[QUOTE=Fretful Porpentine]
I just learned from this thread that there are car seats for eight-year-olds. I’m thirty and childless, and I think the idea of a normal, non-developmentally delayed eight-year-old in a car seat sounds utterly bizarre.
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I’m 20 and think that’s odd. I never had a booster seat, although I never started sitting in the front seats until I was 8 or 9. My whole life I’ve been told that it is horrible to not use one, but I never did.
The drop in violent crime in recent years, to approximately 1960 levels. I lived in a pretty crime-ridden city from age 10–22. It’s odd to think that even the bad parts of town aren’t as dangerous as they were when I was a kid.
The obsession with celebrity. Admittedly, I’ve been out of the country for a while, so maybe I missed some of the development, but it seems like in 2000 when I left normal news wouldn’t carry celebrity-related stories. Now . . . well, I shouldn’t even start on that.
Social networking sites. I was active on BBSs back before the internet became mainstream, and I even went to meet some of the people I corresponded with, so I’m not completely unfamiliar with the social aspects of electronic communictation. The difference between boards like this and sites like MySpace or Xanga are enormous, in my opinion. I can’t imagine having hundreds of virtual friends, sharing pictures with people I’ve never met, constantly updating all those people on intimate details of my personal life. I’m somewhat reserved in real life, so that has something to do with it, but I can’t imagine wanting to be so connected to everyone all the time. If I haven’t met a person they feel kind of unreal, and I really don’t get caring about what a bunch of strangers think about me. I read an article on this recently which reminded me of how odd this trend seems to me.
[QUOTE=Fretful Porpentine]
I just learned from this thread that there are car seats for eight-year-olds. I’m thirty and childless, and I think the idea of a normal, non-developmentally delayed eight-year-old in a car seat sounds utterly bizarre.
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Blame the state legislature. They like to promote safety, and it’s quite true that being strapped into a booster seat is safer than not bieng strapped into one. Of course, the older the child gets, the less the return is, and the more hassle it is, but the legislators aren’t the ones who have to buy bigger cars or get the 8-yos into the booster seats. (I am a parent of two, and I also think the idea of a normal 8-yo in a seat is bizarre. My kid’s 6th birthday was a very happy one, since she didn’t have to ride in a seat any more.)
Laws vary by state–some mandate it up to 4, here in California it’s 6, and some up to 8. I was quite relieved when CA dropped the idea of kicking it up to 8. To listen to these guys, you would think that none of us had survived childhood–my parents used to throw all 4 of us in the back and we would bounce around like popcorn. (OK, it’s good we never got in a wreck, and I’m fine with putting my 3-yo in a seat, but 8 is just ridiculous.)
[QUOTE=Captain_C]
But it seems like TV, radio, all kinds of media are pulling out all the stops to bring in this invisible demographic. I was watching PBS and they had some cartoon that spoke half Spanish and half English. I suppose it is supposed to be educational to children.
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I’m surprised because when I was a kid in the 70s they had lots of Spanish on Sesame Street. For some reason all I ever picked up was how to say open and closed in a weird voice and to count to ten. The Canadian version had French instead of Spanish.
Also in the 70s when I was little my mom had a leash for me. She lost me a couple of times before resorting to that.
[QUOTE=WhyNot]
Never thought respectable professionals would have nose or tongue piercings.
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This has struck me as odd several times recently; I have a third ear piercing at the top of my left ear that I always feel inclined to cover in a professional situation but then I realise that my interviewer has a brightly coloured eyebrow piercing and a spiked lip stud.
Also the mainstream acceptance of internet dating; I’m still a bit skeptical myself about forming and maintaining a relationship on the internet alone but that’s my own personal experience and it’s due to the amount of emotional weight I pull out of textual responses. But I’ve met dozens of couples who cite their romantic origins as the internet and it’s really refreshing actually that people can form those relationships on that sort of interaction alone.
This may just be within my own social group (private girls’ school, has its pros and cons); feminine superiority complexes. These girls think they can mess a guy around, lead him on and then get all offended when he expects some actual physical contact. Meanwhile, if a guy does that to them; bring out the psycho-analysis books and let’s translate ‘Guy Talk’.
Also; the proliferation of Women’s magazines which aid this ‘translation’, as well as give the same damn tips on how to please him in bed. I’m in charge of my own sexuality enough to know how to use it in the bedroom without a user manual, thanks. I find a lot of girls who rely on these texts are massively misinformed emotionally; in realistic educational terms, they know all about contraception etc. which is good but they have no idea about how to treat the guy as a fellow human being. He’s expected to read minds and period cycles, poor thing.
The blatant stupidity of reality TV shows; Laguna Beach, My Sweet Sixteenth, the list of IQ-battering putrescence grows more every day.
[QUOTE=Sal Ammoniac]
Here’s a perfectly trivial example, but the morphing of the song *YMCA *from a gay anthem into a fun song for kids to sing at elementary school functions has always struck me as a wee bit unexpected.
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I think it has always been a fun song for kids to sing at elementary school functions. I remember singing it at a school function in front of all of our parents, complete with the dance, in the 5th grade back in 1978.
If anything, the role as a gay anthem was not seen by all at the time (the Wikipedia article discusses this). Had that side been overt, I can’t imagine we would have been allowed to sing it as kids.
People who stalk and kill celebrities. That seems to be a modern development, and it is just plain creepy.
All of the above - especially the “mainstreaming of geek culture”, the internet, cellphones, and non-smoking.
Apologies if it’s a repetition, but I’d also mention the fact that in most places nowadays, children don’t walk to school anymore. When I was at school (1970s and early 80s) hardly anyone was taken to school by car. Some may have used buses, but most walked.
Even in my small, safe home town, the school run has become the norm, and only people who live inches away from the school let their children walk. There is no fear of abduction in a crime-free place like Gibraltar, although there are genuine traffic safety concerns.
This has to be one of the reasons for the “obesity epidemic” as much as the dietary factors.
The rise of autism. I’m 24 and I never knew a single person with autism until I started teaching. My elementary school has three kids with autism. Almost every school in the county has at least one if not more.
I’m constantly amazed at how the majority of kids treat the ones with autism with respect and patience. It resembles the affection one has for a younger sibling. I know that I and my peers probably wouldn’t have been so kind.
Speaking of autism, I’ll nominate another disorder: allergies.
Even in high school, I remember allergies as being very rare (and I was aware of them; I’m allergic to penicillin). Now it seems that half the people have allergies of one sort or another, especially food allergies, and expecially especially peanut allergies. What’s going on? Are allergies really that more common, or are they being better reported, or what?
[QUOTE=River Hippie]
The demonization of smoking is a good example and one that’s been on my mind lately as my place of employment is going 100% no smoking. I’m guessing that future generations will be watching old movies with all the smoking digitally edited out.
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On a related note, the widespread expectation and acceptance of employee drug testing. In the far-off days of the 1970s, when there was actually a ballot initiative to legalize all use of marijuana for adults in California, and it garnered a 30% yes vote, employer drug testing wasn’t even on anybody’s horizon. What the hell business was it of the employer to regulate what you did on your own time? Now that’s changed to the extent that marijuana could be legalized tomorrow, and yet it would still be forbidden for the vast majority of those who work for others for a living.
[QUOTE=sinjin]
Just one data point, NYC wasn’t that bad before the 90’s either. Took our grammar school kiddies, little sis, and niece to the big city during the 80’s and stayed in times square. Walked all over manhatten day and night, no problems. Only weird thing was we went to the America Cafe (probably defunct now) and thought we were way cool. .
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I think the era in which NYC was perceived as dangerous and dirty was probably between 1965 and 1980. A lot of movies of the era, even those with comic overtones and outright comedies, protrayed the city as a place where muggers lurked everywhere and uncollected garbage rotted on the streets. Soylent Green (1966 novel and 1973 movie), Escape From New York, and similar creations were the darkest extrapolations of this. And for years, the weekly title sequence of Saturday Night Live showed a woman dashing to her car and unlocking it as fast as her feet would carry her–why? To avoid being mugged or raped, of course. NYC in movies nowadays always seems pleasant and clean; just the opposite.
[QUOTE=Thirty-Nine]
The idea that if you can’t smoke a cigarette, you’re more likely to buy another drink. Doubt I could find anything to support that though.
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When I smoked, it seemed to make me thirstier. I’d think smokers would order more beer, not less.
I’m a few years older than Shagnasty, but yes, he’s right about the apocalyptic atmosphere we grew up in. We were screwed–the Soviets were unstoppable menaces who were going to blow us up, and mankind was so unreleivedly violent that it was going to happen sooner rather than later (Remember that scene in 1986’s STIV, when Kirk looks at a newspaper and remarks that it was a miracle that humanity ever made it out of the 20th century?). Our cities were dying and crime was up and would never go down (I was a dark-haired teen girl during the Summer of Sam–I was terrified of going to dark places, and to this day have never been tempted to “park” with a guy). The Japanese had brought Rockefeller Center and were going to own the world.
And since I am a few years older, we kids had another thing to worry about–the energy crisis! We would see in our Weekly Readers horror stories of how kids in the future would be living in a world where by 2000 everyone would have long hair to pile on top of their heads to keep warm in the winter, and there were no more private cars, no more malls, no more anything, if we didn’t shape up RIGHT NOW. Our schools in NYC turned off the heat at noon on Fridays and started it up on noon on Mondays–by 2:00 you were sitting in class in your coat, taking off your mittens to write, as the cold seeped in through the old 1920s style school windows (decaying infrastructure was another staple of the time–the subways were graffitied and filthy and finding an air-conditioned car was a blessing).
Given all that, though, we were pretty happy. When the world is crumbling around you, family and friends are really important, and everybody would visit a lot more and be very close. I also remember seeing very few fat people–we all had terrific bodies now that I look back at the pictures, maybe because marketing aimed solely at teens was just starting, and I still remember when wearing a designer’s name on the butt of your jeans was amazingly pretentious and labelled you a sucker for Madison Avenue. Snacks were a real treat, not an everyday thing, and on the rare occasions when you did eat out portions were smaller. I still remember being unable to finish a can of Coke–12 whole ounces!–when I was little, since I was used to 8-oz bottles.
And even though garbage was everywhere in the NY of the 70s, and I could see fires most days as I took the 4 train el down from the northern Bronx, I still fell in love with NYC. I left home at 18 and every time I came back, things were cleaner, safer, and more harmonious somehow.
Speaking of things changing, I remember meeting Matt in 2003 at the America Cafe, and I had a birthday party there in May of 2004. But in 2005 it was gone and replaced by a much more upscale place, Rosa Mexicano. They put a giant bubble fountain dividing the huge space and moved the bar to the side instead of the back. Meh.
[QUOTE=Mehitabel]
And since I am a few years older, we kids had another thing to worry about–the energy crisis!
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Speaking of the energy crisis, something else that has taken me aback is the huge popularity of SUV’s. Like bottled water, I never could figure out a rational reason for their popularity. After the 1970’s, I expected everyone either bicycling to work or driving Ford Festivas. Instead, I see people who will never see a dirt road in their lives driving four wheel gas guzzlers. It must be a part of the American psyche to crave bigger and more powerful things.
My culture shock to me:
Consumer culture run amok. “The world is disposable. Upgrade, upgrade, upgrade!”
My friend’s cellphone contract expired. Getting renewing his contract, they offered him a new cellphone for only $30. There was nothing wrong with his existing cellphone. His existing cellphone was still very new, only a few months old, it worked perfectly fine and had tons of high tech features. But he got rid of it because he could get the even newer one that has an MP3 player for $30. (He already has an MP3 player.)
My family would buy a car and drive it into the ground. My friend traded in his 2004 Lexus for a new 2007 SUV, because it was time for “something new”. (I still drive a 1996 Toyota, it’s in great shape and gets great mileage).
My former roommate’s vacuum cleaner went on the fritz (cheap ass components). It was cheaper to throw it out and replace it than it would be to repair it. My vacuum cleaner is older than I am. I have to rig bags from another brand to fit it because they don’t make them anymore, but it works better than any new ones I’ve tried.
My word processing software was obsolete only one year after I bought it. My family used the same manual typewriter for over 25 years (I even used it in my first year of university in 1990). I don’t discard functional stuff that still works well just for the sake of new, new, new.
But sometimes I don’t have a choice: I got a laser pointer for my cats. It cost $6. The batteries died and replacing them costs $30. So it makes more sense to throw it out and just buy a new one.
::sigh::
And get off my lawn!
Cell phones for kids. I was prepared for cell phones to exist, and then for them to get tiny, and for them to proliferate. But I absolutely never thought that young people (even down to elementary school!) would have them just because. I get angry about it because I don’t understand why a 12-year-old needs a phone on her at all times. Then I grow a beard and shake my fist while rocking on my rocking chair.
[QUOTE=fuffle]
Cell phones for kids. I was prepared for cell phones to exist, and then for them to get tiny, and for them to proliferate. But I absolutely never thought that young people (even down to elementary school!) would have them just because. I get angry about it because I don’t understand why a 12-year-old needs a phone on her at all times. Then I grow a beard and shake my fist while rocking on my rocking chair.
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There was a newspaper article here about parents who use cellphones to track their children. They interviewed some local singer-songwriter who can log onto a website and see where her 13 year-old is on a map. That freaks me out.
I think that’s why a lot of young kids have them. So parents can know where they are every second, thus reassuring them that a pedophile hasn’t snatched them off the front lawn.
I have a co-worker whose 8 and 10 year old kids have never walked to the corner of their street without adult accompaniment. My friends and I were building ramps in the woods for our BMX bikes by the time I was 6 with nary an adult in shouting distance. I would have thought kids would have had more autonomy by now, not less.
Well, that at least makes sense…although I’m not sure I’m any happier knowing the reason. The local school district where I’m at is actually contemplating issuing RFID wristbands that track kids’ locations using GPS. Similar idea, really. The idea of using an inventory-tracking system on kids is so far beyond messed up to me…it really creeps me out to imagine what today’s elementary school kids will think about civil liberties and personal privacy after having grown up with this.
[QUOTE=fuffle]
Cell phones for kids. I was prepared for cell phones to exist, and then for them to get tiny, and for them to proliferate. But I absolutely never thought that young people (even down to elementary school!) would have them just because. I get angry about it because I don’t understand why a 12-year-old needs a phone on her at all times. Then I grow a beard and shake my fist while rocking on my rocking chair.
[/QUOTE]
I gave my old cellphone (rather than dispose of it!) to my kid for his 13th birthday. Little does he know, it’s almost entirely for my convenience! Yes, he likes that he can call me from school at the end of the day (since I’m one of those horrible parents that makes him get his own little butt to school instead of driving him) and ask if he can go to the park with his friends for an hour. I’m not sure when the last time was that you tried to find a working pay phone, but there are hardly any left, and they’re much more expensive per minute than his pay-as-you-go plan.
But I like it even more when I send him to the store for milk and then remember 5 minutes later that we need eggs, too. Or he gets there and finds no 1% and calls me for further instructions, instead of getting whole milk (blech!).
And, yes, “for emergencies”. What kind? Well, like when I had to go into the hospital four months early for an emergency c-section while he was at school. I was able to leave him a message that his godmother would be picking him up from school and it was okay to spend the night at her place. Or the snowstorm last month, when I called him just as school ended to let him know I’d be coming in the car to pick he and his bike up, because it was just not safe to ride home. Or when his friend broke his ankle at the park and they called me for help without having to try to move the injured kid to find a phone or leave him alone and injured in the park.
Absolutely, it’s an electronic leash. But it’s actually *increased *his freedom and his responsibilities, not decreased them. He’s allowed to go further and stay out longer and later than I was at his age, because I don’t have to worry about whether or not I can check up on him - even though in reality, I hardly do so.
I find tracking icky, although I understand why some parents like the idea. It’s too Orwellian for me (plus, frankly, sooner or later kids need to learn how to lie to their parents and get away with it, as well as learning from the consequences when they do!)