# What comes to mind when you hear the phrase 'moral turpitude'? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 30, 2024, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979 "2024-04-30T18:48:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/1 "2024-04-30T18:48:55Z")
The question is in the thread title - when you hear the phrase ‘moral turpitude’, what comes to mind? ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/2 "2024-04-30T18:51:45Z")
Turpentine ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/3 "2024-04-30T18:52:29Z")
A great weekend, followed by possible job/endorsement contract loss. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/4 "2024-04-30T18:54:38Z")
In the context in which I’ve mostly heard it, it brings to mind a nonsense phrase used by US Immigration (now Customs and Border Protection) to exclude people they don’t like. An example that comes to mind from many years ago was a prominent Canadian psychologist who was permanently banned from the US for having once authored a paper suggesting that LSD may have therapeutic benefits in treating certain types of mental disorders. Apparently that was “moral turpitude”. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/5 "2024-04-30T18:56:36Z")
“That person does things I don’t approve of, and has no shame about it.” Because it is so non-specific, I tend to think it is being used to cover milder pecadillos, and by a rather uptight person. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/6 "2024-04-30T19:00:28Z")
The old visa and green card forms I had to sign when I first came to the States. They changed before I got citizenship but for a long time they sounded somewhere between a Victorian purity pledge and a macarthy era loyalty oath. Lots of “have you committed a crime of moral turpitude”, “ever been a sexual deviant”, “ever been a member of the communist party”, and (60 years after the fall of the third Reich) “did you commit any war cimes for the Nazis between 1933 and 1945” ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/7 "2024-04-30T19:03:22Z")
An egregious, deliberate offense that shocks the conscience of a reasonable person or professional community. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/8 "2024-04-30T19:07:11Z")
Well, I looked up “turpitude”: A _corrupt or depraved or degenerate act or practice_ So, “moral” seems redundant. What other kind of “turpitude” could one have if not “moral”? ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/9 "2024-04-30T19:08:31Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > So, “moral” seems redundant. What other kind of “turpitude” could one have if not “moral”? Is it a [legal doublet](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_doublet)? ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/10 "2024-04-30T19:14:03Z")
I conflated “turpid” and “turbid” for years. I now remember they’re different words, but have to look up which is which. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/11 "2024-04-30T19:17:24Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > Is it a [legal doublet](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_doublet)? Very interesting, thanks! I don’t know if this quite matches the description given for a “legal doublet”. I looked up “redundant phrases”, and I think this matches that. Examples: advance warning end result actual fact added bonus basic essentials free gift comp[etely annihilate unexpected surprise ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/12 "2024-04-30T20:14:49Z")
Burgess Meredith as the Penguin. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/13 "2024-04-30T20:17:12Z")
A bullshit charge added to other bullshit charges. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/14 "2024-04-30T20:26:12Z")
A scene with Kim Cattrall from **Porky’s**. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/15 "2024-04-30T21:35:23Z")
Came here to say that. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/16 "2024-04-30T21:40:59Z")
Wouldn’t a redundant phrase be _immoral_ turpitude? Moral turpitude is an oxymoron. When you think about it. But what comes to mind today is Kristi Noem. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/17 "2024-04-30T21:43:42Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > Wouldn’t a redundant phrase be _immoral_ turpitude? Moral turpitude is an oxymoron. When you think about it. Not at all. “Moral turpitude” is to distinguish it from the turpitude used to thin paint. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/18 "2024-04-30T21:50:40Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > Not at all. “Moral turpitude” is to distinguish it from the turpitude used to thin paint. You mean porpentine. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/19 "2024-04-30T21:55:52Z")
Ah! My bad. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979/20 "2024-04-30T22:02:18Z")
Contract law, specifically the sort of morality clauses Hollywood stars used to sign with the studios that allowed the studios to fire them for scandal. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-comes-to-mind-when-you-hear-the-phrase-moral-turpitude/1000979.md?page=2)