What dates a movie the most?

Some movies are so brilliantly made, you are sucked in immediately, regardless of the time it was made.

Example: His Girl Friday video goodness.

Lion in Winter One of the best movies you’ve never seen that you need to see before you die.
this is not the opening clip. It was the first I found on Youtube.

Then there are some, that something goes wrong. Like in LadyHawke which was a better than average story/acting/cast/set and on the verge of epic geekness in its own way, and the music was so out of place, it really took you out of the moment.

Not sure of the time frame, but there was a period where electronic “synth” music was used even for films it was not appropriate for. Blade Runner? Perfect vehicle for Vangelis’s “moody moog musings”. Chariots of Fire? Not so perfect, but the music matched the slo-mo running so well, it gets a pass. A film set in a woodsy idyll, like Ladyhawke? WHAT were they thinking?

Heck, we could start a whole thread on misplaced synthesizers in movie soundtracks:
Tango and Cash, Fame, Masters of the Universe, The Mighty Boosh… heck, even when they rock, I question what that That Non-Analog Robot Sound has to do with films like Beverly Hills Cop.

Just checked and they were first used in the Bond film On Her Majesty’s Secret Service back in 1969!

Yes.

The OP mentioned Bridge on the River Kwai. When I finally watched that film all the way through I was shocked at how old-fashioned-Hollywood cornball awful it was! I think because its a war film and based on a true story. Its as if you made a film set in a German concentration camp but used a standard boilerplate Hollywood script with jingoistic characters, insultingly inappropriate pathos, and an utterly ridiculously unrealistic happy ending.

And it was made by David freakin’ Lean!

You need to catch “Johnny Guitar” sometime. Joan Crawford and Mercedes McCambridge as the town vs country baron fighting over some tail played by Sterling Hayden. The shock, horror, and sense of camp washing over the audience is alternately never ending and all was delivered straight up.

I would say yes, due to the production more than any musical style.
Yes, this topic deserves its own thread. I came of age in the 80’s and loved the music I was listening to. Now it grates on my ears like gravel in a coffee grinder.

This happened on Seinfeld for a while, when Kramer would make his first appearance. From the Seinfeld IMDB trivia page:

“As Kramer became more popular, his entrance applause grew so prolonged that the cast complained it was ruining the pacing of their scenes. Directors subsequently asked the audience not to applaud so much when Kramer entered.”

Just an interesting observation. But I think the greatest singular contributor to the '80’s synth ambient cinematic movement is John Carpenter. It’s not just a Halloween Soundtrack.

From extensive reading, I’ve gathered that in Victorian Times, a young lady ‘put her hair up’ in a bun or chignon when she reached marriageable age. Long, loose hair was acceptable for children (or maybe ‘loose women - inside, only?’), it simply wasn’t acceptable to let it flap around for adult women. And women didn’t get their hair cut short, barring an unfortunate accident with, say, paint, or due to an illness. For a 14 year old who wasn’t living in a proper middle-class home, but out and about in the world, well, she was still a child, and her hair would have needed to be kept under some kind of control, so braided pigtails were a logical solution. That, a snood (sort of a mesh hairnet with the hair bundled into it), or a ponytail or braid. If she was of an age to meet boys, go to parties, etc. her female relatives would have started her off on a future of elaborately arranged upswept hairdos. (sidetrack: women never left their homes without a hat or head covering of some kind. It simply Wasn’t Done!)

And “The Third Man”, which can be seen as a sort of rejoinder to “Casablanca”, holds up even better. Very, very modern-feeling film.

I missed this before, but you are so right! I watched The Snake Pit (1948, with Olivia de Havilland) a few months ago – it’s about a young woman who is institutionalized due to mental illness and eventually recovers, and it was based on an autobiographical novel by a woman with the same issues and did a lot of good for the real-life mental health community and actually inspired a number of states to change to reform the conditions in their state mental hospitals. So it was a pretty important film, and the care with which the director made the film and required all the cast and crew to spend time at a mental hospital so that they could capture asylum life accurately is very evident. It’s a good movie and worth seeing.

BUT. Olivia de Havilland’s character was clearly psychotic, either schizophrenic or bipolar with psychotic episodes, or something. She heard auditory hallucinations, experienced “lost time” blackouts, had memory problems, paranoia, emotional lability, attempted suicide IIRC, etc. Her eventual healing was as a result of the combination of electroconvulsive therapy and talk therapy. The major breakthrough and explanation of her problem was not, “You are schizophrenic,” but…“you have a guilt complex due to rejecting your father’s affection shortly before he died when you were a child.” AND THAT WAS IT. The clouds part and light beams down from the heavens and all is now well.

So in 2011, I hear this and think, “What the hell kind of Freudian bullshit is this?” That would never fly today. However, and this factors into why this movie is still worth seeing, it’s entirely appropriate to the time (as it should have been, as it wasn’t a period film) and educational as to the history of psychiatry and the conception of mental illness.

But boy is that diagnosis dated.

All movies are period films, eventually.

I’ve pondered this myself. I’ve always wondered if it would be possible to make a movie that is genuinely timeless, that doesn’t date, and so I started to pay attention to old films, trying to work out which ones still seem absolutely fresh today. Not so much the plots but the style. The look, the music, the sound design, editing, credits etc (old British films tended to have all the credits at the beginning, and just one slide at the end with THE END, or perhaps a single diagonal list of the main players). The conclusion I reached is that the perfectly undateable film would probably have to be a period drama, and thus already dated, shot as simply as possible, with actors and actresses who didn’t go on to be famous and who wore period-correct hairstyles etc.

The film would have to be lucky that a subsequent, ubiquitously famous film did not copy some element of it and thus date it to the time of the subsequent film. I’m thinking of e.g. Saving Private Ryan or The Matrix, which both had very distinctive and original visual tricks that were subsequently smothered to death by floods of imitators, and are thus through no fault of their own inextricably linked to a certain time. Compare either of those with Raiders of the Lost Ark, which had plenty of imitators, but was shot in a deliberately simple, old-fashioned style. Mostly on location, with a lead actor who had an everyman quality. Orchestral music, well-done practical effects, set in the past. It’s a good example of a film that has aged very well.

You’d also have to make a distinction between films that are definitely of their time, but which feel like modern period dramas set in that time, and films which are of their time and feel old. Close Encounters of the Third Kind is obviously set in the late 70s, what with the hairstyles and the televisions, but it doesn’t feel particularly old. In contrast, every single frame of Rocky IV screams 1985. Every single frame of Rocky IV was targeted at the people of 1985; outside that year its effect is nil.

See, I was thinking of Ridley Scott’s The Duellists, which is set in Napoleonic times, with period-correct costumes, and beautifully shot, but the whole thing has nonetheless dated. Specifically it looks and feels like an extended New Romantic video, what with the dandy highwayman looks and the obvious graduated sky darkening filters. The same is true to a lesser extent of Stanley Kubrick’s Barry Lyndon, or Peter Greenaway’s The Draughtman’s Contract; for someone my age, it is hard to look at those films without thinking of Adam Ant (or in the case of the latter film, Channel 4 and women in dungarees). Perhaps future generations, who have no organic knowledge of Adam Ant, and of the video for David Bowie’s Ashes to Ashes, will view them more kindly.

Barry Lyndon benefits from having Ryan O’Neal in the lead, because he is extremely bland and his career tanked thereafter. Classical music, subtle lighting effects, Kubrick’s particular visual style. Certainly it has dated far better than A Clockwork Orange, which was supposed to be in the future, but now looks like the fag end of the 1960s distilled into a pint glass. Stanley Kubrick’s a fascinating director to ponder in this respect. He controlled his films, down to the design of the credits, and there was no way he was going to bow to fashion, and so most of his films have aged very well albeit not perfectly. In the future, when Jack Nicholson is long-dead, and no-one remembers him, there won’t be much of The Shining that says 1980.

I suppose the ultimate answer is that no single thing dates a movie; it’s a combination of things. For example, the original Night of the Living Dead felt old-fashioned to me because it’s in black and white, and the characters generally look and act like people from the past - in fact, the first time I saw it I assumed it had been made in the 1950s - but the brutal, uncompromising attitude hasn’t dated. A plot point later in the film where SPOILER the hero shoots one of the living living SPOILER genuinely surprised me.

I’ve often wondered how a child, with no previous exposure to old films or old culture, would react to Easy Rider or Electra Glide in Blue or Logan’s Run or All the President’s Men etc etc. All of those films seem dated to me, even though I wasn’t alive when they were new, because I have built up a mental picture of early-70s cinema. Downbeat endings, meandering plots, all the cast in their thirties and forties. I suppose at first they just seem alien, and then over time the faces become familiar, and the music, and - paf! - the alienness and the time period become linked.

On a small technical level, footsteps. In 60s action films. Seriously; the last time I saw The IPCRESS File I was struck by how the sound mix was full of footsteps during action sequences, and this seems to have been a quirk of the period. Same with the fight sequence on the train in From Russia with Love. Obviously-looped dialogue that doesn’t have any room ambience, that’s another thing.

Gordon Jackson. You don’t know him, because you’re American, but trust me. He dates a film. And blue light; blue light dates a film to the 1980s. You know, it’s interesting to compare the first two Robocop films. The original came out in 1987 and doesn’t absolutely reek of the 1980s; the style is modest, nothing tries to be deliberately contemporary, and the general look has a sensibly formal approach. The bizarre ethnic mix of the Detroit street gangs hasn’t dated, in the sense that it was weird back then. Still, the brutal violence is just as funny as it ever was. In contrast, the sequel has a distinct and pervasive whiff of the early 1990s about it, for reasons I can’t quite put my finger on.

I suspect far too many people are watching movies to see if they can pick out incongruities or “things that look dated” and suffer an inability to enjoy them as a result.

That said: I have difficulty getting into '30s-'40s movies in which American actors speak in those pseudo-British voice-trained accents. You’re growing up in working-class Cleveland, you probably can’t be expected to sound like Olivia de Havilland.

Also, any movie with Walter Brennan or William Bendix is hopelessly dated.

I think it is little things: Smoking on an airplane, or basically anywhere. No seat belts. Pay phones. Staying at a hotel, signing your name, and paying the bill in the morning. Calling co-workers or neighbors Mr. or Miss so and so. Kids calling their parents sir or ma’am. Things that don’t happen today.

Also when the movie actually mentions date, for example when Demolition Man shows Hollywood burning to the ground in 1996, that immediately dates it.

To me, the big difference is “stage” acting verses naturalism.

Mmm, okay. So there’s just the two of you. And you’re standing in the kitchen of your own house. The record player isn’t going. The radio isn’t. So, um… why are you shouting at each other? Are you both deaf? Did your mothers never teach you about inside voice vs outside voice? Is the sappy violin-drenched score actually being played on the set while you’re doing your scenes?

I remember back in school we watched an old film version of a play we were studying, and all the hammy, hysterical stage-acting got a big laugh from us kids.