# What did Reagan effect? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 19, 2014, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695 "2014-02-19T07:48:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/21 "2014-02-19T20:17:50Z")
> [@nevadaexile](#): > > The behind teh scene nogotiating which led to the release of the US hostages held by Iran. But [that was one of Reagan’s,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/October_Surprise_conspiracy_theory) wasn’t it? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![nevadaexile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb8c5e/32.png) [@nevadaexile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nevadaexile)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/22 "2014-02-19T20:20:55Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > But [that was one of Reagan’s,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/October_Surprise_conspiracy_theory) wasn’t it? 😉 No, it was not. The Carter team was working behind the scenes to get the hostages released up to the day of the inauguration. The hostages were released shortly thereafter Reagan certainly took _ **credit** _ for it. But then, he though that he actually served in combat in his later years, so…. ---
**Author:** ![Steely\_Dan\_Fan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de053/32.png) [@Steely\_Dan\_Fan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steely_Dan_Fan)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/23 "2014-02-19T20:30:54Z")
> [@lance\_strongarm](#): > > He didn’t effect anything. He affected some things though. No, no, he effected lots of things: thirty years (and counting) of poverty, misery, hatred, oppression, and tyranny. ---
**Author:** ![Steely\_Dan\_Fan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de053/32.png) [@Steely\_Dan\_Fan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steely_Dan_Fan)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/24 "2014-02-19T20:32:22Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Reagan is widely credited with hastening the downfall of the Soviet Union and the Iron Curtain. Whether this is valid or not, I don’t know It’s not. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/25 "2014-02-19T21:31:17Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Reagan is widely credited with hastening the downfall of the Soviet Union and the Iron Curtain. Whether this is valid or not . . . It was really Gorbachev’s doing. ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/26 "2014-02-19T21:58:27Z")
One thing he effected was a disastrous farm policy. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/27 "2014-02-19T22:04:07Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > It was really Gorbachev’s doing. Of all the politicians in the world in the past fifty years, Gorbachev might be the most deserving of our reverence. It would be hard to overstate just how important he was in 90 and 91, and how much cataclysmically worse things could have been if a man of weaker principle or courage were in his position. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/28 "2014-02-19T22:43:46Z")
> [@Latro](#): > > You seem to assume that it was Reagan that led the Reagan administration. > The powers that run that administration actually ran three administrations. > [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Please name them. That is, please name the **powers** as well as the administrations. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/29 "2014-02-19T22:45:38Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Historians rank Reagan well above average among Presidents for leadership qualities, but below average for qualifications and quality of appointments, ending up in the middle of the pack overall. How do they rank him on policies? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/30 "2014-02-19T22:48:20Z")
What would Ronald Reagan do If he were here right now? He’d hear a plan And he’d claim it, too, That’s what Ronald Reagan’d do! When Ronald Reagan was in the Army Fighting World War II, He never left the States, but said He was there and freed the Jews! When Ronald Reagan was in Hollywood, Heading up the SAG, He turned the names of Comsymps in To the fucking HUAC scumbags! When Ronald Reagan was in the White House Putting down the lewd, The air controllers stood up proud, And Reagan said, “You’re screwed!” So what would Ronald Reagan do If he were here today? I’m sure he’d stab a back or two, That’s what Ronald Reagan’d do! That’s what Ronald Reagan’d do! (With apologies to Stone & Parker, and Brian Boitano.) ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/31 "2014-02-19T23:41:36Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > How do they rank him on policies? Ranking in each of 20 categories is shown at the link I provided (click 7 in the Contents). Reagan’s highest rank (#3, behind only Washington and Teddy Roosevelt) is for … Luck! > [@Mosier](#): > > Of all the politicians in the world in the past fifty years, Gorbachev might be the most deserving of our reverence. It would be hard to overstate just how important he was in 90 and 91, and how much cataclysmically worse things could have been if a man of weaker principle or courage were in his position. I am a fan of [Michael Hart’s List of History’s 100 Most Influential Persons](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_100:_A_Ranking_of_the_Most_Influential_Persons_in_History). The list includes four Russians: Stalin, Lenin, Peter the Great, and Mikhail Gorbachev. The list includes 5 American inventors: the Wright brothers jointly, Edison, Fermi (if he’s considered American), Gregory Pincus and Henry Ford; and three American Presidents: Washington, Jefferson (though not for his Presidency) and Kennedy. (JFK makes the list because of his importance to _future_ generations on the assumption that a Moon landing would not have been attempted without JFK.) ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2014, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/32 "2014-02-21T18:21:21Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > He was a good diplomat. Brought Israel and Egypt together. It was already in the works. Henry Kissinger, the man whom Carter had traduced in the 1976 elections, is the one who got it rolling. Carter was good in that he didn’t screw it up, as usual. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2014, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/33 "2014-02-21T19:39:52Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > He _effected_ a change in the underlying political structure of the US by selling people on economic theories that Americans had largely abandoned in the 1930s. Reagan \*might \*have sold people on what you think he sold them on, but in practice he was simply a supply-side keynesian. If in fact he did \*adequately \*sell people on what you think he sold them on, the U.S. would be in better fiscal shape. The real legacy of Reagan is his ability to sell true fiscal conservatism down the river by embracing supply-side keynesianism. Dick Cheney bridged the gap from the birth of right wing keynesianism during the Reagan era to its apotheosis in the GWB era, the rest is history. [David Stockman](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/31/opinion/sunday/sundown-in-america.html?_r=0) > [@](#): > > But in practice, “supply-side” was just Keynesian economics for the prosperous classes—that is, it ended-up being a scheme to goose the GDP aggregates by drawing down Uncle Sam’s credit card and then passing along the borrowings to so-called “job creators” thru tax cuts rather than to dim-witted bureaucrats thru spending schemes. Indeed, the circumstances of my own ex-communication from the supply-side church underscore the Reaganite embrace of the Keynesian gospel. Read the whole thing. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2014, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/34 "2014-02-21T19:49:18Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Reagan \*might \*have sold people on what you think he sold them on, but in practice he was simply a supply-side keynesian. If in fact he did \*adequately \*sell people on what you think he sold them on, the U.S. would be in better fiscal shape. Based on those ideas abandoned in the 1930s? Not likely. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2014, 7:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/35 "2014-02-23T07:40:21Z")
> [@For You](#): > > My question is whether it is possible to find valid information about the real short and long term effects of Reagan Administration policies. Reagan’s 1986 amnesty for illegal aliens set off a baby boom. Ironically, a large proportion of which are likely to vote Democrat 😃 > [@](#): > > Between 1987 and 1991, total fertility rates for foreign-born Hispanics [in California] increased from 3.2 to 4.4 [expected babies per woman over her lifetime]. This dramatic rise was the primary force behind the overall increase in the state’s total fertility rate during this period. Were it not for the large increase in fertility among Hispanic immigrants, fertility rates in California would have increased very little between 1987 and 1991. > > "Why did total fertility rates increase so dramatically for Hispanic immigrants? First, the composition of the Hispanic immigrant population in California changed as a result of the Immigration Reform and Control Act (IRCA) of 1986. In California alone, 1.6 million unauthorized immigrants applied for amnesty (legal immigrant status) under this act. The vast majority were young men, and many were agricultural workers who settled permanently in the United States. > > Previous research indicates that many of those granted amnesty were joined later by spouses and relatives in the United States… As a result, many young adult Hispanic women came to California during the late 1980s. We also know that unauthorized immigrants tend to have less education than other immigrants and that they are more likely to come from rural areas. Both characteristics are associated with high levels of fertility. As a result, changes in the composition of the Hispanic immigration population probably increased fertility rates. > “Another possible reason for the sudden increase in fertility rates for Hispanic immigrants is also related to IRCA. Because many of those granted amnesty and their spouses had been apart for some time, their reunion in California prompted a “catch-up” effect in the timing of births…” Laura E. Hill & Hans P. Johnson “[Understanding the Future of Californians’ Fertility: The Role of Immigrants](http://www.ppic.org/content/pubs/report/R_402LHR.pdf):” Public Policy Institute of California ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2014, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/36 "2014-02-23T09:42:51Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > That is, please name the **powers** as well as the administrations. Rumsfeld, Bush Sr and Cheney. They were the power behind Reagan’s throne, reigned in the open under Bush Sr and used a stooge again with Bush Jr. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2014, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/37 "2014-02-24T11:37:41Z")
> [@Latro](#): > > Rumsfeld, Bush Sr and Cheney. > > They were the power behind Reagan’s throne, reigned in the open under Bush Sr and used a stooge again with Bush Jr. With secret sealed orders from the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy! ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2014, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/38 "2014-02-24T12:17:23Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > With secret sealed orders from the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy! Right, yes, if you call it a conspiracy you can just handwave away the obvious. Have a chuckle and move along. Nothing to see here. ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2014, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/39 "2014-02-25T03:33:27Z")
I didn’t live during his presidency, but I’m amazed at how a man who won 49 states in his re-election bid has been so thoroughly trashed by historical revisionism. Makes me really believe in liberal bias among the so-called intellectual elite. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2014, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695/40 "2014-02-25T03:55:50Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > I didn’t live during his presidency, but I’m amazed at how a man who won 49 states in his re-election bid has been so thoroughly trashed by historical revisionism. > > Makes me really believe in liberal bias among the so-called intellectual elite. Some things look better in hindsight than they did at the time, and some things look worse, and hindsight is usually right. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-did-reagan-effect/681695.md?page=3)