# What do righties have against the ACLU? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 7, 2008, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257 "2008-04-07T01:02:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/1 "2008-04-07T01:02:41Z")
In [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=9659385&posted=1#post9659385) about a Muslim civil rights case in a prison, a couple of posters have offered up a couple of snarky comments about the ACLU and implied that it is in some way anti-Christian or in some other way unsavory. I’ve often heard conservatives bashing the ACLU, but I’ve never heard a clear explanation as to what is supposed to be so terrible about them. So enlighten me, righties. What do you have against an organization which fights for YOUR civil rights? Does anybody want to defend the meme that they’re anti-Christian? I suspect that no one will be able to articulate any convincing argument for why the ACLU should be viewed in a negative light. Prove me wrong. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/2 "2008-04-07T01:08:37Z")
not really snarky but you have to expect that when something you value is challenged and taken away, and at times it seems as though you’re losing your complete right of freedom of religion, well, of course you’re going to question the group that tries to take your rights away. It’s that easy… ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/3 "2008-04-07T01:09:14Z")
I think [this](http://www.aclu.org/religion/govtfunding/26526res20060824.html) will be informative, a long, long list of many times the ACLU has fought for the rights of Christians to exercise their religion ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/4 "2008-04-07T01:10:53Z")
**JohnnieEnigma** , could you elaborate on which rights have been taken away? ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/5 "2008-04-07T01:12:11Z")
Look there’s a real perception of the aclu trying to eliminate christianity in our culture… I’m just telling you because the perception really exists. If you did a search on “aclu abolishing christianity” you would find so many sites rationalizing this… Here’s one column by Chuck Norris: [http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE\_ID=53317](http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53317) ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/6 "2008-04-07T01:13:48Z")
[QUOTE=Sublight] **JohnnieEnigma** , could you elaborate on which rights have been taken away? [/QUOTE] I could give you many examples of where christians felt their religious rights were being violated, but it could fill a book. I kid you not. All you have to do is a simple google search to see what I’m referring to.. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/7 "2008-04-07T01:14:36Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] Look there’s a real perception of the aclu trying to eliminate christianity in our culture… I’m just telling you because the perception really exists. If you did a search on “aclu abolishing christianity” you would find so many sites rationalizing this.. Here’s one column by Chuck Norris: [http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE\_ID=53317](http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53317) [/QUOTE] Chuck Norris is a moron. I would like to see a real cite of the ACLU either trying to “take away” a right or tring to “abolish Christianity.” ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/8 "2008-04-07T01:15:49Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] I could give you many examples of where christians felt their religious rights were being violated, but it could fill a book. I kid you not. All you have to do is a simple google search to see what I’m referring to.. [/QUOTE] I don’t care how “many Christians feel.” I know that many of them have a _perception_ that the ACLU is out to get them. What I’m trying to find is a single shred of evidence that their perceptions are justified. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/9 "2008-04-07T01:18:55Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] I don’t care how “many Christians feel.” I know that many of them have a _perception_ that the ACLU is out to get them. What I’m trying to find is a single shred of evidence that their perceptions are justified. [/QUOTE] sure a lot of of the perception is probably based on hysteria after a lawsuit challenging the freedom of practicing christianity is filed, and I’ll try to find exact examples that would have slayed the christian right into feeling this way. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/10 "2008-04-07T01:19:22Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] I don’t care how “many Christians feel.” I know that many of them have a _perception_ that the ACLU is out to get them. What I’m trying to find is a single shred of evidence that their perceptions are justified. [/QUOTE] Mt. Soledad Cross The Seal of the City of Los Angeles The Boy Scouts of America using military land for campouts The Sea Scouts getting a cheap lease for slip for their boats. Each of these situations shows the ACLU going after a religious organization or symbol. The ACLU has a point (that has been supported in court) that each of these is the government supporting a religious organization. However - these actions certainly make the perception justified. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/11 "2008-04-07T01:21:38Z")
The Chuck Norris column at the World Nut Daily site offers only whines about the ACLU going after the misuse of state property for religious displays. If those same public buildings were used for Muslim or Wiccan displays, fundies like Chuck Norris would have embolisms. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/12 "2008-04-07T01:22:29Z")
here is a quote from Roger baldwin: As Roger Baldwin (a co-founder of the ACLU) said of the goals of the ACLU: "I am for socialism, disarmament, and ultimately, for abolishing the state itself… I seek social ownership of property, the abolition of the properties class, and sole control of those who produce wealth. Communism is the goal. I don’t regret being part of the communist tactic. I knew what I was doing. I was not an innocent liberal. I wanted what the communists wanted, and I traveled the United Front road to get it. So when you have a co-founder pushing communism, you automatically think christianity is threatened. [http://jcb.pentex-net.com/archives/2005/09/is\_the\_aclu\_ant.html](http://jcb.pentex-net.com/archives/2005/09/is_the_aclu_ant.html) ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/13 "2008-04-07T01:22:46Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] sure a lot of of the perception is probably based on hysteria after a lawsuit challenging the freedom of practicing christianity is filed, and I’ll try to find exact examples that would have slayed the christian right into feeling this way. [/QUOTE] I’d love to see a single case of the ACLU trying to challenge the free practice of _any_ religion. My guess is you’ll find nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/14 "2008-04-07T01:23:51Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] here is a quote from Roger baldwin: As Roger Baldwin (a co-founder of the ACLU) said of the goals of the ACLU: "I am for socialism, disarmament, and ultimately, for abolishing the state itself… I seek social ownership of property, the abolition of the properties class, and sole control of those who produce wealth. Communism is the goal. I don’t regret being part of the communist tactic. I knew what I was doing. I was not an innocent liberal. I wanted what the communists wanted, and I traveled the United Front road to get it. So when you have a co-founder pushing communism, you automatically think christianity is threatened. [http://jcb.pentex-net.com/archives/2005/09/is\_the\_aclu\_ant.html](http://jcb.pentex-net.com/archives/2005/09/is_the_aclu_ant.html) [/QUOTE] This is not a cite for the ACLU trying to take anyone’s rights away. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/15 "2008-04-07T01:24:20Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] The Chuck Norris column at the World Nut Daily site offers only whines about the ACLU going after the misuse of state property for religious displays. If those same public buildings were used for Muslim or Wiccan displays, fundies like Chuck Norris would have embolisms. [/QUOTE] cite? After all, there ARE public spaces being used for multiple religions. Do you have a cite for their “embolisms?” > **[Boing Boing - A Directory of Mostly Wonderful Things](https://boingboing.net/)** > > Boing Boing is the Web's favorite site devoted to technology, entertainment, and culture. Launched in 1989 as a print 'zine and still... ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/16 "2008-04-07T01:26:03Z")
[QUOTE=Algher] Mt. Soledad Cross The Seal of the City of Los Angeles The Boy Scouts of America using military land for campouts The Sea Scouts getting a cheap lease for slip for their boats. Each of these situations shows the ACLU going after a religious organization or symbol. The ACLU has a point (that has been supported in court) that each of these is the government supporting a religious organization. However - these actions certainly make the perception justified. [/QUOTE] No it doesn’t. It only shows that many Christians have no comprehension of their own Constutution. Still waiting for a cite for the ACLU tryng to take anyone’s rights away. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/17 "2008-04-07T01:28:40Z")
They also tend to be against affirmative action. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/18 "2008-04-07T01:29:08Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] No it doesn’t. It only shows that many Christians have no comprehension of their own Constutution. Still waiting for a cite for the ACLU tryng to take anyone’s rights away. [/QUOTE] And is shows that others have no comprehension of the history of our nation. tell me - is it a justified perception when a minority sees anti-affimative action as being anti-minority? ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/19 "2008-04-07T01:29:34Z")
Alright this is downright hilarious. I found one site calling the ACLU American Christian Loathers Union and another site calling them the Anti-Christian Liberties Union 😃 … still looking… ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2008, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257/20 "2008-04-07T01:30:11Z")
What, my thread wasn’t good enough? > **[A Response to Anti-ACLU Sentiment](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=462762)** > > In this thread (which I didn’t want to hijack), ralph124c and ExTank et al. express a common right-wing anti-ACLU viewpoint. I think this viewpoint comes from a lack of knowledge, which is why this in GD and not the Pit. There are people who think... [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-righties-have-against-the-aclu/444257.md?page=2)