What exactly is a life of purpose and meaning

[Captain_Awesome]

@ITR_champion

I’ve made my opinions about evolutionary psychology known. You, obviously, feel differently, but even acknowledging the different angles that we come from I think you’re assumptions need some review. Ever since people started explaining human behavior in this way, there’s been a split, with one group saying that we’re evolved to be nice, helpful, and supportive, while the other group insists that we’re programmed to look out for number one and disregard all others. Neither group, however, can actually find the genes that make us do these things. It’s been fifty years since the discovery of DNA and ten years since we sequenced the human genome. We’ve poured money, time, and effort into matching up genes with traits. Yet we’ve yet to find any gene that governs social behavior, whether pro- or anti-cooperation.

Plus, service to others isn’t programmed into us. Babies don’t come into the world are start crawling towards the Salvation Army to make a donation. We have to teach young children to behave decently. We make them share their toys and not snatch things from other kids. Later we teach them the rules of politeness, manners, and civility. Later still, ethics and morality. If no one teaches a kid these things, the kid never learns them. Research shows that the experiences a child has determine the eventual structure of the brain; it is not determined by genes.

And evidence of this can be seen just by looking around. Young people today care less about helping others and more about advancing themselves than any previous generation. 80% list “making lots of money” as a life goal, up from 45% fifty years ago. 51% list becoming famous. Meanwhile the percentages of those wanting to contribute to their community, serve others, or take on leadership roles has gone down. (All according to this book.)

Evolutionary psychology doesn’t necessitate itself on identifying a particular gene or genes for governing behaviour. Much of this knowledge is apparently gained from the environment. Whether or not these genes do or do not exist, individuals and groups which advocate reproduction and a framework of social organisation which supports this, tend to do better in demographic terms, relative to groups without these imperatives. Evolutionarily they are often more successful. Modern aspirations of financial and social status are entirely in keeping with the reproductive opportunity and success that they demonstrably affect.

[msmith537]

@Wesley_Clark

So what is a meaningless life? Is it a life where the only goal is to serve yourself? Or is there something else? Is a life meaningless if you life in a studio apartment, have no friends, no goals beyond yourself and only have your job and your hobbies?

Well I suppose it might depend on what their job or hobbies were.

@jimpatro

That term sounds like someone else wanting you to fit their agenda. " Try to live a life of purpose and meaning" translated “Here’s what’s important to me, make it important to you”.

Reminds me of " If you don’t stand for something, you’ll fall for anything" Meaning-“If you don’t stand for what I espouse, you’ll fall for something I don’t”.

I’ve heard this in response to my agnosticism.

I think the point is that you need to figure out what has purpose and meaning to you. You are correct that institutional systems - school, military, governments, corporations, religeon, cults, etc - often will try to instill a sense of organizational purpose and meaning in their members. The goal being to inspire their memebers to place the goals of the group ahead of the goals of the individual. The statement " If you don’t stand for something, you’ll fall for anything" (a variation on a phrase by Alexander Hamilton) essentially means that if you don’t already have a strong sense of purpose you are more succeptable to getting caught up in someone elses.

[panache45]

@Captain_Awesome

Very simple. The purpose of life is to reproduce successfully. Any meaning beside this, or in spite of this, is a human construct. This isn’t to dismiss such philosophies, just that they don’t have a definitive basis, beyond their role in influencing reproductive success.

Total bull. This may apply to amoeba or wolverines, but we have a different type of consciousness, which enables us to decide our own individual purpose. Calling this a “human construct” is totally accurate . . . and not in a bad way.

Think of some of the people who are reproducing these days. Is this considered a positive thing for humanity? Is “Octo-Mom” humanity’s new paradigm? And think of all the truly great people who never reproduced. I think, now that there are about 7 billion of us, reproduction isn’t the singleminded goal it used to be.

[Captain_Awesome]

Totally accurate bullshit?!

Firstly I never suggested that you were prevented from inventing your own conceptual purpose, simply that such a philosophy wasn’t the definitive point of life itself.

Secondly I didn’t claim that unfettered reproduction was a good thing, just that individuals and groups which produce more viable offspring, due to whatever reason, tend to be more evolutionarily successful. Many ‘great people’ did not reproduce, and were essentially biological cul-de-sacs, which isn’t to detract from the greatness of their work within human understanding, but crudely it’s Goodnight Vienna for their genetic lineage.

[NJ_Kef]

@Wesley_Clark

And from an evolutionary perspective, a tribe of 100 people where individuals obtained a sense of fulfillment from helping the other 99 members maintain their physical, social and psychological integrity against threats and entropy would have survival advantages over one where there was no sense of meaning. Just as long as people reciprocated the efforts. If not, people would feel cheap.

Bear in mind that a tribe of 100 is probably an organic community comprised of siblings, parents, uncles, aunts, cousins, grandparents, spouses, in-laws, common ancestors, and friends, etc. Why wouldn’t they look out for one another?

I think meaningfulness can be found anywhere, even in isolation. But abstaining from interpersonal relationships seems to me to deprive one of the opportunity of learning what it means to be a human being.