# What could kill off fictional inland seagulls? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 30, 2007, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712 "2007-07-30T17:36:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![pigeon\_sandwich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4491bb/32.png) [@pigeon\_sandwich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pigeon_sandwich)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/21 "2007-07-31T02:58:20Z")
Oh dear, no seagulls? I’m having a Santa Claus moment. It sounds like poisoning-of-some-sort is my best bet. (The last time they let me borrow the death ray, it didn’t end well). Another question: What about pelicans? I know they can be found inland as well, but I think they’d be sufficiently-unusual in this particular setting. Anyway, I seem to hear a lot about them dying in large numbers, so it seems promising. If they ended up in the middle of farm country (far from any lakes or ponds), would it be likely for them to die of malnutrition? (I’m thinking of something like: [http://en.greenmedia.md/?p=49](http://en.greenmedia.md/?p=49) ) Thanks all! This has been a great help. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/22 "2007-07-31T03:04:29Z")
Well, in Kansas, at [Cheyenne Bottoms](http://www.cheyennebottoms.net/index.html) (In [Barton County](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barton_County%2C_Kansas), the center of the state) you can find more than one kind of [seabird](http://www.cheyennebottoms.net/b_w_birdlist.html). Of course, Cheyenne Bottoms is a wetlands of [international](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramsar_list_of_wetlands_of_international_importance#United_States) importance too, and birds from all over the world can be seen there, it’s a stopover during migrations. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/23 "2007-07-31T03:40:39Z")
Adding, the seagulls are around yearlong though. They are found in garbage dumps and at lakes. ---
**Author:** ![whistlepig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/73ab20/32.png) [@whistlepig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whistlepig)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/24 "2007-07-31T04:17:58Z")
[QUOTE=Yllaria] The Utah thing was considered to be a miracle. I don’t think they usually get that far inland, or at least they didn’t in pre-landfill days. [/QUOTE] It was a “miracle” because they ate the crickets, not that they were inland. Here in Helena, Montana, we have California Least Gulls all over the place. whistlepig ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/25 "2007-07-31T04:21:46Z")
Strict enforcement of anti-noise laws? [sub]squawky little bastards…[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/26 "2007-07-31T07:30:10Z")
[QUOTE=Telemark] Not by people who know birds. 🙂 From my National Geographic Field Guide to the Birds of North America: [/quote] Sure, and as I said, ‘organic’ means something distinct to people who know chemistry. That doesn’t mean the word has just the one meaning, or that the experts in a field that happens to use a specific definition of it are appointed to police their usage. > [@](#): > > There is no species or family known as a seagull. Many are commonly called that, but we’re here to fight ignorance. I know, it’s a lost battle, but I also correct people who say all evergreens are “pine trees”. It’s not ignorance, it’s just people using a colloquial term. (in this case, one that’s been established for centuries). You’re not fighting ignorance, you’re fighting the dictionary. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/27 "2007-07-31T12:26:56Z")
[QUOTE=Mangetout] You’re not fighting ignorance, you’re fighting the dictionary. [/QUOTE] I disagree, but it’s not something I stay up nights worrying about. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/28 "2007-07-31T12:50:41Z")
Have gulls always lived inland, or are they expanding their range? I don’t recall ever seeing them as a kid (in the Chattanooga area), but I see them on a regular basis these days. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/29 "2007-07-31T18:59:36Z")
We have california gulls (very common, especially in large parking lots) and curlew sandpipers (less common) here in Havre, Montana, which is as landlocked as you could imagine. (Yes, Havre means ‘Harbor’ in French. One of the grandmothers of a founder was from Le Havre, France. Does’t really mean anything, and it certainly isn’t pronounced that way. (Or that way, either.)) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/30 "2007-07-31T23:02:56Z")
Many species of gulls and terns nest inland. In particular, Franklin’s Gulls nest on lakes, ponds and marshes in the Great Plains. [QUOTE=Mangetout] It’s not ignorance, it’s just people using a colloquial term. (in this case, one that’s been established for centuries). You’re not fighting ignorance, you’re fighting the dictionary. [/QUOTE] You are correct that it is a common colloquial name for the group of birds, but **Fact of the Matter** is also correct that it is a misnomer. Many people call Turkey Vultures “buzzards,” so that can be considered an actual name for the bird; but Turkey Vultures have nothing to do with the true buzzards of the genus _Buteo_. So it’s a name, but not an accurate name. [QUOTE=spoke-] Have gulls always lived inland, or are they expanding their range? I don’t recall ever seeing them as a kid (in the Chattanooga area), but I see them on a regular basis these days. [/QUOTE] Many species have always occurred inland. However, Herring Gulls and other species have greatly increased in population in some areas due to the availability of food in landfills, etc., and this may be the reason you are seeing more now. [QUOTE=pigeon sandwich] Another question: What about pelicans? I know they can be found inland as well, but I think they’d be sufficiently-unusual in this particular setting. [/quote] Most species of pelicans actually nest inland on freshwater or saline lakes, including the American White Pelican, although they often winter on coasts. The only really marine species is the Brown Pelican. > [@](#): > > Anyway, I seem to hear a lot about them dying in large numbers, so it seems promising. This may be due to things like red tides (toxic algae) or disease. Pelicans may also sometimes starve due to climatic factors such as El Nino events, which affect their food supply. > [@](#): > > If they ended up in the middle of farm country (far from any lakes or ponds), would it be likely for them to die of malnutrition? Since pelicans feed mainly on fish, yes. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/31 "2007-07-31T23:10:54Z")
[QUOTE=Colibri] You are correct that it is a common colloquial name for the group of birds, but **Fact of the Matter** is also correct that it is a misnomer. Many people call Turkey Vultures “buzzards,” so that can be considered an actual name for the bird; but Turkey Vultures have nothing to do with the true buzzards of the genus _Buteo_. So it’s a name, but not an accurate name. [/QUOTE] Such is the nature of colloquial terms, indeed, such is the nature of language. Yes, it’s not a technically accurate term (but then, it isn’t even meant to be), but it’s hardly alone in that, and it’s so well established (the online etymology site dates it to 1542. It’s a little late to be fighting over whether it’s a word we can rightly use. I mean, where are the folks campaigning to call _Malaria_ by its proper name? - that one has only been around since the 1730s - the disease isn’t really caused by bad air. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/32 "2007-07-31T23:33:59Z")
[QUOTE=Mangetout] Such is the nature of colloquial terms, indeed, such is the nature of language. Yes, it’s not a technically accurate term (but then, it isn’t even meant to be), but it’s hardly alone in that, and it’s so well established (the online etymology site dates it to 1542. It’s a little late to be fighting over whether it’s a word we can rightly use. [/QUOTE] I do understand your point. _My_ point was that **Fact of the Matter** is also correct in that the name is a misnomer, and misleading (since it obviously has mislead the OP and others). Sure, people are free to call gulls seagulls, and Turkey Vultures buzzards; but if you \*do \* want to be precise, and have your meaning clearly understood, the former terms are preferred (though not mandatory). Don’t even get me started on moose, elk, and wapiti, or on monkeys and apes. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2007, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/33 "2007-07-31T23:38:44Z")
I agree that when precision is required, precise terms are necessary. ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2007, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/34 "2007-08-01T00:22:49Z")
[QUOTE=Derleth] We have california gulls (very common, especially in large parking lots) [/QUOTE] Careful, you don’t want to get the californiagulls - parkinggulls debate going. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2007, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/35 "2007-08-01T06:05:51Z")
From Google scholar: [http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list\_uids=5417461&dopt=Citation](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=5417461&dopt=Citation) Cloacal and salt-gland ion excretion in the seagull, Larus glaucescens, acclimated to increasing concentrations of sea water. [http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1046/j.1365-2672.1999.00666.x](http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1046/j.1365-2672.1999.00666.x) Occurrence and numbers of bacteriophages and bacterial indicators in faeces of yellow-legged seagull (Larus cachinnans) Life History Biology of the Desert Nesting Seagull Larus Modestus Mediation and mechanisms of the hypotensive effect of L-dopa in the sea-gull: Larus argentatus. THE EMBRYONAL DEVELOPMENT OF THE ADRENAL GLANDS IN THE SEA GULL (LARUS CANUS L.) Reproductive Consequences of El Nino-Southern Oscillation in Gray Gulls (Larus modestus) I got 261 scientific papers using the term “seagull” and _Larus_. (the principle genus of gulls). _But_, I got over 10,000 hits for “gull + Larus”. So, yes the term “seagull” is \*sometimes \*used in the scientific community but “gull” is _far_ more prefered. The word “gull” comes from ME around 1400 or so. I found "seagull’ first used around 1535, a hundred years later or so. Can we get back to the OP now? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2007, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/36 "2007-08-01T07:37:21Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] Can we get back to the OP now? 😛 [/QUOTE] I thought we already had. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2007, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712/37 "2007-08-01T14:01:58Z")
[QUOTE=Sapo] Careful, you don’t want to get the californiagulls - parkinggulls debate going. [/QUOTE] I wish they all could be California gulls. Because then they wouldn’t be in Montana. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-kill-off-fictional-inland-seagulls/413712.md?page=1)