Well, I don’t have a yellow ribbon sticker on my car, nor a ‘Support the Troops’ bumper sticker. Doesn’t mean I don’t support the troops of course.
What does ‘Support the Troops’ mean? Well, it obviously means many things to many people in this thread. To some its obviously a nefarious neo-con plan to trick people into going along with the Iraqi invasion and to squelch any opposition. To others it merely means what it says…support the troops, appreciate their service to their country, understand that they had no real say in going to Iraq and so shouldn’t be blamed for the decisions made by their government, but are only doing their duty. I’m sure everyone knows which meaning I subscribe to by now.
There have been several Vietnam vets who have chimed in to the thread with their personal experiences. I’m not a Vietnam vet…I was in the first Gulf War. However, my father is a Vietnam vet. Perhaps his stories of abuse by civilians when he was coming home from Vietnam are unique to him…others in this thread don’t seem to have had similar experiences. Perhaps my father was one of only a handful of service men spit on, who had red dye thrown on their white uniforms, who were called all manner of names, etc. Be that as it may, I think part of the ‘support our troops’ (which started in the FIRST GW btw…as well as the yellow ribbon thing) is a reaction to those times.
I think that as people grew up they were appalled by the actions of the more rabid citizens to the troops coming back from Vietnam…troops who really had no say in where they were sent or what they were ordered to do. People realized that it was wrong to blame the troops for what the government did…that even if they totally disagreed with the government and what it was doing, blaming the troops was stupid and petty. Wishing ill on the troops was stupid and petty.
Perhaps all this stemmed from a few individual actions against guys like my dad…perhaps they were isolated incidents blown all out of proportion in the retelling and later by the media. Or, perhaps it was more widespread than some seem to think, and that those Vietnam veteran posters in this thread got off lucky as far as such abuse goes. I don’t really know…I only know what my father told me about his and his buddies experiences coming home. Reguardless of whether its fiction or fact, I think it was a major factor in the whole ‘support the troops’ movement.
At its core I agree whole heartedly with the concept…support the men and women who are sacrificing their time, energy and sometimes their very lives for all of us…doing their duty in OUR name. Respect that sacrifice, be understanding to their situation, and sympathetic to the families who have lost a loved one at our collective behest. This doesn’t in any way mean you have to agree or support the GOVERNMENT who decided to pursue this war. You show your support or lack of support for our government by doing your civic duty and voting…and then by becoming loyal opposition and calm and reasoned resistance to that government if your side loses.
Now there are some “Support President Bush and Our Troops” magnetic ribbons appearing. From driving distance they don’t look much different. Is this some back door effort to blur exactly the distinction so many posters have been careful to clarify?
Sure there are. There are some right here on this board. From this thread:
I was on another board dedicated to an author. A serviceman wrote in to say how much he loved the books, and that he shares them with his fellow troops and that the author has helped them through their struggle. Immediately a poster jumped all over him for killing innocents in an illegal war, blah blah. When called to task on her disrespect when the post was being nothing but thanksful to the author, she basically said “screw you and all the troops.” It wasn’t a debate board, btw
There are some who cannot bring themselves to support ANYthing about this war, including the troops.
“Support our troops” has been co-opted by the Right to mean ‘patriotism’ and ‘my country right or wrong’ and ‘if you don’t support the troops and our Godly President you hate America and want our troops to die at the hands of sandy little buttholes in Iraq because you don’t have a trunk magnet,’
“Support our troops” has also been co-opted by the left to mean ‘propaganda-spewing idiot who doesn’t know what war is really about’ and ‘I support the troops but don’t support the warmongering imperialist idiot who sent them there’ and ‘bring them home now!’
It just depends on which side of the argument you’re on, really - you can take it to mean whatever you want it to, just like the Bible.
I personally take it to mean that I send money every month to the USO, an organization I know from personal experience supports our troops very very well and directly in a variety of ways, many of which I have used personally. I don’t show it through a stupid bumber sticker bought at Wal-Mart to help pad some executive’s pocket.
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I am envious of your experience. Air Force from 1991-1994, Air National Guard from 1995-1999; I served in Germany and Korea on active duty, and was ordered by base command to NEVER wear uniforms off base - protestors were far too likely to come after us and the ones in Korea were decidedly NOT pacifists. I served ANG duty in Montana (no problems there wearing uniform; they thought I was just out huntin’ usually, but would have bought me lunch if I let them - few are more supportive of the troops than Montanans :)) but in when I was serving in the Oregon Air National Guard and living in Portland, I got stares, nasty comments, and the occasional ‘oops, didn’t mean to shove you, wanna make something of it, GI Joe?’ comments when wearing uniform in public or on public transport. This was in 1997-1999. Not fun - got bad enough I wouldn’t wear my uniform too / from Guard Drills. I’ll never forgot the sweet little old lady in Portland on the bus who called me a fascist and asked me to get off at the next stop when I was wearing my BDU’s one weekend.
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It seems to me that the folks who view these magnets with a "shrug the shoulders, it just means ‘support the troops’ " perspective are missing part of the message. There seems to be a bit of “code-talking” going on with these things. The traditional orientation of these ribbons/ribbon-images is with the loop at the top and the ends of the ribbon trailing to the bottom. That’s how many people place them on their cars. However, recently I’ve seen a lot of these magnets oriented so that the loop sits to the right and the ends to the left. With the “ribbon” oriented that way, its shape matches the Christian fish symbol, which also shows up on the tails of a lot of cars. I think there’s a definite message in that placement. Folks in this forum have already noted that “support the troops”/ribbons are a proxy statement for “I’m in favor of war.” The “fishy” placement of the ribbon magnet adds an extra dimension to it-- a crusading, “I like war because Jesus wants us to kill those darkies” idea. (I know you can argue that they turn the ribbon on its side so the “support the troops” legend reads horizontally, but I think that’s specious. It’s perfectly legible with the ribbon oriented in the traditional manner.) It stands out to me as another example of the burgeoning Christo-Fascism that is taking over this country. Not a good thing at all.
As for the phrase itself, I too have long asked, “What exactly does “Support The Troops” mean?” How do you “support the troops?” Do you supply materiel? Do recon? Are you enlisted? What?
I understand that some people do send care packages or body armor or whatnot to the troops, particularly their relatives in the service, and I think that’s fine. But when I look around me, it seems like for most people “support the troops” means flapping their gums and nothing more. It is a proxy for “I like war, as long as I’m not getting shot at” far more often than not. And that’s the sort of behavior that gets people–other people–killed.
I feel somewhat sorry for the troops, because they’re caught in a trap that is mostly not of their own devising. On the other hand, most of those troops are the same age as me or younger (I’m 36). Like me, they grew up in this country post-Vietnam, and they had ample opportunity to learn the lessons of that tragedy: that war as an instrument of policy is outdated and dead, because a subject population can inflict more harm on you than can ever make the objective worth it (not to mention future “blowback” which will come from such campaigns); the awful consequences for powerless individuals when the military is used not to defend the nation, but to further the interests of a tiny subset of the nation (those soldiers who survive the current mess will be dealing with the consequences of their experiences for the rest of their lives–as much as the next FIFTY years); that wars fought for murky–at best–reasons are polarizing and divisive for the nation, and cause enormous harm on the home front.
A final thought on those magnets: if you’re up for some mischief, when you’re walking through the parking lot and you see one of those things, peel it off and put it back on upside down, with the loop at the bottom and the ends at the top, so it looks kind of goat-horned/devil-y. I bet the owners of those vehicles will find that most amusing…
Uh, wow, Lion, that’s a lot of interpretation there. I had always thought the sideways orientation was so the words could be read, nothing more - well, possibly so the thing would fit in the available prominent space, too.
I used to have one on my car, bought from the local American Legion post so I’m clear there. I most certainly do support the troops, who have made a huge sacrifice and exposed themselves to great risk on our behalf. I support them by wanting them home as soon as possible (i.e. now) so that no more lives are wasted on this folly. I’d be happy to get them their damn armor in the meanwhile.
And the yellow ribbon is, as I understand it, just to mean “Come home, you’re always welcome”. That’s it.
But I do agree that it’s come to symbolize support of the war itself, and lest my views be misinterpreted, off it’s come. I only hope now that the topic becomes obsolete very soon.
I’m against the war. It’s stupid and will have exactly the opposite of its intended results, aside from capturing that great booby prize, Saddam Hussein.
Talking to the folks is exactly the thing a lot of our military people want most to do other than going home. So, don’t be stingy. Shell out a few bucks and let them know you care.
Thank you for that link, braintree. I’ve just sent out a check for a card for a soldier. I’m sure all posters, no matter their political bent, or thoughts on the war, would agree this is a fantastic way to help the troops.
Have you considered opening a thread soley about this phone card program? Or are there rules against it as it may fall under solitciting?
I honestly don’t know, but figure if it is fine as a reply in a thread, it should be fine as a thread topic.
elucidator, you seem to be missing your usual cynicism about everything associated with this Damn Fool War™ today. Did someone hack into your account?
But no, the troops apparently don’t get any sort of government-sponsored calls home (either that, or it was some insanely small number of minutes, I can’t recall). Here’s a story about a pair of teens who got cheesed enough about the issue to act.
I am burdened with a notion of common decency, which often gets expressed by simply assuming certain provisions are made for the deserving. It honestly didn’t occur to me that such a thing as free phone calls home were not readily and commonly available.
So give me a dress and call me “Pollyanna”. (Might want to be smiling when you do it, I can be a bit tetchy sometimes…)
Have you considered this: In the wake of 9/11 after the various relief funds were set up to benefit the families of those killed, the average compensation for someone killed was on the order of a million dollars. I don’t recall if it was over or under that figure, but certainly close to that.
Unless a member of the Armed Services pays for SGLI the death benefits for being killed in combat are basically those given by the VA: A generic marker, and a flag for the coffin. If the servicemember chooses to pay for the group life insurance offered by the military, the maximum payout is $200,000. And that’s after a recent (~12 years ago) increase. Now, I imagine it is possible to get additional coverage above that level - but can you imagine what the premiums must be for someone who’s been deployed to Iraq?
Just asked a fellow what it means to support the troops from his point of view, as he spent a year in Iraq and may be sent back in about March.
He said the recognition and appreciation they get, like the parties we throw for them when they return, are good support, and they appreciate that. He says they are glad they aren’t getting spat upon like the Vietnam era vets, and he thinks they have the Vietnam vets and their work to thank for that (note that he hasn’t read the above posts on the Vietnam stories).
What they wish was different was that we wouldn’t watch what they are doing over there so closely, and wouldn’t act like Monday morning quarterbacks. For example, he said, don’t put a soldier on trial because he shoots a dead Iraqi body on the ground when he walks by it - because on another day that body would have jumped up and shot the soldier as he passed. There are too many hazards and too many people pulling tricks on them and too many ways to get killed if they aren’t cautious about things and putting themselves first.
So, he says, just give them the job to do, and let them do it, without interfering.
We got into a long-ass acrimonious debate about this not that long ago, in a thread about supporting the troops while being against the war in general. See here:
Strip away the acrimony and there were some interesting perspectives on what it meant to support the troops.