# What do you think this comment means? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 27, 2010, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530 "2010-10-27T15:13:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![overlyverbose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/9dc877/32.png) [@overlyverbose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/overlyverbose)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/21 "2010-10-27T18:11:01Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > Either way, if you’re getting sidetracked into this argument about what the sentence meant, you’re completely missing the real problem in your marriage, I think. Believe me, I know how easy it is to keep the argument on the topic that doesn’t really matter, but in the long run, it’s not going to improve your relationship. It’s much scarier to talk about the real issue(s) at hand, but it’s the only way things will change. Very, very wise words. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/22 "2010-10-27T18:13:58Z")
> [@overlyverbose](#): > > English is my husband’s second language, which is why, once he explained why he thought what he thought, I was kind of relieved. He was taking the phrase very literally. My relief dissipated somewhat, though, when I realized that he still doesn’t quite believe me, despite having now read a dictionary definition of the slang use of the term. > > It never entered my mind that, to him, I was playing the victim when my intent was actually the opposite. Looking at it from a more objective standpoint (mostly typing it out), I can see it both ways. > > The whole exchange really just left me scratching my head. It’s pretty simple. He just misunderstands an idiomatic metaphor and is trying to apply a literalistic meaning. By doing so, he gets to control the conversation. What’s his first language? For some reason, my brain has stuck him with a German accent. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/23 "2010-10-27T18:16:12Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > Is he a native English speaker? I ask because it sounds to me like he’s interpreting “doormat” too literally, while understanding that it’s a metaphor, but not really grokking it. He’s sees a doormat as a person he’s being accused of “wiping his feet all over” (which is quite close to literal), not a person who just allows other to act around them without making their needs known (which is closer to the idiom, and closer to what you meant, I think.) > > . That’s exactly what I thought, too. Isn’t the OP’s husband Indian? People who speak English as a second language, or even as a first language but from outside the US, often have a hard time understanding the nuances of idiosyncratic speech and metaphors that operate on two levels at once–in this case we use “doormat” to indicate something that is being stepped on but we also understand it to mean that the doormat is there because it wants to be. There’s a level of agency inherent in the idiom that you might take for granted that he literally can’t grasp. ETA: and I see a whole bunch of people including the OP have responded in the time it took me to write this. Oh well. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/24 "2010-10-27T18:30:58Z")
Ah, he’s Indian. Well, the problem is that the two of you are mistaken in thinking that you speak a common language. He speaks Indian English, which is sufficiently different in connotation of certain words and phrases that it can cause miscommunication. I have the same problem with my wife. I’m Indian-American and she’s Indian-Indian. I find that she also tends to try to analyze words and phrases literalistically, rather than idiomatically. For example, she gets very offended when I react to something she says by saying “That doesn’t make any sense.” I’m criticizing her logic or questioning her data in context; whereas she thinks I’m literally saying that her words make no sense. Indians also tend to be oversensitive to perceived criticism. I suspect that there might have been less opportunity for bickering over wording if you had just stuck to the facts: “I need your help and I need it now, not five minutes from now and not 30 minutes from now. If you won’t give me that help then I’m taking the kids out to eat and you can get dinner on your own.” (I find that wives can pull this kind of thing off. Husbands, not so successfully.) Isn’t it possible to save your status on his video game? ---
**Author:** ![overlyverbose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/9dc877/32.png) [@overlyverbose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/overlyverbose)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/25 "2010-10-27T18:35:56Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > It’s pretty simple. He just misunderstands an idiomatic metaphor and is trying to apply a literalistic meaning. > > By doing so, he gets to control the conversation. > > What’s his first language? For some reason, my brain has stuck him with a German accent. He’s actually Indian - Gujurati was his first language, then both Hindi & English. Thinking of him with a German accent makes me giggle. Like I’ve said, it’s not uncommon for a “discussion” to get more heated between the two of us because of a nuance of the English language. Apparently the term “stonewall” has far more negative connotations to him than it does to me, too. _That_ one was a doozy. There was another time when he called to tell me that his knee had atrophied (he’d been having knee problems and went to see a specialist). I was horrified, convinced he had a wasting disease. Before I panicked, I asked exactly what the doctor said and if he had used the term atrophy. My husband’s response was, “Well, he says the muscle is weak and I need physical therapy.” Thinking of the ensuing discussion (not heated, but certainly entertaining) just now makes me smile - it’s odd what kind of fond memories you develop about your significant other. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/26 "2010-10-27T18:46:14Z")
> [@overlyverbose](#): > > Like I’ve said, it’s not uncommon for a “discussion” to get more heated between the two of us because of a nuance of the English language. Apparently the term “stonewall” has far more negative connotations to him than it does to me, too. _That_ one was a doozy. Ugh. I sympathize. I’ve tried my best, with little success, to convince my wife that words don’t necessarily have the same connotations for me as they do for her, so she probably should defer getting upset by something I say unless she’s sure I mean what she thinks I mean. I’m guessing this is a combination of her Indianness and her feminine self-confidence in her ability to read people’s minds. I haven’t had much luck in trying to persuade her not to jump to conclusions based on her superior mental powers. I recently learned about the difference between high-context and low-context cultures, and this might also play a role. People from high-context societies tend to load words with a lot of unspoken meanings and connotations. I’m curious as to what was so offensive about “stonewall.” I also suspect that he’s used to the idea of the women of the household handling all the domestic duties without assistance from the men. So I would expect that you will have to continue to remind him of these kinds of things. Don’t expect that there will be a time anytime soon in which he will pitch in without your having to remind him to do so. ---
**Author:** ![overlyverbose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/9dc877/32.png) [@overlyverbose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/overlyverbose)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/27 "2010-10-27T18:57:14Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > Ugh. I sympathize. I’ve tried my best, with little success, to convince my wife that words don’t necessarily have the same connotations for me as they do for her, so she probably should defer getting upset by something I say unless she’s sure I mean what she thinks I mean. > > I’m guessing this is a combination of her Indianness and her feminine self-confidence in her ability to read people’s minds. I haven’t had much luck in trying to persuade her not to jump to conclusions based on her superior mental powers. > > I recently learned about the difference between high-context and low-context cultures, and this might also play a role. People from high-context societies tend to load words with a lot of unspoken meanings and connotations. > > I’m curious as to what was so offensive about “stonewall.” Yeah, my husband often thinks that something I’m saying is a mark against his character, rather than a comment on an action. The stonewall argument was an argument within an argument - like **WhyNot** mentioned. It was a distraction and I can’t even remember what we were talking about beforehand - oh, wait. It was something about our son and discipline (a frequently topic for us). He had disciplined our son for a pretty minor infraction and asked me for my thoughts and I stated them. Discipline is a touchy subject for everyone, I think - it’s very easy to sound accusatory or to assume that of someone else. I probably didn’t say what I meant to well (I disagreed with his method, but agreed that our son needed consequences) and my husband just shut down. He flatly refused to hear anymore, didn’t want to discuss it - nothing. I wanted to explain what I meant because I had unintentionally hurt his feelings. He wouldn’t let me. So I said, “Please let me tell you what I meant. I feel like you’re stonewalling me and I think I can clear this up.” I meant, “You’re not letting me explain myself, but if you do, I think you’ll feel better.” He heard something closer to, “You’re an asshole and you never listen to me.” What resulted was a craptacular discussion about my thoughts on his essential character. Obviously, I love him, so I had no bad thoughts about his character and it took me a day and a half to convince him. 'Twas very frustrating and awkward afterward. We generally have a day-long argument hangover period where we’re still not quite sure whether the other person’s still upset. I seek confirmation through touch; he shuts down until he’s over it. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2010, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/28 "2010-10-28T04:54:07Z")
Okay, now I get the OP. The question is who you think is the one primarily at fault, right? In other words, were you accusing him of doing something wrong, or pointing out that you did something wrong and are now going stop? That actually is a legitimate question. Although I’d tend towards the more optimistic version (that you weren’t saying anything bad about me), I can understand that someone who is upset, or even just annoyed, would likely take the other interpretation. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2010, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/29 "2010-10-28T14:20:37Z")
> [@Dung\_Beetle](#): > > I take it to mean that your husband is nitpicking the wording of a plain English sentence to divert your attention from the fact that he agreed to help you, but was not actually willing. My thoughts exactly–the meaning of that phrase is the least important thing going on here. The OP’s husband needs a kick in the nuts. ---
**Author:** ![Kaio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c68b51/32.png) [@Kaio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaio)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2010, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/30 "2010-10-28T19:25:29Z")
> [@overlyverbose](#): > > What resulted was a craptacular discussion about my thoughts on his essential character. Obviously, I love him, so I had no bad thoughts about his character and it took me a day and a half to convince him. 'Twas very frustrating and awkward afterward. Honestly, this leads me to believe that what’s going on is waaaaayyyy deeper than just a language barrier. As you said, you married this guy, and yet the _first_ conclusion he jumps to is that you think he’s an asshole? It doesn’t even occur to him that he might have misunderstood, _even though_ this sort of thing is the most common argument you have? He just decides you’re BSing him when you tell him what you actually meant – and it takes a _day and a half_ to convince him you’re being honest? Buh? I dunno. I think this communication problem needs to be addressed in a more concrete and proactive way than what you’ve got going on now. (I hate to say it, but Dialectical Behavior Therapy might be extremely useful, if you can convince him to take it seriously. Or at least buy a DBT workbook and work through it together. DBT is basically “how to have an argument like a grown-up.”) ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2010, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/31 "2010-10-28T22:29:11Z")
> [@overlyverbose](#): > > He took that to mean, “I’ve been a powerless victim for too long. You’ve been wiping your shoes on me and I’m so taken for granted.” My intention was, “Hey, I’ve been allowing this to happen to me, but I’m not going to do it anymore. You agreed to help me when I need it. Get off the X-box and help now.” The amount of daylight between these two interpretations is so small that I don’t understand why there would be enough miscommunication to start an argument. It doesn’t sound like him taking things literally is really a problem. He thought you were accusing him of walking all over you. You meant you were _allowing_ him to walk over you. Two different sides of the coin, but they ultimately mean the same thing: you feel like you’re being walked on. The whole bit about “you’re going to make it stop” is kind of irrelevant. The only purpose that serves is to justify why you’re telling to him to help NOW, but it doesn’t change the meaning of what came before it. If a spouse told me that he felt like a doormat in the same context as yours, I’d think he was making a statement about me, too. That said, you have a perfectfully valid reason for feeling that way! It takes two to make a doormat. So I guess I fail to see the need to even correct his interpretation. When you ask your husband to help and he puts you off, that is an act of disrespect. He needs to know that. Feeling the need to sugar coat things so it sounds like you’re pointing the finger at yourself and not at him (when really you _are_ mad at him) isn’t fair to you or to him. But especially not to you. ---
**Author:** ![kittenblue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ba8739/32.png) [@kittenblue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kittenblue)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2010, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530/32 "2010-10-29T13:41:52Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > The amount of daylight between these two interpretations is so small that I don’t understand why there would be enough miscommunication to start an argument. It doesn’t sound like him taking things literally is really a problem. > > He thought you were accusing him of walking all over you. You meant you were _allowing_ him to walk over you. Two different sides of the coin, but they ultimately mean the same thing: you feel like you’re being walked on. The whole bit about “you’re going to make it stop” is kind of irrelevant. The only purpose that serves is to justify why you’re telling to him to help NOW, but it doesn’t change the meaning of what came before it. > > If a spouse told me that he felt like a doormat in the same context as yours, I’d think he was making a statement about me, too. That said, you have a perfectfully valid reason for feeling that way! It takes two to make a doormat. So I guess I fail to see the need to even correct his interpretation. When you ask your husband to help and he puts you off, that is an act of disrespect. He needs to know that. Feeling the need to sugar coat things so it sounds like you’re pointing the finger at yourself and not at him (when really you _are_ mad at him) isn’t fair to you or to him. But especially not to you. There. That’s exactly what I wanted to say. You were mad, and basically told him he was not treating you well, and that this was his normal way of treating you. You tried to soften it with a “it’s not you, it’s me” but that won’t work. You can’t try to try to hide behind a subtle nuance of language that most people wouldn’t recognize. He made you mad. It happens. It’s not the end of the world to admit it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-do-you-think-this-comment-means/558530.md?page=1)