# What difference would it make if Atheist ruled the world? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 2, 2013, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188 "2013-10-02T15:48:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/341 "2013-10-03T18:07:46Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > If you just really have a serious need to find fault in me, why not just ask me and I will give you a list of my faults, then you can just rail on them? We’ll get to that… but first, can you address this list that was provided to you on [page 3](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16719811&postcount=130) and which you dismissed after a single click on Australian Atheists. After all, it addresses your OP quite well by listing the various contributions that atheist organizations make that benefit humanity without the need for moral dictates from the Christian bible. ---
**Author:** ![Mickiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/0ea827/32.png) [@Mickiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mickiel)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/342 "2013-10-03T18:10:35Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > We’ll get to that… but first, can you address this list that was provided to you on [page 3](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16719811&postcount=130) and which you dismissed after a single click on Australian Atheists. > > After all, it addresses your OP quite well by listing the various contributions that atheist organizations make that benefit humanity without the need for moral dictates from the Christian bible. I thought the list was impressive, but they mostly seemed self serving to me; but I was still impressed with it. It showed Atheism is widespread, which would help if you ruled the world. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/343 "2013-10-03T18:10:47Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > You have talents that can cause the things that are not good for dialog in threads. The power to cloud men’s minds?! ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/344 "2013-10-03T18:13:20Z")
Who’s been forbidding Mickiel to post lists? What is this… not-see Germany? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/345 "2013-10-03T18:13:55Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > I thought the list was impressive, but they mostly seemed self serving to me; but I was still impressed with it. It showed Atheism is widespread, which would help if you ruled the world. Dismissive and insulting at the same time-How sweet. It’s a damnsight better then the vague and defective list _you_ provided in the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/346 "2013-10-03T18:15:30Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > I thought the list was impressive, but they mostly seemed self serving to me; but I was still impressed with it. It showed Atheism is widespread, which would help if you ruled the world. Self-serving compared to whom? Certainly not the vast fortunes spent by religions to proselytize. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/347 "2013-10-03T18:15:59Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Who’s been forbidding Mickiel to post lists? What is this… not-see Germany? Nobody’s forbidden him to make lists. ---
**Author:** ![Mickiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/0ea827/32.png) [@Mickiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mickiel)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/348 "2013-10-03T18:16:36Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Who’s been forbidding Mickiel to post lists? What is this… not-see Germany? Well I am told I can post list, but it was also told to me to debate rather than to list; so I am debating. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/349 "2013-10-03T18:17:50Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > Can you show me where I ever said" Because I said so", I would like to see that? The “because I said so” was shorthand for the longer statement “_You post stuff that you believe to be true without offering a shred of evidence that your opinion is supported by any facts, whatsoever._” An example of such a post would be [this one](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=16713136#post16713136), in which you provide a long list of things that you assert must be true or things that you demand to know how they can otherwise exist than in your belief system. In point of fact, you are merely asserting your beliefs without support. We could probably take the time to explain how each of those points is in error, but your responses to similar exchanges have been to simply deny them, again without supporting evidence. No one is going to invest the time and energy to give a sufficient explanatory correction to your errors simply to have you blow them off. To take just one example: > [@](#): > > Language; is taught! Case closed! Who taught man? The statement is worthless. Language occurs in numerous species and there are scientific explanations for how that mechanism of communication has arisen. They are very much involved with the evolutionary development of humans from the species that preceded humans. As to being “taught,” that is a fairly complex interplay between the developing brain, the environment, and other speakers that cannot be reduced to “taught” in the way that you laid it out. When you declare as a fact something that we know to be an error without even bothering to try to explain how it _might_ (despite actual evidence) be true, that is the equivalent of saying “Because I said so.” ---
**Author:** ![Mickiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/0ea827/32.png) [@Mickiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mickiel)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/350 "2013-10-03T18:18:10Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Self-serving compared to whom? Certainly not the vast fortunes spent by religions to proselytize. Well I clicked on 7 or 8 different countries and they promoted themselves, but I saw nothingelse they promoted for humanity. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/351 "2013-10-03T18:19:53Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > Well I am told I can post list, but it was also told to me to debate rather than to list; so I am debating. You are? It looks more like you’re demanding explanations while not reading the ones you’ve already been given nor providing any of your own. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/352 "2013-10-03T18:21:02Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > Well I am told I can post list, but it was also told to me to debate rather than to list; so I am debating. no - you’re not. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/353 "2013-10-03T18:21:54Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > Well I clicked on 7 or 8 different countries and they promoted themselves, but I saw nothingelse they promoted for humanity. Why do you refuse to defend your own list from the OP? ---
**Author:** ![Mickiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/0ea827/32.png) [@Mickiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mickiel)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/354 "2013-10-03T18:22:11Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > The “because I said so” was shorthand for the longer statement “_You post stuff that you believe to be true without offering a shred of evidence that your opinion is supported by any facts, whatsoever._” > > An example of such a post would be [this one](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=16713136#post16713136), in which you provide a long list of things that you assert must be true or things that you demand to know how they can otherwise exist than in your belief system. > In point of fact, you are merely asserting your beliefs without support. We could probably take the time to explain how each of those points is in error, but your responses to similar exchanges have been to simply deny them, again without supporting evidence. No one is going to invest the time and energy to give a sufficient explanatory correction to your errors simply to have you blow them off. > > To take just one example:The statement is worthless. Language occurs in numerous species and there are scientific explanations for how that mechanism of communication has arisen. They are very much involved with the evolutionary development of humans from the species that preceded humans. As to being “taught,” that is a fairly complex interplay between the developing brain, the environment, and other speakers that cannot be reduced to “taught” in the way that you laid it out. > > When you declare as a fact something that we know to be an error without even bothering to try to explain how it _might_ (despite actual evidence) be true, that is the equivalent of saying “Because I said so.” I could have went into a comprehensive explination for each one on the list, but it was simply too long and I did not want to take the time to do so; but as you say I would, Atheists would only reject the paragraphs of explinations as they would the list. So I learned from that experience, not to make any more list. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/355 "2013-10-03T18:22:29Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > Well I clicked on 7 or 8 different countries and they promoted themselves, but I saw nothingelse they promoted for humanity. You’re using [this article](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_secular_organizations), right? It’s a list of secular **ist** organizations, one that exist to promote secularism. If you want a list of secular charities, try [this.](http://www.freethoughtpedia.com/wiki/Secular_charities) It turns out organizations like Goodwill, Oxfam, and Doctors Without Borders do plenty for humanity. ---
**Author:** ![Mickiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/0ea827/32.png) [@Mickiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mickiel)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/356 "2013-10-03T18:23:47Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > You are? It looks more like you’re demanding explanations while not reading the ones you’ve already been given nor providing any of your own. I am demanding explinations and I am not debating? So just what do you suggest I do differently? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/357 "2013-10-03T18:24:05Z")
The prohibition on lists was placed on simply throwing out a list of words or phrases that Mickiel believed made some point when there was no explanation or argument to support them. There was no prohibition against providing a list of authors or sources or against responding to a direct question with a list of items that answered the question. The prohibition was on the sort of post to which I linked in my last post or, worse, to Mickiel’s post that preceded it that included nothing but the first word in each sentence in the post to which I linked. Now. Let us everyone drop the topic of lists. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Mickiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/0ea827/32.png) [@Mickiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mickiel)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/358 "2013-10-03T18:25:48Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > You’re using [this article](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_secular_organizations), right? It’s a list of secular **ist** organizations, one that exist to promote secularism. If you want a list of secular charities, try [this.](http://www.freethoughtpedia.com/wiki/Secular_charities) It turns out organizations like Goodwill, Oxfam, and Doctors Without Borders do plenty for humanity. Well at first glance, that list seems to be much better and not self serving. This is what Atheist would need if they ruled the world. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/359 "2013-10-03T18:27:39Z")
> [@Mickiel](#): > > Well at first glance, that list seems to be much better and not self serving. This is what Atheist would need if they ruled the world. Atheist ruling the world is your particular hang-up. No one else’s. ---
**Author:** ![Mickiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/0ea827/32.png) [@Mickiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mickiel)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188/360 "2013-10-03T18:28:59Z")
Well anyway, as we near the closing of this thread, I do see some signs now, which I did not see at first, that Atheist could indeed rule this world; but I have seen no evidence that such a rule would make the world " Much" different than it is now. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-difference-would-it-make-if-atheist-ruled-the-world/670188.md?page=19)