# What crime were the "To catch a predator" subjects committing? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 10, 2008, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476 "2008-12-10T00:35:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/41 "2008-12-11T00:47:52Z")
This is a hijack from the strict question of legality, but what are the actual typical plea deals and/or prison sentences served by the people caught on _To Catch a Predator_ or committing similar crimes when NBC cameras _aren’t_ there? Does making, ahem, an appearance on the show affect either way the typical sentence served? ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/42 "2008-12-11T01:23:44Z")
> [@threemae](#): > > This is a hijack from the strict question of legality, but what are the actual typical plea deals and/or prison sentences served by the people caught on _To Catch a Predator_ or committing similar crimes when NBC cameras _aren’t_ there? Does making, ahem, an appearance on the show affect either way the typical sentence served? I don’t think we’ll find very meaningful statistics on this topic. The dateline page lists the names of some of the guest stars, and I was able to find some of them in their respective state databases. There’s also this page [http://www.news-journalonline.com/special/predator/](http://www.news-journalonline.com/special/predator/) , which lists some sentences. But as you can see from some of the articles on the linked page, many of these guys are caught with drugs or child pornography, and without additional research we can’t tell what portion of their sentence was for the enticement offense. OTOH, it’s probably a fair assumption that the group that isn’t on the show commits a similar group of offenses. BJS statistics, though, don’t separate sentencing data with enough granularity for us to get a picture of the average sentence. They don’t have a category for this particular offense: [http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/html/scscf04/tables/scs04204tab.htm](http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/html/scscf04/tables/scs04204tab.htm) [Home | Bureau of Justice Statistics](http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/html/fdluc/2004/tables/fdluc04st26.htm) Here are some statistics from Georgia, FWIW: [http://www.dcor.state.ga.us/pdf/ChildSexOffenders.pdf](http://www.dcor.state.ga.us/pdf/ChildSexOffenders.pdf) I’ll poke around a bit more and see if I can come up with anything that’s actually useful. ---
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/43 "2008-12-11T02:06:28Z")
Thank you, your last cite was useful. Although it isn’t particularly descriptive and I’m not sure if Georgia is representative, average time served for child molestation is approaching six years, aggravated child molestation (whatever that is) is approaching 10. I guess I’m contrasting that with the statutory: “knowingly persuades, induces, entices, or coerces any individual who has not attained the age of 18 years, to engage in prostitution or any sexual activity for which any person can be charged with a criminal offense, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title and imprisoned not less than 10 years or for life.” To me, soliciting a 16 year old over the internet is an order of magnitude different from child molestation, although I know that in “the wild” the 10 to life figure is probably grossly inflated from reality due to pleas, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/44 "2008-12-11T02:12:00Z")
> [@threemae](#): > > Thank you, your last cite was useful. Although it isn’t particularly descriptive and I’m not sure if Georgia is representative, average time served for child molestation is approaching six years, aggravated child molestation (whatever that is) is approaching 10. > I guess I’m contrasting that with the statutory: > “knowingly persuades, induces, entices, or coerces any individual who has not attained the age of 18 years, to engage in prostitution or any sexual activity for which any person can be charged with a criminal offense, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title and imprisoned not less than 10 years or for life.” > > To me, soliciting a 16 year old over the internet is an order of magnitude different from child molestation, although I know that in “the wild” the 10 to life figure is probably grossly inflated from reality due to pleas, etc. Perhaps I misunderstood what you were asking, too. Are you interested in a comparison of sentences of those convicted of enticement or attempt and those convicted of actually having sex with a minor? I might be able to find some stats on that. I thought you were looking for those who got decoyed by the tv show vs. those who got decoyed by law enforcement. Obviously, that’s a lot tougher to get a lock on. ---
**Author:** ![seodoa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4af34b/32.png) [@seodoa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/seodoa)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/45 "2008-12-11T02:22:04Z")
> [@threemae](#): > > To me, soliciting a 16 year old over the internet is an order of magnitude different from child molestation, although I know that in “the wild” the 10 to life figure is probably grossly inflated from reality due to pleas, etc. Not wanting to provide too much information, I can’t really give you a cite (although if persistent enough, you could certainly find one with Google), but an individual I worked with several years back was among those caught in a To Catch a Predator sting. His sentence ended up being 60 days and 2 years probation. He was a first-time offender, so I’m sure that is on the lenient side. ETA: The girl he thought he was meeting was also at least 13 years old which, in the state law, at least, provides for a more lenient sentence than if she had been 12 or younger. ---
**Author:** ![ParentalAdvisory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/53a042/32.png) [@ParentalAdvisory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParentalAdvisory)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/46 "2008-12-11T06:25:42Z")
Let me preface, I’m not some perv, just want to know how the law works. What if the girl is 13, you question her age, and she shows you a fake ID (but looks real to you) that says she’s of age to consent? Further, the police collect this ID as evidence and would agree that it could pass off as real (assuming she hasn’t destroyed it). Is the guy still busted? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/47 "2008-12-11T13:30:13Z")
> [@ParentalAdvisory](#): > > Let me preface, I’m not some perv, just want to know how the law works. > > What if the girl is 13, you question her age, and she shows you a fake ID (but looks real to you) that says she’s of age to consent? Further, the police collect this ID as evidence and would agree that it could pass off as real (assuming she hasn’t destroyed it). Is the guy still busted? He could be. Of course, your hypothetical is pretty divergent from the ones that started this thread, so it’s not clear to me if you’re picturing this ID check happening after an IRL meeting arranged by computer in which the girl claims she’s underage, or simply a meeting IRL to begin with, with no computers involved. ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/48 "2008-12-11T18:07:02Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > No, because he obviously has no intention of following through. This brings up another question. What if someone realizes that they are chatting with the folks from “To catch a predator”, and decides to go along with it (to mess with them, and/or to be on TV). So he sends a letter to himself saying something like “I know I am chatting with the To Catch a Predator guys, and not a 13-year old girl, and I am going along with it to mess with them”. The letter is sent via USPS and has a date on it. Would that be sufficient proof that the person had no intention of following through, and he was in on the sting? If yes, this would be bad, since real perverts could just send themselves such a letter anytime they start chatting with underage girls, and use that as “proof” that they had no intention of following through. This could work in other areas. For example, a car thief could send himself an SMS before trying to steal a car (saying “I know it’s a sting car, so I’ll just pretend to steal it to mess with them”). One response from the state would be to pass a law that makes it a crime to mess with a sting operation once you realize it is a sting operation. Are such laws already in place? ETA: The SMS idea would not work as is, because they can see from your wireless providers’ logs that you sent a whole bunch of these to yourself on different dates. But the main idea of putting it in writing that you think it is a sting still holds. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/49 "2008-12-11T18:34:18Z")
> [@Polerius](#): > > What if someone realizes that they are chatting with the folks from “To catch a predator”, and decides to go along with it (to mess with them, and/or to be on TV). So he sends a letter to himself… Same answer: the jury is entitled to believe or disbelieve any evidence before them. There’s no magic bullet or magic shield; the reason we have a jury is so they can apply their common sense and life experience to weighing the evidence and deciding what to credit and what to dismiss. So the jury could decide that the letter shows there was no criminal intent… or they could decide that the letter was an artifice intended to shield the sender in case the youngster turned out to be a sting. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/50 "2008-12-11T19:59:31Z")
> [@Polerius](#): > > This brings up another question. > > What if someone realizes that they are chatting with the folks from “To catch a predator”, and decides to go along with it (to mess with them, and/or to be on TV). So he sends a letter to himself saying something like “I know I am chatting with the To Catch a Predator guys, and not a 13-year old girl, and I am going along with it to mess with them”. The letter is sent via USPS and has a date on it. > > Would that be sufficient proof that the person had no intention of following through, and he was in on the sting? > > If yes, this would be bad, since real perverts could just send themselves such a letter anytime they start chatting with underage girls, and use that as “proof” that they had no intention of following through. > > This could work in other areas. For example, a car thief could send himself an SMS before trying to steal a car (saying “I know it’s a sting car, so I’ll just pretend to steal it to mess with them”). > > One response from the state would be to pass a law that makes it a crime to mess with a sting operation once you realize it is a sting operation. Are such laws already in place? > > ETA: The SMS idea would not work as is, because they can see from your wireless providers’ logs that you sent a whole bunch of these to yourself on different dates. But the main idea of putting it in writing that you think it is a sting still holds. I thought I saw a show (To Catch a Predator episode) where a suspect who showed up has a pre-prepared letter in his car that he wrote, stating that it was his intent to _not_ engage in sex with a minor. When the police came out and arrested him, he tried to use the letter as a shield. The police arrested him anyway. I guess they felt it was for the DA to sort out. (Err… what **Bricker** said.) There’s also a lot of these suspects who make the claim that their intention was to show up and “talk the minor” out of their dangerous ways. None of the suspects who made it “on Air” seem to escape being charged. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476/51 "2008-12-11T23:55:33Z")
I wonder, though, **Bricker** , why you keep deferring to the jury? I think some of these inquiries are intended more to ask if they’d even be prosecuted. Prosecutors don’t just send _everything_ to trial unless they have a good idea they can win. Uh, not looking for legal advice to potential predators on this forum, which is something you may be trying to avoid. 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-crime-were-the-to-catch-a-predator-subjects-committing/476476.md?page=2)