what do you think of LOST ?

[Pushkin]

@Minotaurus

LOST: the promising tv-series that i thought was a mini-series

i got tired after season 1 and only saw the 3-4 first episodes in seasons 2

this series irritated me more and more and i find it pathetic that so many are fascinated by this fraud :mad:

Hey, I’m right with you (just not as mad as you!)

I thought it was a great idea for a mini-series. Maybe akin to the Prisoner, something that asks lots of questions, answers few and is short enough that nothing really drags.

Instead we got what I find quite typical of most series on the TV these days, to make up for a lack of decent plots, an endless stream of characters is thrown at us for variety, not to give us anything better.

I can see the island getting ever more complex as the series progresses until, like the X-Files, nobody really knows how to either tie it up or leave it in a satisfying way.

From time to time I watch, but its not gripped me the way 24 has

[CalMeacham]

I have to admit that I really hate series in which the aura is all, and they abandon any sort of coherent plot or idea. Twin Peaks, I think, is the one that started it all. It was about a murder investigation, and when it started out we were struck by the radically different way it was depicted, so unlike the inhuman or puzzzler aspect you usually saw on TV. People were affected by Laura Palmer’s death, even the police. The quirky characters and the different directors; styles just added to the interest. We awaited new revelations. But the show rambled on and just got weirder. It eventually became clear that this was a scam, and that there never had been a coherent story with well thought-oout background. They wer just extemporizing. Makin’ it up as you go along. I got disgusted, and stopped watching.

It’s legitiimate to make a show (or write a novel) where you go along with the characters and see what happens. How things unfold as characters respond to stimuli consistent with what we know about them. It’s another thing to say or imply that there’s a coherent story behind all this that will come to a satisfactory conclusion, or at least that you’ll knioqw what the hell is going on, then not deliver. Twin Peaks was the first to do that. Then X-Files did. Now such series are the rage, and I don’t watch 'em – Lost, Invasion, Surface. Screw 'em. Don’t tantalize me with hints of mystery if you haven’t figured out what you’re talking about yet and never will give us a comprehensible or satisfying story line. Heck, evenm Rocky and Bullwinkle’s first 45-episode run did that!

[Larry_Mudd]

@Martini Enfield

There’s a new comedy starting on ABC here callled Absolute Power, which stars Stephen Fry and looks very promising (I caught the first episode on TV last night before work, and it was most enjoyable!),

Oooh, my pants just got tighter. (I’m a big fan of the radio show, and had no idea that a television adaptation was around.)

Anyway, I’m posting to help out Roadfood, who wondered how anyone with “an IQ above room temperature” could enjoy Lost. I might be able to lend a little insight there. I just finished watching the season finale. (Had “life” stuff to attend to, so I couldn’t watch it last night.)

Anyway, my above-mentioned friend (who caught up on the entire run of Lost within the last couple of weeks) sent me an email which said:

@Larry's oldest and best friend in the entire world

I have lots to say about last night’s Lost, but you usually do much better. Drop some science on me about it if time permits.

So I watched the show tonight with a few brews, and kept adding to an email that I kept open, with the subject “Larry’s running commentary on the Lost season finale.”

Anyone who hasn’t yet seen the show (but intends to) may want to skip by this post as it contains some minor spoilers. Skip it! Skip it now!

This is what I wrote to him, unexpurgated:

Desmond’s real name is David Hume? Hahahahaha.

That’s the philosophical trifecta, then: Locke, Rousseau, and Hume. If David Hume had one over-riding theme, it’s skepticism. This gives Desmond’s line about wondering if the whole button-pushing thing was just a head-game “every day” a little extra colour.

As for the book, I don’t remember much about it – I didn’t like it much. The main thrust of the plot is that some guy (forget his name) is forced by his father to marry a bitchy girl that he doesn’t know at all. That, or he’s out of the will. Before he can do it, though, a body turns up and gets mistaken for him. The main character gets the money instead. I don’t really know how (or if) this connects to the story yet – except that Daddy Issues are a recurring theme in Lost, and that there seems to be some ambiguity about Desmond/Hume’s identity. And of course, Desmond’s sweetie’s daddy is mucking about in ways that vaguely recall “Our Mutual Friend.”

Desmond’s estranged (and soon-to-be-married) wife’s name is “Penelope.” This goes back to the greek mythology thing that runs through Lost (Apollo, Delos, the Swans, the Arrows of Apollo, and on-and-on.) Anyway, Penelope is the wife of Odysseus. While Odysseus was off during the Trojan War, he got stranded on an island inhabited by the magical Circe… She turned all his men into pigs and Odysseus captive for a long time. While this was going on, Penelope had many suitors who wanted her to give up Odysseus for dead – until her son Telemachus freaked out and drove them away. (You might remember the analogy of “Penny,” Ulysses’ wife in O Brother Where Art Thou?)

As a side note, I’m sending you out "Seeing Other People, " which features a character named “Penelope” who’s a divorced mom seeing a new guy – and of course the kid is acting out, Telemachus style.

…but before I get sidetracked too much, I’m going to go back to the show. (Just finished the first Desmond flashback, and didn’t intend to take this long of a break to jot my thoughts down. Also spent a while chatting with Stephanie. Goddamnit, that girl drives me crazy. In a mostly good way. I’m still rambling on about this because I’m on my third beer. Speaking of Ulysses/Odysseus, in James Joyce’s Ulysses, (where Molly Bloom stands in for Penelope,) one of my favourite quotes relating to the brew I’m enjoying now (Bass #1 Ale) can be found. In a tavern, a man sits in deep contemplation of the distinctive red-triangle label:

The gods too are ever kind, Lenehan said. If I had poor luck with Bass’s mare perhaps this draught of his may serve me more propensely. He was laying his hand upon a winejar: Malachi saw it and withheld his act, pointing to the stranger and to the scarlet label. Warily, Malachi whispered, preserve a druid silence. His soul is far away. It is as painful perhaps to be awakened from a vision as to be born. Any object, intensely regarded, may be a gate of access to the incorruptible eon of the gods. Do you not think it, Stephen? Theosophos told me so, Stephen answered, whom in a previous existence Egyptian priests initiated into the mysteries of karmic law. The lords of the moon, Theosophos told me, an orangefiery shipload from planet Alpha of the lunar chain, would not assume the etheric doubles and these were therefore incarnated by the rubycoloured egos from the second constellation.

Now I know I’m on a tangent. Spent some time looking for a photoshopped picture I made based on that passage showing me raising a bottle of Bass as my mystical third eye opened. I look really goofy (nay, even drunk) when my mystical third eye opens. Back to the show, then…

…back again, and pretty soon. Desmond’s babe’s daddy is Charles Widmore – don’t know if you remember, but that name has come up a few times already. There was a sign advertising Widmore Construction outside Charlie’s recording studio, and the pregnancy test that Sun used was from Widmore Labs.

[…]

“The world’s still out there, isn’t it?” “I’m not so sure about that.” Quintessentially Hume. Hume was all about only being certain of what could be confirmed with the senses. Desmond doesn’t really believe that anything besides the island exists because he can’t see it.

[…]

…and of course, the whole thing about pushing the button comes down to the reconciliation/ opposition of reason and faith – major themes of John Locke, David Hume, and Jean-Jacques Rousseau. (Locke leans towards faith, while Hume is all reason.)

[…]

Yoon-jin Kim is unreasonably hot. When a woman is bent over vomiting, you ought not to be thinking about taking her from behind. (Sorry, fourth beer.)

[…]

Holy crap! More greek stuff. The big ol’ foot references the legendary Colosuss of Rhodes. The Colossus was a representation of Helios, the precursor to Apollo. (Apollonian stuff is all through Lost. We should talk about that some time. Apollo bars, the Swan Station, the Arrow station, the Sickness, the Island that is Apart From The Earth…) No idea about the four toes, about from “4” being one of The Numbers.

[…]

END OF PART ONE.

Holy fuck, intense scene with the revelation (for Hurley et all) about Michael. Kick him in the nuts, Hugo! Erm. (Sorry. Four beers and some bench presses and dumb-bell action.) I wish I had some MDMA. Or some weed. This is kick-ass.

[…] Huh. Desmond’s “I’m sure” about the blast doors doesn’t fit with the David Hume thing – unless he’s a structural engineer and has intimate knowledge of the station’s construction.

[…]

Did Eko Arzt himself? Fuuuuuuuuuck. (Right under the hatch mural which has “I’m sick”, the sun, and a big arrow. The “arrows of Apollo” (sun god) symbolize plague, by the way.)

[…]

Maybe it’s all on Mssr. Bass & Co, but I practically bawled throughout Desmond’s reading of Penelope’s letter and John Locke’s “illumination.” Fecking great scene, anyway.

[…]

Happy to see Charlie finally get a little sumptin’ sumptin. Emilie de Ravin is unreasonably pretty, like almost everyone on the show. (I feel a bit weird relating to the show on the “Who kissed who” level, but… finally! Way to go, you little limey freak! Better LAT*E than never.

Speaking of “Emilie,” a nice coincidence with that actress’s name. (Jean-Jacques) Rousseau wrote “Emile,” a treatise on early education. A big part of it was that education should be natural process that flows from the student’s natural interests and curiosity, rather than an artificial (and therefore onerous) regimen. In Emile, Rousseau suggested that the most important textbook for a child is “Robinson Crusoe” – that a child should be encourage to act as though they are themselves a Robinson Crusoe – dependent on themselves for survival. What knowledge is necessary for that? “Emile” is about providing the means for self-actualization to the student. Being left to one’s own devices on a remote island lend themselves to that sort of thing, eh? Major theme of the show, for sure.

Anyway… as for the ending… Whiskey Tango Foxtrot? Desmond’s sweetie is in the upper eschelon of the Dharma Initiative? Maaaaaaan…

We should blab more about this later… not to mention a lot of stuff from the last two years. (I’m eager to hear about things you’ve caught that I probably missed, too. Nice thing about the show is that it draws from so many disparate places. All things to all people. No freaking wonder it’s so popular, eh?)

Cheers,
Larry

Anyway, that’s how an episode of Lost appears to someone with an IQ above room temperature. (When said person of reasonable intelligence is handicapped by biblious behaviour.) I would be really interested in hearing a play-by-play of what runs through your skull whille you watch television that appeals to you, since it must obviously be written above the heads of us poor dim-bulbs who watch Lost.

[Smeghead]

There was a TV version of Absolute Power that aired in the UK. It was quite good, though it had a different feel than the radio version. Is this the same show that ABC is (apparently) airing, or did they try to shudder Americanize it?

[Larry_Mudd]

@Smeghead

Is this the same show that ABC is (apparently) airing, or did they try to shudder Americanize it?

He’s not talking about that ABC.

[Gozu]

@vaderspal

Well, one person’s “shortcomings” is another’s entertainment. If you go into the show thinking that it’s a bunch of real-world people who happen to be on a plane that crashes into an island, and the story is about them trying to survive and/or get rescued, well then of course you’re going to hate “Lost.” I would have been monumentally bored by such a show. What I love about the “Lost” is the smoke monsters, odd coincidences, polar bears, magic numbers, secret hatches, intersecting backstories, exploding Ardts, crazy French ladies, shadowy corporations, omnicient Others, dads rising from the dead, imaginary friends, backwards-talking teenagers (oop, I mean ten year olds), hallucinatory horses, diaper-wearing rock stars, Jesus sticks, and boat…BOAT! The more convoluted it gets, the more I think with glee, “how the hell are the writers gonna get themselves out of THIS one?!”

Additionally, I’m quite happy that in S2 Kate has learned to keep her clothes on. :rolleyes:

As for “realistic” shows like “Law & Order” and “CSI” and “The Wire” and any of the other eleventy-dozen police/medical proceurals on TV - some of those are good shows, but generally they bore the shit out of me. Still, I’m not gonna call up my mom and declare that her obsession with L&OSVU means she’s an idiot who’s being duped by wealthy Network honchos.

…of course, she loves “Lost,” too.

I can’t argue for your reasons to like lost. They are sound. However, you can’t possibly lump CSI with The Wire. Calling CSI a realistic show is ludicrous. It’s not realistic. Every episode is filled with “rolleyes” and “yeah riiight” moments. I don’t know about L&O because I don’t watch it but I’d be surprised if it felt as authentic and gritty as “The Wire”. In fact, I can’t think of any other show that really feels authentic. Sopranos and Big love are better than most in that regard I suppose.(both are also HBO shows unsurprisingly enough)

Not that I’m saying shows must feel authentic for me to like them, I like Scrubs, Arrested development, Rome, Sopranos, the office, etc.