# What did Civil War soldiers fight for? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 7, 2012, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676 "2012-08-07T00:29:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/21 "2012-08-07T04:42:52Z")
For a lot of poor folks (especially immigrants fresh off the boat in the north), they signed up for a pair of the best boots they’d ever owned and the promise of three meals a day and steady income. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/22 "2012-08-07T04:53:17Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > According to Mark Twain it was because Southern women wouldn’t have sex with men who refused to fight. I’ve heard the same; to such an extent that men who avoided fighting (by, say paying someone to take their place as mentioned) were held in such contempt by women that prostitutes would spit on them. The idea that women = anti-war is a modern one; the Spartan mothers telling their sons “come back with your shield or on it” is more the historical norm. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/23 "2012-08-07T04:59:45Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > I’ve heard the same; to such an extent that men who avoided fighting (by, say paying someone to take their place as mentioned) were held in such contempt by women that prostitutes would spit on them. The idea that women = anti-war is a modern one; the Spartan mothers telling their sons “come back with your shield or on it” is more the historical norm. So, umm, 411 BC is “Modern”?:dubious: Lysistrata would disagree with you. True, women can be just as bloodthirsty as men, no doubt. ---
**Author:** ![wedgehed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8edcca/32.png) [@wedgehed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wedgehed)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/24 "2012-08-07T05:11:53Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Fortunately, though, you cut off my quote just before that part. OK, so I’m a defensive Southerner whose ancestors wore grey. Just go ahead & steal my chickens! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![PrettyVacant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/49beb7/32.png) [@PrettyVacant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PrettyVacant)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/25 "2012-08-07T08:05:00Z")
Money, manufactured patriotism, peer pressure, social pressure, the owners of capital - all twisted and distorted through the filter of a ‘doing the right thing’ morality. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/26 "2012-08-07T11:03:45Z")
> [@wedgehed](#): > > As far as defending slavery, it seems to me that a better defense would have been to stay in the Union & block every piece of anti-slavery legislation that came before Congress. Fortunately, the fire-eaters in the south weren’t that bright. They might not have been that bright, but they weren’t dumb either. And they could read demographic trends. The President had just gotten elected without any southern support. In the House , only 90 of the 238 congressmen were from the South…a number swamped by even the size of the House Republican caucus, which made up 108 members. Things were a little better in the Senate, where the South was better able to maintain parity due to raw state numbers. But if you look at a map, there was a lot more territory waiting to be settled, most of it in places slavery wasn’t really able to take root in. All those territories would some day be demanding statehood, and the Senators in those states wouldn’t be able to be counted on to defend slavery. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/27 "2012-08-07T13:02:56Z")
> [@PrettyVacant](#): > > Money, manufactured patriotism, peer pressure, social pressure, the owners of capital - all twisted and distorted through the filter of a ‘doing the right thing’ morality. Except, the North r_eally was_ “doing the right thing”. ---
**Author:** ![PrettyVacant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/49beb7/32.png) [@PrettyVacant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PrettyVacant)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/28 "2012-08-07T13:28:36Z")
Cue: States Rights vs. blah, bleh, meh. ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/29 "2012-08-07T14:00:47Z")
Joining the army was a great long-term career move–if you lived to tell about it. Civil War veterans had huge advantages in politics and business. If you were young and healthy and _didn’t_ fight, you’d spend the rest of your life explaining why, just as later politicians were dogged by avoiding service in Vietnam. As a northern veteran, by contrast, you would join the Grand Army of the Republic, a clubby fraternity with great networking opportunities whose members cared for each other in good times and bad. Best to sign up, dodge rebel bullets and dysentery, and brag about it for the rest of your life. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/30 "2012-08-07T14:13:35Z")
> [@wedgehed](#): > > I believe the average Confederate soldier was fighting to defend his home. My wife recently read a book by an historian whose primary primary documents were letters written by Confederate soldiers to their families. So take this as a tertiary at best source :). Anyway, one interesting finding is that a lot of Confederate soldiers were fighting to defend their homes, _by maintaining slavery_. Every white person in the South was well aware of the Haiti example, in which slaves engaged in a bloody uprising and slaughtered many white people. There was a fear among white Southerners that if slavery ended, there might be a similar massacre in the South, as freed slaves sought revenge. While there might have been some legitimacy to this fear, given the Haitian precedent, it was no doubt exacerbated by racist impressions of the brutality of black people. A white Confederate soldier who had no slaves might nevertheless want to keep the institution of slavery strong, as a way of protecting his wife, mother, sister, daughter. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/31 "2012-08-07T14:28:49Z")
> [@wedgehed](#): > > OK, so I’m a defensive Southerner whose ancestors wore grey. Just go ahead & steal my chickens! > > 🙂 I burning your chickens! ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/32 "2012-08-07T15:08:38Z")
Many reasons have been mentioned; most of them valid. Beginning in 1862, men on both side joined because [they were conscripted](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_the_United_States#Civil_War); the procedure was phased in over the following years. As mentioned, prosperous Yankees had the option of paying somebody else to take their place. Rebels who owned enough slaves were exempt; see also [Desertion in the Civil War.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desertion#American_Civil_War) ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/33 "2012-08-07T18:04:48Z")
There was a lot of ambivalence even in the South about the war. The people in the mountains rarely had big farms, or slaves, and were not NEARLY so enamored of slavery as the people in middle and south Georgia where they had the big plantations. In fact, one county in north Georgia is called “Union County” because it went for the Union throughout the Civil War.[Cite.](http://georgia.gov/cities-counties/union-county) ---
**Author:** ![wedgehed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8edcca/32.png) [@wedgehed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wedgehed)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/34 "2012-08-07T19:09:32Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > In fact, one county in north Georgia is called “Union County” because it went for the Union throughout the Civil War.[Cite.](http://georgia.gov/cities-counties/union-county) Not quite. [Cite](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_County,_Georgia#History) There’s also a Lincoln County in Georgia. It’s not named for Abe though. ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_s\_Son](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19adc/32.png) [@Jim\_s\_Son](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_s_Son)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2012, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/35 "2012-08-07T22:56:41Z")
A lot of Northerners felt that if they were to keep having a republic, they had to fight for it when it was threatened. Even if that threat was one-third of the states leaving it. You had some 80 years of hearing how their grandfathers fought for freedom in the Revolution and many thought to prove themselves worthy of being free men. they had to defend it. Certainly this was reinforced by many units being made up of people from the same area-which had devastating effects if that unit suffered severe casualties. From a later war, E.B. Sledge in his book on World War II in the Pacific says “If a country is worth living in, then it is worth fighting for.” I think a lot of people 150 years ago had that attitude. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2012, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/36 "2012-08-08T00:24:27Z")
> [@wedgehed](#): > > Not quite. > > [Cite](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_County,_Georgia#History) > > There’s also a Lincoln County in Georgia. It’s not named for Abe though. Hmm. The origin of the name was wrong but the cite reinforces the larger point about the ambivalence of north Georgians toward secession and the Civil War. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2012, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/37 "2012-08-08T00:37:07Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > Hmm. The origin of the name was wrong but the cite reinforces the larger point about the ambivalence of north Georgians toward secession and the Civil War. Damn Yankee Georgians! ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2012, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/38 "2012-08-08T00:44:35Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Early on, at least a few of 'em signed up in order to wear those cool Zouave uniforms! That’s a really good point. No way you’re getting away those pants any other way. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2012, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/39 "2012-08-08T00:52:38Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Many reasons have been mentioned; most of them valid. Beginning in 1862, men on both side joined because [they were conscripted](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_the_United_States#Civil_War); the procedure was phased in over the following years. The draft was a real phenomenon, but as I noted earlier, fewer than 3% of Federal troops were drafted. (In fact, I was surprised to find that more men joined up as paid substitutes than actually served as conscripts–although the total percentages of both groups were still pretty low.) What I had remembered, but might come as a surprise to those who romaticize the Southern war effort, is that the Secessionist states instituted a draft earlier than the Union states. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2012, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676/40 "2012-08-08T01:20:46Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Except, the North r_eally was_ “doing the right thing”. That is a fitting name considering your view of the War of Northern Aggression. > [@](#): > > It remains the deadliest war in American history, resulting in the deaths of an estimated 750,000 soldiers[5] and an undetermined number of civilian casualties. Historian John Huddleston estimates the death toll at ten percent of all Northern males 20–45 years old, and 30 percent of all Southern white males aged 18–40 . [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-civil-war-soldiers-fight-for/630676.md?page=3)