# What do Episcopalians stand for? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 14, 2004, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857 "2004-12-14T21:20:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2004, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/1 "2004-12-14T21:20:02Z")
I’m sorry if I’ve butchered the spelling, I’ve seen it two different ways, please correct me. Anyway, to our mutual embarrasment my boyfriend just found out that his family is Episcopalian. (obviously non-practicing. Embarrasing because we didn’t know, not that there’s anything embarrasing about being E- that religion in the first place). Can anyone either tell me a little about them, or refer me to a website? I’ve tried [religioustolerance.org](http://religioustolerance.org), but it seems to be quite difficult to narrow down a specific sect of Christianity. I tried Google, but I keep getting churches of this religion. I don’t want churches until I have a basic idea of what the faith stands for, who started it, etc. We are not planning to take it up. We just want knowledge/information. ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2004, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/2 "2004-12-14T21:27:08Z")
You may have had better luck searching for “anglican church in the US” which is more or less what the Episcopalian church is. [http://www.dfms.org/life.htm](http://www.dfms.org/life.htm) and [http://www.episcopalian.org/](http://www.episcopalian.org/) might give you some of what you’re looking for. ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2004, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/3 "2004-12-14T21:33:18Z")
I was going to say, “They stand for communion and for singing hymns, and sit for the rest of the service” until I read your post. :smack: I was not a full-fledged member of the Episcopal church but I attended for a while and was married in one. As best I recall the church is a descendant of the Anglican church (Church of England), which was a split-off of the Catholic church. I think the split resulted from some sort of rift between the church and the reigning monarch. Beliefs are similar to Catholicism but more liberal, including married priests. In fact, IIRC, the priest who married me left the Catholic church so he could get married (to a Catholic nun, who also joined the Episcopal church). Tons of Googleable material, such as [this.](http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/society/A0858019.html) ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2004, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/4 "2004-12-14T21:34:33Z")
I should have linked to [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=291601) thread. Not directly on the topic but has some information you may find useful. More directly to what the Episcopalian church stands for they recently consecrated an openly gay bishop who is living with a partner so they seem to be putting their money where their mouth when it comes to standing for gay rights. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2004, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/5 "2004-12-14T22:31:49Z")
> [@CookingWithGas](#): > > I was going to say, “They stand for communion and for singing hymns, and sit for the rest of the service” until I read your post. :smack: > > I was not a full-fledged member of the Episcopal church but I attended for a while and was married in one. As best I recall the church is a descendant of the Anglican church (Church of England), which was a split-off of the Catholic church. I think the split resulted from some sort of rift between the church and the reigning monarch. No fairl I was going to answer that…pout. Anyway, mrAru is episcopalian, and we joke about him being Catholic Light…all the ceremony and half the guilt 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2004, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/6 "2004-12-14T22:34:29Z")
I will give you the short version and I will use a phrase that some consider offensive but I don’t care because I am Episcopalian. The offensive phrase is that Episcopalian = Catholic Lite. That is partially true because Episcopalian church services are very similar to Catholic church services. It is not true because the Episcopal church is one of the more liberal chuches around. Episcopal churches are not under the control of the Pope or any other of the Cathoic hierachy. Leaders of individual churches are called priests but priest can marry, have kids, and even be female. My priest is great and she is a female. Episcopalians also embrace members of other churches and they can take communion and participate just like anyone else. Becoming a member basically just involves going to church and saying that you want to be one. ---
**Author:** ![moriah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b2d939/32.png) [@moriah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moriah)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2004, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/7 "2004-12-14T23:28:23Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > The offensive phrase is that Episcopalian = Catholic Lite. That is partially true because Episcopalian church services are very similar to Catholic church services. It is not true because the Episcopal church is one of the more liberal chuches around. Which is why the (offensive?) joke is that it is ‘Lite,’ i.e., missing the stricter hierarchy and legal requirements of the more conservative RCC. * * * \*\*What do Episcopalians stand for? \*\* I witnessed an Episcopalian service once, and I saw them all stand for the Creed. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/8 "2004-12-15T00:44:35Z")
But it is still heirarchical. So, they have a (for lack of a better word) [denominational wide web site](http://www.ecusa.anglican.org/index_flash.htm). [This](http://www.ecusa.anglican.org/seekers.htm) is the visitors’ section of the site, and [here is the section](http://www.ecusa.anglican.org/17041_16976_ENG_HTM.htm?menu=undefined) called “What is the Episcopal Church about?” ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/9 "2004-12-15T00:53:58Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > . . . Becoming a member basically just involves going to church and saying that you want to be one. There is the little matter of baptism, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/10 "2004-12-15T01:13:47Z")
> [@UDS](#): > > There is the little matter of baptism, of course. But note that a baptism from any denomination will do. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/11 "2004-12-15T01:55:24Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > But note that a baptism from any denomination will do. …so long as it’s “in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.” A non-Trinitarian Baptism is not necessarily valid; I think it’d be up to the Bishop to ascertain its validity. There’s no quick-and-easy answer to the OP. The Baptismal Covenant promised by or for every Episcopalian at Baptism and renewed several times a year – at the Easter Vigil service at minimum – probably says what we believe best: > [@The Book of Common Prayer](#): > > **The Baptismal Covenant** > > _Celebrant:_ Do you believe in God the Father? > > _People:_ I believe in God, the Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth. > > \*Celebrant Do you believe in Jesus Christ, the Son of God? > > _People:_ I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord. > He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit and born of the Virgin Mary. > He suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried. > He descended to the dead. > On the third day he rose again. > He ascended into heaven, and is seated at the right hand of the Father. > He will come again to judge the living and the dead. > > _Celebrant:_ Do you believe in God the Holy Spirit? > > \*People:/i] I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy catholic Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body, and the life everlasting. > > _Celebrant:_ Will you continue in the apostles’ teaching and fellowship, in the breaking of bread, and in the prayers? > > _People:_ I will, with God’s help. > > _Celebrant:_ Will you persevere in resisting evil, and, whenever you fall into sin, repent and return to the Lord? > > _People:_ I will, with God’s help. > > _Celebrant:_ Will you proclaim by word and example the Good News of God in Christ? > > _People:_ I will, with God’s help. > > _Celebrant:_ Will you seek and serve Christ in all persons, loving your neighbor as yourself? > > _People:_ I will, with God’s help. > > _Celebrant:_ Will you strive for justice and peace among all people, and respect the dignity of every human being? > > _People:_ I will, with God’s help. Obviously, the first three questions and responses are a dialogue form of the Apostles’ Creed. Taking the contents seriously, particularly the last five questions added onto it, is a part of what makes us what we are. However, it needs to be added that there’s room for questioning, debate, and exploring intelligent answers in the Episcopal Church – the idea that somebody has All The Answers cadged from the Bible and glued together into a theological edifice like a six-year-old with a pile of balsa wood and library paste is not a part of who we are. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/12 "2004-12-15T02:22:03Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > …so long as it’s “in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.” A non-Trinitarian Baptism is not necessarily valid; I think it’d be up to the Bishop to ascertain its validity. Out of curisiosity, where (if anywhere) is that spelled out? The only language I’ve ever seen has been an unqualified “any Christian denomination.” Is it a diocesan thing? ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/13 "2004-12-15T04:30:54Z")
Anaamika writes: \> Anyway, to our mutual embarrasment my boyfriend just found out that his \> family is Episcopalian. In just what sense is your boyfriend’s family Episcopalian if it’s so little discussed in the family that your boyfriend can suddenly discover that they are Episcopalian? ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/14 "2004-12-15T06:36:56Z")
When I was a 12-year old Presbyterian, going through the “joining the church” seminar, we visited an Episcopalian church, and some others. The Episcopal cleric said their service involved several changes from sitting to standing and kneeling. The traditional Episcopalian joke has an old sea captain visiting one Sunday. He keeps up with all the popping up and down pretty well. Later, he tells the parson it was his first time in an Episcopal church. The preacher says, “Well, you kept up with us alright, for a beginner.” The cap’n says, “Well, I’m an old sailor. I know how to rise and fall with the tide.” The newer joke says there are no Episcopalian chess masters. They can’t tell a bishop from a queen. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/15 "2004-12-15T07:25:36Z")
I was raised Episcopalian, in the same church that Ruth Gordon used to go to. I just learned that there are more LDS than Episcopalians. That really surprised me. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/16 "2004-12-15T15:39:57Z")
> [@Wendell Wagner](#): > > Anaamika writes: > > \> Anyway, to our mutual embarrasment my boyfriend just found out that his > \> family is Episcopalian. > > In just what sense is your boyfriend’s family Episcopalian if it’s so little discussed in the family that your boyfriend can suddenly discover that they are Episcopalian? I didn’t ask his mother. It just came out casually, as we were walking in Queens. He asked her something like, “We’re Buddhists, right?” and she said, “No, we’re all Episcopalian. You, too.” It was something of a surprise. As far as I can tell, they don’t go to church or anything. His parents are baptized. He isn’t. And thank you everyone for information. We certainly don’t plan to join the church, myself especially (I’m a godless heathen!) But I think the \*study \* of religion is fascinating. I just never had a reason to study a particular sect of Christianity before. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/17 "2004-12-15T15:59:15Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > I didn’t ask his mother. It just came out casually, as we were walking in Queens. He asked her something like, “We’re Buddhists, right?” and she said, “No, we’re all Episcopalian. You, too.” It was something of a surprise. That has to be both one of the funniest and saddest things that I have read in a while. It sounds like they are a really tight nit bunch. ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/18 "2004-12-15T17:46:02Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > I didn’t ask his mother. It just came out casually, as we were walking in Queens. He asked her something like, “We’re Buddhists, right?” and she said, “No, we’re all Episcopalian. You, too.” It was something of a surprise. That tops me. When I was five they asked us in school what religion we were just in case one of us were forbidden by faith from saying the pledge of allegance. I wasn’t sure but I knew I was baptized so I answered Baptist. I was in fact baptized in the Sacred Heart church as a Roman Catholic but my young mind didn’t make this connection. I was later soon enrolled in catechism where a big lady with a steel ruler set me straight on such topics. At least they are nominally closer than Episcopalian and Buddhist :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/19 "2004-12-15T18:39:37Z")
> [@moriah](#): > > Which is why the (offensive?) joke is that it is ‘Lite,’ i.e., missing the stricter hierarchy and legal requirements of the more conservative RCC. > > * * * > > \*\*What do Episcopalians stand for? \*\* > > I witnessed an Episcopalian service once, and I saw them all stand for the Creed. LOL, remind me to tell MrAru he has to be offended at himself as HE is the one who calls it catholic light…and his mother, sister, her kids…his grandparents… aunts, uncles and cousins… sheesh Shag, more people need to remove sticks from fundaments and learn that people make jokes about themselves. Many of the best jewish jokes are TOLD by jewish commedians. I even know a catholic priest who commented [when walking up behind a pair of kids who just made the joke “bear catholic? Pope shit in the woods”] that since the current pope was an avid camper, that yes indeed the pope has shat in the woods onnumerous occasions. ---
**Author:** ![Mollie\_Magill](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mollie_magill/32/20882_2.png) [@Mollie\_Magill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mollie_Magill)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857/20 "2004-12-15T19:02:31Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > I didn’t ask his mother. It just came out casually, as we were walking in Queens. He asked her something like, “We’re Buddhists, right?” and she said, “No, we’re all Episcopalian. You, too.” It was something of a surprise. > > As far as I can tell, they don’t go to church or anything. His parents are baptized. He isn’t. If that’s the case, then he isn’t Episcopalian. I’d always heard “Catholic lite. Same great taste, one third less guilt.” From my (Catholic) best friend. Regarding “discovering” you are actually a member of a different faith: When my wfe and I were joining the church where we’re now members, my wife discovered she had been baptized solely as a catholic, not jointly like her broght and sister. I asked her if I needed to ask the pope’s permission to marry her. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-episcopalians-stand-for/279857.md?page=2)