# What Could Ronald Reagan Have Done \[About AIDS\]? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 7, 2004, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085 "2004-06-07T12:16:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2004, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/81 "2004-06-08T23:40:13Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > I’m implying nothing. I’m saying that RR obviously had prejudices. I’m making a point that we ALL have prejudices, and that said prejudices could be our own blindspot. > > How you people are reading into this that I’m equating Nazism with Gay behavior is beyond me. Is this a knee jerk reaction, or is my post really that hard to understand?? I have a question, **X**. What was your problem with my original example of “Christians”? Is that not something someone could be prejudiced against? Did that not paint a picture of my point (which you seem to be ignoring) being that Reagan’s actions were basically a hate crime, and if it had happened to a different group of people, he would have done a helluva lot more? ---
**Author:** ![pervert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@pervert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pervert)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2004, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/82 "2004-06-08T23:42:32Z")
> [@GLWasteful](#): > > **pervert** : Fair enough, I’ll ask them. Although, “Just Say No to Gay Sex,” is not what anyone was thinking. Something more along the lines of what **elucidator** has proposed. Y’know, a simple declaration that those lost mattered. Simple as that. And no, I’m not naive enough to think that a simple statement would have seen Reagan crowned with laurels and hosannahs singing praise to his name. But I still maintain that he wouldn’t have been as widely despised as he was. Fair enough. I’ll agree with you. I think that fewer people would be pissed if he had said something earlier. At the same time, I think the number would have been irrelevant. We would still have had this thread. There still would have been almost no one willing to say “Well, what could he have done, give him a break”. But all in all, your right. He could have, and probably should have, shown support for a part of the population which was really scared. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2004, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/83 "2004-06-08T23:46:12Z")
> [@pervert](#): > > At the same time, I think the number would have been irrelevant. We would still have had this thread. There still would have been almost no one willing to say “Well, what could he have done, give him a break”. The difference is, the people defending him would have some justification other than, “he didn’t have the cure, what could he do (besides education and awareness)?” ---
**Author:** ![pervert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@pervert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pervert)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2004, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/84 "2004-06-08T23:46:54Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > Yes, that’s right, he could have launched campaigns talking about what AIDS is, what it does, how it is transmitted, and made means of stoppign AIDS available. When could he have done this? Look back at the history of AIDS link I posted a while ago. Or simply google up one of your own. For several years at the begining of the AIDS crisis, no one knew what aids was where it came from, or how it was spread. What could he have said in 1981 that would even have been coherent? ---
**Author:** ![GLWasteful](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f05b48/32.png) [@GLWasteful](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GLWasteful)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2004, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/85 "2004-06-08T23:49:52Z")
**xtisme** : > [@](#): > > Lets make the scenerio a bit more realistic Zagadka. Say you are president of the US. A mysterious disease strikes but seems to be killing only Nazi’s and KKK members, and the indications are that it seems to be killing them because of their hating behavior. Oh, man. Yer killing me here. **More** realistic? The above scenario? Why not get off the dime and answer the question that **Zagadka** asked in the first place? (A question, I must say, that involves a scenario at least as ludicrous as the above. However, to say that you are making a situation more realistic and then propose the the anal leakage that you did. . .well, I’m still chuckling.) And to answer your lame-assed question. I don’t know what I would do. Conversely, if the hypothetical proposed by **Zagadka** had occured, I feel comfortable saying that people would march on the White House with pitchforks. Rightly. 'Samatter of fact, if that happened, I would be helping out in any way I could, and I’m an atheist. The very fucking least that the president could do is to say, "My heart is heavy at this time of much pain and suffering by those in the heartland. A nations thoughts and prayers go out to them, blah blah blah. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2004, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/86 "2004-06-08T23:52:12Z")
> [@pervert](#): > > When could he have done this? Look back at the history of AIDS link I posted a while ago. Or simply google up one of your own. For several years at the begining of the AIDS crisis, no one knew what aids was where it came from, or how it was spread. What could he have said in 1981 that would even have been coherent? What could Bush have said the morning of 9/11? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/87 "2004-06-09T00:05:06Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > I have a question, X. What was your problem with my original example of “Christians”? Is that not something someone could be prejudiced against? Did that not paint a picture of my point (which you seem to be ignoring) being that Reagan’s actions were basically a hate crime, and if it had happened to a different group of people, he would have done a helluva lot more? Its probably escaped you, but Christians make up a majority in the country. If any president did what you are implying he’d be impeached in about a min. Its that democracy thing, you know? So your example was, you know, a bad one. The reason I picked Nazi’s and KKK members was I was reasonably sure it was something you didn’t approve of. Any fringe group would have worked. -XT ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/88 "2004-06-09T00:10:40Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > Its probably escaped you, but Christians make up a majority in the country. If any president did what you are implying he’d be impeached in about a min. Its that democracy thing, you know? Good point. How about… I dunno. What makes up 10% of the population (apparently making it OK to ignore the extinction of)… I mean, this is all COMPLETELY ignoring the fact that AIDS potentially threatened everyone in the county who had sex. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/89 "2004-06-09T00:15:53Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > Its probably escaped you, but Christians make up a majority in the country. If any president did what you are implying he’d be impeached in about a min. Its that democracy thing, you know? > > So your example was, you know, a bad one. The reason I picked Nazi’s and KKK members was I was reasonably sure it was something you didn’t approve of. Any fringe group would have worked. I know, I have it! What if a skyscraper carrying 3,000 people collapsed, and the President didn’t say anything? Oooh, what if 10,000 people in Tempe, Arizona mysteriously died from an unknown disease? Are any of these cases “OK” for the President to ignore? In fact, you admitted above that should a small portion of the Christian population die by freak accident, “if any president did what you are implying he’d be impeached in about a min” - so why the hell wasn’t Reagan, and why is everyone busy kissing his ass now? ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/90 "2004-06-09T00:20:59Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > I’m implying nothing. I’m saying that RR obviously had prejudices. And if he was so prejudiced against gay people that he viewed them as unworthy of compassion, then he deserves to be criticized (and even hated) for that prejudice. ---
**Author:** ![pervert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@pervert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pervert)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/91 "2004-06-09T01:20:33Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > What could Bush have said the morning of 9/11? I sincerely hope you understand the problem with the analogy you just made. ---
**Author:** ![pervert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@pervert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pervert)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/92 "2004-06-09T01:26:24Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > And if he was so prejudiced against gay people that he viewed them as unworthy of compassion, then he deserves to be criticized (and even hated) for that prejudice. To some extent, sure. Do you have even the smallest shred of evidence that he though this way? ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/93 "2004-06-09T01:27:40Z")
> [@pervert](#): > > I sincerely hope you understand the problem with the analogy you just made. What? All Bush could have (and did) say that morning was express sympathy for the people, promise to find out what happened and bring justice to whoever did it. Reagan could have made similar statements regarding AIDS. While Bush may not have been able to do much in those first few hours of 9/11 - everyone was in something of a panic and we needed to hear SOMETHING that it was being controlled. Do you think people would be justifying it if Bush had waited 3 days before letting anyone in the government say or do anything about 9/11? What if AIDS was a Soviet biological attack? Would Reagan have reacted any faster or slower then? ---
**Author:** ![pervert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@pervert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pervert)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/94 "2004-06-09T01:27:57Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > The difference is, the people defending him would have some justification other than, “he didn’t have the cure, what could he do (besides education and awareness)?” I have to laugh at this. Thank you very much. The idea that any defense is necessary for some of the hateful things you have been posting here and other Reagan bashing threads is very amusing. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/95 "2004-06-09T01:28:51Z")
> [@pervert](#): > > To some extent, sure. Do you have even the smallest shred of evidence that he though this way? You’re kidding, right? You must be. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/96 "2004-06-09T01:30:04Z")
> [@pervert](#): > > I have to laugh at this. Thank you very much. The idea that any defense is necessary for some of the hateful things you have been posting here and other Reagan bashing threads is very amusing. 😉 Cite? ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/97 "2004-06-09T01:37:00Z")
> [@pervert](#): > > To some extent, sure. Do you have even the smallest shred of evidence that he though this way? Other than his documented actions, or lack thereof? By what possible other reason could they be explained? And **xtisme** , if I understand you correctly, basically you’re saying that Reagan ignored it because his personal prejudices prevented him from doing so. I’m glad we’re in agreement, except about the part where I find that reprehensible. ---
**Author:** ![pervert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@pervert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pervert)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/98 "2004-06-09T01:47:23Z")
> [@matt\_mcl](#): > > Other than his documented actions, or lack thereof? By what possible other reason could they be explained? Sure. There were not any viable actions he could have taken before about 1983 or so at the latest. Remember, no one was sure what this thing was for quite some time. Now, it took him some time to do anything about it after this. I agree with **xtisme** that the most probable cause of this is that he could not get his head wraped around the problem. But I have to repeat the OP. His lack of actions implies that there were actions he could have taken. Can you name them? Remember you have to give time frames. It is not enough to say that so many thousands of people died when such a number was not obvious until after he left office. If you say that he should have said something, you need to include when he could have said it. You may have to include some background information on how widespread the crisis was at the point you are talking about. But, **MaxTheVool** ’s contention that “And if he was so prejudiced against gay people that he viewed them as unworthy of compassion, then he deserves to be criticized (and even hated) for that prejudice.” while true as a conditional, needs some other evidence before you can say it has been satisfied. ---
**Author:** ![pervert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@pervert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pervert)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/99 "2004-06-09T01:51:49Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > What? All Bush could have (and did) say that morning was express sympathy for the people, promise to find out what happened and bring justice to whoever did it. > > Reagan could have made similar statements regarding AIDS. Again, when? Remember, AIDS was a very puzzling syndrome for quite a long time. It was not even obviously contagious for at least a year. After that, it was not clear how it was passed on. This is the essential characteristic of the two tragedies that you miss. One was obvious and sudden. The other was hidden and over an extended period. Remember, lest we forget, the AIDS epidemic started in the mid to late 70s! ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085/100 "2004-06-09T01:52:36Z")
> [@pervert](#): > > Sure. There were not any viable actions he could have taken before about 1983 or so at the latest. And the next 4 years he was what, waiting for his speech writer to get off the can? > [@](#): > > the most probable cause of this is that he could not get his head wraped around the problem. Granted, he was pretty stupid. > [@](#): > > His lack of actions implies that there were actions he could have taken. Can you name them? Remember you have to give time frames. Um, yes… he could have followed roughly the same course as the Berkeley Free Clinic. SURELY the Federal Government had the resources to - OH WAIT! That’s right, they DIDN’T INVESTIGATE IT AS MUCH AS THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN BECAUSE REAGAN SAT ON IT. Whew, that one almost slipped by us! > [@](#): > > But, **MaxTheVool** ’s contention that “And if he was so prejudiced against gay people that he viewed them as unworthy of compassion, then he deserves to be criticized (and even hated) for that prejudice.” > while true as a conditional, needs some other evidence before you can say it has been satisfied. Ignoring the deaths of thousands of your people: Not sufficient grounds for you to be said to dislike them. K… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-could-ronald-reagan-have-done-about-aids/249085.md?page=6)