What do childless old people do when they decline in health?

Sadly, this is the correct answer for millions of people in America. There’s no comfortable ending to life; instead, it’s being reduced to poverty, relying on charity, and eventually dying, hopefully without too much pain. Thankfully Medicaid provides some semblance of healthcare, but there’s no soft landing spot unless you’ve made it for yourself.

Usually, this is in the form of investments. Ideally, though, a person doesn’t just have savings. They also have passive income - things like rental properties, that provide money without you having to do any work.

Additionally, if you own your home free and clear, a reverse mortgage - which is basically a pledge to give the bank an encumbrance over your home when you die in exchange for regular periodic payments to you - might be a consideration for some income.

But life comes at you fast. You can be on this sort of track and then some tragedy arises - it can range from personal to global. And suddenly the best laid plans go awry.

That’s when family typically comes in. To the OP, in the absence of such people, I suppose a person is back to poverty, charity, and then perishing.

Again, long term care insurance can be an option as long as you get it in place before you need it. The ones I looked at cover in-home as well as nursing home care.

@Broomstick has an excellent point, and it’s one we don’t seem to do a lot of in the US - cultivate friends of all ages. You may not make close enough friends with someone of a younger generation that they’ll want move you in with them so they can wipe your butt and puree your carrots, but having someone to visit you in The Home really does help elderly people maintain their spirits and it doesn’t hurt for care staff to know someone will notice your condition. And it’s fun to get to know people who aren’t in the same age group besides!

Medical care, generally, has usually gone up in price faster than inflation, yes. Per the Kaiser Family Foundation, since 2000 medical care prices (services, drugs, eqipment, insurance, etc) have increased by 110%, while consumer goods and services rose 71%.

Medicare may cover short-term nursing home care, if the purpose of the admission is rehabilitation, and IIRC this only pays for 30 days.

I started a related thread here a few years ago, about whether children might be on the hook for a parent’s nursing home care. In short, no, unless they co-signed for the financial responsibility.

If I ever make it to be old (and ill) enough that this will become a issue, I’ll probably just choose to not live anymore. This will be relatively easy since I’ll likely have no friends, family or relatives (or at least no relatives that I’ve had any contact with for decades by that point).

Sadly, most suicide (and even general mental health) awareness and recources are concentrated in younger age groups even though suicide rates among the elderly are much higher. At least all the rates have gone down the past 20 years (although not for the US specifically).

Whether it’s things like ageism, loneliness, lack of public or private resources, illness, chronic pain etc, old people seem pretty neglected. And with an aging population in many places, things will continue to get worse I fear.

I just wanted to piggyback on this point:

Also see: major win-win

I apologize to any American Exceptionalists who take offense to me posting this here :wink:

Both long-term care and medical expenses in general have gone up considerably over the rate of inflation over the last 50 years:

https://www.seniorliving.org/history/1950-1970-nursing-home-population-and-costs/

According to the site above, annual nursing home costs averaged $5,300 in 1970, when today’s 70 year olds were just starting their working lives, and today’s 80 and 90 year olds of course that much further into them, though most still arguably in the “early” part.

And the cost was $90,156 in 2019 (semi-private room, but I doubt there were many private rooms in 1970)

$5,300 in 1950 is equivalent in purchasing power to about $65,270.71 today.

So going just by inflation, long-term care should have cost about 65K a year; instead it costs about 90K. And that’s conflating “nursing home” in 1970 to “long-term care” (which generally covers a broader range, including somewhat less expensive services) in 2019 – and 2019 was four years ago.

I had trouble finding the equivalent figures for medical costs, but here’s some info:

On a per capita basis, health spending has increased sharply in the last five decades, from $353 per person in 1970 to $12,531 in 2020. In constant 2020 dollars, the increase was from $1,875 in 1970 to $12,531 in 2020.

so there’s an increase of more than 6x even after adjusting for inflation. That’s over all ages; the costs for older people are of course a lot higher:

those between 65 and 74 spend about $13,000 a year on health care. That jumps to $24,000 between 75 and 84 and then rises to $39,000 for those over the age of 85

For the purposes of the discussion, I think these are good rough estimates for various forms of elder care

$20-25/hr for at home assistance
$500-1000/month in fees (in addition to mortgage/utilities) to live in a senior community
$4000/month assisted living
$8000/month nursing home

Granted its a lot cheaper overseas. I think its only $1500/month for nursing home care in mexico.

Also again people don’t stay ‘that’ long in assisted living or nursing homes. There are outliers who spend years and years which pushes up the average, but the majority of people who go into a nursing home are dead within 6 months or so.

One issue is the labor shortage we are going to see as the population declines and the elderly population grows. There won’t be enough people to take care of the elderly. Maybe/hopefully there will be advances in robotics who can save on labor and increase independence, but theres no guarantee that the tech will be mature enough within 30-40 years.

In the west, we may have large amounts of immigration from the developing world to address the labor shortage, but that just means that in their home countries the problems will be even more pronounced.

Setting aside all the (well-founded) financial discussions, an elderly person is simply less effectual as an adult. Even if no dementia is involved, they often have a harder time making decisions, a harder time doing practical things, a harder time hearing or using a telephone, and a much harder time learning about new things, such as changes to tax or financial legislation or products.

My late MIL was one such. Here’s the story of her last few years, which story came to an end in spring of 2021. Up to age 90(!) she was living on her own in a rented apartment and managing all her own affairs adequately. Had way more money than she needed for her simple middle-class tastes.

Over the next couple of years she became much less capable. Bills piled up unpaid although she had plenty of money. She quit cooking for herself and despite a lifelong disdain for any/all restaurant food as badly prepared, began to live on Meals-on-Wheels food. Which are little better than Swanson TV dinners.

At her request, and with her complete understanding, she relinquished day-to-day management of her bills, assets, & paperwork to us. She’d had everything in a trust for years, but we’d been inactive trustees and she’d been the one doing everything. Not anymore. Now she watched and we worked.

A bit later she decided on her own to move from a regular apartment into an elder care facility. “Independent living” specifically. Which is a great invention. You get a decent 1BR apartment with a small kitchen, basic maid service, a restaurant down the hall, recreational activities and some transportation. It’s like being back in the college dorms. Everybody is the same age, has the same interests and problems, etc. The environment is designed to help you succeed every day, even as you inexorably slide downhill towards your end.

But she needed our help to identify which facilities were around, take her there, help her evaluate them, and eventually help her decide which one. It totally was her decision, but we had to grease the process into something simple & small enough that she could handle it. A decent metaphor is feeding a 6-yo. They can operate a fork and a spoon and a napkin just fine. But an adult needs to pre-cut their meat & vegetables; that task is just too difficult for their small weak hands & flaky coordination.

Mom could eat fine; she couldn’t decide fine. Every decision task was simply overwhelmingly complicated, although all had been pieces of cake to her just 2 years previously. If we isolated the issues and explained the tradeoffs neutrally, she could and did decide just fine. But that upstream work was beyond her.

Of course we had to select and hire the movers, box the stuff she didn’t trust them to touch, etc.

Once she was moved into independent living, it ought to have been easy enough for her. It was a great facility, and everything there is geared to the needs of slowing seniors. At first she did great there, but as she got older and physically slower and mentally more forgetful (still no dementia), even stuff like getting a lightbulb changed became too hard. She wouldn’t call the front desk; she’d call me. In her explanation, they never understood her requests correctly, but they always understood mine.

Physically of course she was getting weaker too. SHe could no longer walk, and could only go about 10 feet with a walker before she was exhausted. Otherwise she used a power-chair to get around. And her hearing eventually collapsed to the point that the telephone was useless, despite ultrahigh-powered hearing aids. We communicated face-to-face or via email. And the face-to-face was none-too reliable. What she thought she saw / heard was frequently a lot different than what we said, even though we knew to keep it simple, enunciate like mad and speak very loudly at a measured pace.

etc. etc., etc.

At age 96 years 8 months she forgot to wake up one morning. She’d run her course and died in her sleep as she had wished. The week before she was mentally capable, watched the news, could talk about both ancient history and current events, was reading a 1000 page novel, still used her computer for email, but increasingly badly by mis-remembered rote, etc. Bravo Mom: you totally got your money’s worth out of life and stretched out the clock far better than 90% of American white women, much less the rest of humanity.

But there is no way she could have lived the last 4 years without us first installing “training wheels on her bike” and later on without us pushing that bike, along with all the help she was getting from the facility. The facility was a big help. She’d still have been utterly screwed without us.


Like some folks upthread, barring WW-III I’m not concerned about my ability to pay for elder care for myself & my wife. And I do recognize what a rare position of privilege that is.

What I’m deeply concerned about is being able to hire somebody to do for me all that we did for Mom. Somebody to pay her taxes, invest her funds, pay her bills, renew her library card, take her shopping, take her out for her birthday, help her buy new shoes, get a haircut, and a thousand other trivial tasks of adulthood that each eventually become too hard for any elderly person to accomplish unassisted. A good facility can help a lot. But they can’t do it all; heck they can’t do even half of it.

And the problem with all these arrangements is they don’t stay arranged. We’d get Mom a good helper, and 6 months later they’d quit, or their own child was in jail, or whatever, and they’d be gone. So we had to go find Mom another new helper. Again and again and again.


Bottom line IMO:
Unless you have the good fortune to drop dead while you’re still a fully capable adult, you’re going to live through a year or 3 of wallowing incompetence as an adult. Not necessarily legal incompetence, just practical helplessness. Like an 8yo suddenly forced to fend for themselves doesn’t stand a chance, neither will you / me. Somebody somehow needs to pick up the slack or you’ll fester into a lump in a trash-filled room with unpaid bills piled up. Even if you have the funds to pay them, you won’t be able to muster the effort.

I was skeptical about the suicide rate being highest in the elderly until I got that job at the big hospital. I was also quite surprised about the extent of substance abuse, mostly alcoholism, in that population.

As noted in that thread, many states still have filial responsibility laws on the books, making adult children legally obligated to support elderly parents in need. Currently such laws are almost never enforced, but as the elderly population grows and state budgets come under increasing strain, i could see states making more of an effort to compel children.

Yeah, it’s a bit of a low-key worry. My mother passed away on Sunday after an unexpected hospital stay and needless to say it has started me thinking in my spare moments. Dealing with her hospitalization was stressful, dealing with her death has been painful, dealing with the aftermath is of course shaping up to be an utter pain in the ass.

But it was the decline the last few years before that that was worrisome. It was little things like her increasing difficulty in learning how to use a new phone (not even a smartphone I might add) or TV and somewhat bigger things like a refusal to want to engage with the internet causing me to have to step in and do more and more for her to enable her to function in society. Because unfortunately or not services are increasingly online registration only. I don’t expect to have quite her level of technological limitations, but still there are other problems that can arise and you can’t plan that well for cognitive decline much of the time. It has a way of sneaking up on people.

While in the midst of this stuff with my mother I got a call saying it was time to have another colonoscopy. Woo-hoo. But as I was working out the logistics of getting a ride home, I realized that was just one more thing that might become slightly more complex in the future. This year? No problem. Five years? Probably not too difficult. Ten? fifteen? Might have to start investigating medical transportation services (no Uber, Lyft or cab is allowed).

I’m not losing sleep over it yet, but it’s on my mind and I’m definitely not looking forward to the decline. No sirree bob.

You have my deepest condolences. I feel pretty comfortable saying that I speak for quite a few Dopers.

How do you account for that stroke that disables you, but doesn’t take you out. Now you are incapacitated and can’t follow through with your plans that you said you would do.

My experience shows this happens a lot, and those people who said they would take themselves out; don’t account for a sudden incapacitating event.

I’m curious if your brother ever got on board with the situation, seeing how happy your mom was after she moved in with you.

My brother didn’t live in the same city – nor, indeed, even in the same country – he lived in New York City, and we were in Ontario. But he was a fair-minded guy, and he and his wife helped us navigate through the bureaucracy of home-care services. His wife was of particular assistance, since she had worked in Ontario social services and knew the processes and still had contacts with many of the key people. So, although we never discussed the issue again, I think he implicitly acknowledged that Mom was doing fine at our house, and did everything he could to help.

That’s good to hear!

I’m sorry for your loss, Tamarlane.

I’m noticing the same cognitive decline in my mother (pushing 80). She’s fine for everyday tasks and managing finances, mostly because the complex stuff has already been outsourced to professionals, but nevertheless it’s hard to take, and I’d say she’s still at about 90% of normal.

My own plan’s step one is “don’t return to the USA.” I just don’t trust the healthcare system there to look out for my welfare. I am a childless only child, and the relatives I’m closest to are almost all older or roughly my age. So family will be no help. It’s a worry. Mostly I’m doing what Broomstick is doing (well, numbers 1, 2, and 4—it may come to three, but right now spouse and I can rely on each other).

I have a similar concern. I suppose if you had everything in a trust, then the trustee or person with power-of-attorney could hire a case manager? (or something like that?) Or you could research case managers before you become incompetent and communicate your wishes to the trustee or POA?