Not an example of a way in which America’s support of Israel has benefited us. After all, any country can use those technologies, Israel-friendly or not.
Not if Israel was pushed into the sea - the fervent wish of its neighbors.
How would that prevent me from using voicemail? Or eating cherry tomatoes?
Aside from supporting Israel being the right thing to do, they have better intel in the region than we do, and they share it with us. Also, they do a few things in covert ops that we prefer not to do ourselves.
The US doesn’t do anything it doesn’t want or feel the need to do. That’s just realism. The idea that the Jooish Lobby controls foreign policy against our own interests is a bit silly. We’ve addressed the need/want for an ideological and military alliance with Israel quite a bit since I’ve been here (not long). Many Muslim-dominated countries dislike Israel or her policies but it doesn’t stop them from having (albeit grudgingly) relationships with Israel as well.
Since 1967 which of its neighbors has called for pushing Israel into the sea?
They also do things we can’t outright say we agree with or want but secretly work in our favor, eg, bombing shit.
Lebanon & Syria border Israel. Iran is a short bit away.
While the West Bank and Gaza aren’t Israeli neighbors on a technicality, can I just call it the Territory Formerly Under Jordanian Control or Palestine Jr.?
And which of these has called for driving Israel into the sea since 1967?
Arafat, Hizbollah, Hamas…?
Are you joking?
Why go back so far.
Here it is from Egypt
The protesters, demonstrating against the deaths of the six soldiers, waved Palestinian flags and called out, “Israel will be torched” and “Death to Israel”.
According to local news reports, the protesters attempted to prevent the Israeli ambassador from entering the premises and demanded his deportation. They also called out, “Jihad, jihad!” and “The army of Mohammed will return”, as well as, “We want fire, we want war!” and “The people demand an end to Camp David Accords!” .
… or from Lebanon
..its 1985 manifesto reportedly states “our struggle will end only when this entity [Israel] is obliterated. We recognize no treaty with it, no ceasefire, and no peace agreements.”
A sign of this came in the harsh tone of the speech he delivered Wednesday night from the Al-Raya Stadium in the Shiite district Dahya district of Beirut: Ahmadinejad and Hizballah leader Hassan Nasrallah declared their common goal was Israel’s destruction. The IDF, the Lebanese army and UNIFIL raised their war alert further when it was discovered that Nasrallah was not standing beside the Iranian president but had relayed his speech by videotape.
And which countries have these controlled and called for driving Israel into the sea since '67? Surely you can cite this since you think its a joke. Or is this destined to be like all of your claims that you can’t cite? Still waiting for you in the Morals/ethics and the Dachau Massacre thread, but I’m not holding my breath.
Because Nassar calling for driving Israel into the sea was the last time a neighboring country said this.
Protestors, not the Egyptian government. Try again.
I wasn’t aware that Hezbollah was the government of Lebanon, news to me.
Again, it’s news to me that Hezbollah is the ruling party in Lebanon.
Oh hey look, it isn’t. The Lebanese army went on higher alert when he said this.
So Lebanon, Syria, Jordan and Egypt, you’re batting 0 for 4 on this.
:dubious: No, it isn’t. Lots of lobbies in D.C. have (1) a whole lot of influence on the Hill, in the West Wing, etc. and (2) an agenda not necessarily completely in line with what a disinterested observer might call the general public interest.
I’m nitpicking here, but a specific variety of cherry tomatoes was developed in Israel in the 70s. Cherry tomatoes have been in existence longer than large slicing tomatoes.
Errm, not exactly. Arab citizens of Israel have the vote. Sure, they’re doing all kinds of shit in Palestine like the settlements and walls and crap, and their biased immigration policy is bad, but that don’t make them not democratic. Just bad (in some ways) - the way America can be bad in some ways (invading foreign countries, torture) yet still democratic.
But most Arabs under Israeli rule, millions of them, are not citizens, and do not have any vote in Israeli elections, and live in a homeland which is neither in Israel nor out of it. Sound pretty much exactly like Apartheid.
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But most Arabs under Israeli rule, millions of them, are not citizens, and do not have any vote in Israeli elections, and live in a homeland which is neither in Israel nor out of it. Sound pretty much exactly like Apartheid.
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But they aren’t Israeli citizens. AFAIK, all Arab Israeli citizens have the right to vote…they just are excluded from military service (IIRC). You are comparing apples to oranges by trying to include Arabs in the occupied territories who can’t vote (most of who don’t want to be Israeli citizens in any case) with Arabs who live in Israel and are citizens.
-XT
Oh hey look it is. It is right now a part of the ruling coalition in Lebanon. I guess you don’t follow the region’s news much.
Right, and under Apartheid, blacks under South African rule were not South African citizens, they were citizens of their “independent” “homelands.” It’s just the same. Apples and apples.
Do you mean the Palestinians? They’re under Israeli hegemony, sure, but I wouldn’t call it rule, exactly.
I used to think that until fairly recently, but I’ve decided it isn’t an accurate-enough comparison to be true. I’m no fan of Israeli treatment of Palestinians, believe me, but on this, I’ve come around to saying “I know Apartheid, and this isn’t it”. The status of Israeli citizen Arabs is kind of what makes it not so for me.
What the Israelis have going on is definitely some sort of cultural and ethnic oppression, but that doesn’t mean Israel, itself, isn’t a democracy.