just your title was indeed the TSR-2. > > I’ve seen the realm thing at Duxford and it is indeed a badass piece of kit. Very fresh-looking for a 60 year old design. At least it flew though. Very true, though the TSR-2 is just one part of an object lesson in how a country can through away a world-leading industry, Britain went from fielding not one but three world class nuclear bombers in the 1950’s to, well… > [@Loach](#): > > I always wanted to see the RAH-66 Comanche fielded. There really hasn’t been a true scout helicopter for decades. > > [Boeing–Sikorsky RAH-66 Comanche - Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing%E2%80%93Sikorsky_RAH-66_Comanche) That reminds me of the Cheyenne, it would be interesting to see what it would have turned into with a few more generations of development. > **[Lockheed AH-56 Cheyenne](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_AH-56_Cheyenne)** > > The Lockheed AH-56 Cheyenne is an attack helicopter developed by Lockheed for the United States Army. It rose from the Army's Advanced Aerial Fire Support System (AAFSS) program to field the service's first dedicated attack helicopter. Lockheed designed the Cheyenne using a four-blade rigid-rotor system and configured the aircraft as a compound helicopter with low-mounted wings and a tail-mounted thrusting propeller driven by a General Electric T64 turboshaft engine. The Cheyenne was to have ... Actually that would be a potentially interesting and fun Cold War story, with all the military hardware that was cancelled being fielded and those that were fielded in our timeline/reality being cancelled. ---
**Author:** ![Gray\_Ghost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c0e974/32.png) [@Gray\_Ghost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gray_Ghost)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2018, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/34 "2018-08-28T23:53:19Z")
> [@Atomic\_Alex](#): > > …That reminds me of the Cheyenne, it would be interesting to see what it would have turned into with a few more generations of development. > > [Lockheed AH-56 Cheyenne - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_AH-56_Cheyenne) > > Actually that would be a potentially interesting and fun Cold War story, with all the military hardware that was cancelled being fielded and those that were fielded in our timeline/reality being cancelled. The TSR reminded me more of a A-5 Vigilante than anything else. Beautiful a/c, but my God, if the F-111 had teething pains with near Mach 1.0 flight on the deck, I’m not sure how an a/c 10-15 years earlier would do any better. The Cheyenne—and it is a gorgeous helicopter, with outstanding speed—unfortunately would have flown its missions right in the heart of the envelope of a bunch of Soviet AAA and low altitude SAM systems, like SA-8, 2S6, 2K22/SA-19, and a slew of others. N.O.T.E. is where it was at, and preferably deploying weapons while sitting behind a terrain feature while some other system/sight did the designating. The Russians built an awful lot of AAA machinery to kill anything aircraft related that had the misfortune of letting itself get seen by said machinery. As for the Comanche, it was a dumb decision, although it can be argued the Army has never really valued scout aircraft, like the Kiowa, Bronco, or Mohawk like they should’ve. Maybe nowadays, their work can be replaced by a distributed surveillance net of interlinked drones. Or maybe, the Army figures that things like the Reaper and it’s stealthier cousins will be enough. I think they’re really going to regret getting rid of the institutional memory of the Cav air scout community with getting rid of the Kiowas, and not getting them sufficient survivable replacements like the Comanche. One seat was kind of silly though. There’s just too much stuff to do, and too many things to watch out for at low level, for one person to handle it all. Maybe AI will solve that problem too. ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2018, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/35 "2018-08-29T00:32:39Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > The TSR reminded me more of a A-5 Vigilante than anything else. Beautiful a/c, but my God, if the F-111 had teething pains with near Mach 1.0 flight on the deck, I’m not sure how an a/c 10-15 years earlier would do any better. > > \<\> > > I think they’re really going to regret getting rid of the institutional memory of the Cav air scout community with getting rid of the Kiowas, and not getting them sufficient survivable replacements like the Comanche. One seat was kind of silly though. There’s just too much stuff to do, and too many things to watch out for at low level, for one person to handle it all. Maybe AI will solve that problem too. The Soviets kind of went for a Cheyenne type helicopter with the Mi-24 didn’t they? Did they think it would be more survivable in the NATO air defence environment? And I didn’t know the Kiowa had been done away with, seems a strange decision definitely. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2018, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/36 "2018-08-29T07:23:59Z")
> [@Atomic\_Alex](#): > > Very true, though the TSR-2 is just one part of an object lesson in how a country can through away a world-leading industry, Britain went from fielding not one but three world class nuclear bombers in the 1950’s to, well… quite, we did that a lot with our post-war technological advances. For a country that maximised the benefits of the industrial revolution we did very poorly with 20th century innovations. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2018, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/37 "2018-08-29T07:54:41Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > The TSR reminded me more of a A-5 Vigilante than anything else. Beautiful a/c, but my God, if the F-111 had teething pains with near Mach 1.0 flight on the deck, I’m not sure how an a/c 10-15 years earlier would do any better. Apparently not. It was a great machine in the air. The first time it went supersonic it did so on one afterburner and an F3 Lightning couldn’t keep up without lighting both. Top speed would certainly have been approaching mach 2.5 and the teething troubles lay elsewhere with fuel pumps and landing gear rather than any airborne qualities. Sadly it did lack the most important qualities of all, frugality and political backing. ---
**Author:** ![Sloe\_Moe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8797f3/32.png) [@Sloe\_Moe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sloe_Moe)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2018, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/38 "2018-08-29T08:34:18Z")
Question: how come the turretless design for MBT’s didn’t catch on? During the '80s i recall the UK, West Germany, and the USSR were experimenting. The last cold war Soviet design i recall was a monster turretless design with a 155mm gun (scaled down to 135mm). The frontal armor would have had enough ceramic armor to defeat any kinetic sabot round, while the sides and back were chock-full of reactive armor. The gun could fire full caliber HEAT, sabot, and sub-caliber “cannon ball” rounds capable of cracking hard brittle armor. The article mentioned the (US) army will now consider installing depleted uranium armor on to the M-1 Abrams. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2018, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268/39 "2018-08-29T08:38:15Z")
I first remwmber XM8 and OICW. Probably not the best project; seemed innovative at the time. But it filled pop culture for awhile, especially in video games. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-cancelled-20th-21st-century-military-system-would-you-have-liked-to-have-seen-come-to-fruition/820268.md?page=1)