Yep - if I never see another “Ain’t nobody got time for that!” meme post, it’ll be too soon.
Does it need to be to qualify for this bit
of apprently overhyped terminology?
How fictional does a movie need to be before it’s not “cultural appropriation”
Especially if you’re dealing with the traditional folklore of a culture?
To me it just seemed odd for a minute but no big deal.
Thus is probably another example though where the Arthur stories have such a huge amount of representation that it’s no big deal.
Where if we were dealing with a traditional native story doing something like that would be a big nono because it may well be the only exposure people ever get.
I rarely if ever use memes but I could see your angle on that.
Are they just generic black people? Or are they like stars known for the exaggerated trait?
And do you mean that some have an overabundance of black go tos for negative traits? Like they just don’t even bother to mix it up?
I grew up almost at the same as the Virginia governor. Dressing in costume included darkening the skin for a character like Michael Jackson. It wasn’t a concern then.
What was a concern is blackface Minstrel entertainment. They included racial stereotypical humor, exaggerated black facial features and minstrel songs.
This was certainly offensive in 1980 and people my age knew it.
There’s no comparison in putting on a MJ costume and singing Billy Jean and a minstrel entertainer like this …
Everything about this guy is racially exaggerated.
I really have thank monstro here too.
I’m not quite in agreement on some of the ahistorical parts of what he’/ she? said but the vast , vast , vast majority of his points were reasonable, clear explanations including the way to approach it with my son.
That gave me a great way of explaining to him why he can’t brown up without making it sound like it’s not ok to be black or not ok to idolize a black person or character.
You were the one who called it a “medeival movies”[sic] which kind of implies a period piece, not the inaccurate-to-history mess that was KALotS.
And yes, in a fantasy piece, anything goes. Not that POC were strangers to medieval Europe, you understand.
It wouldn’t be “cultural appropriation” even if it claimed to be a recreation of Agincourt with an all-Black cast, because that’s not what cultural appropriation is.
The traditional Arthurian romances featured several POC knights, as I’ve shown.
The difference between the two should be screamingly obvious.
I was told about ten years ago that such descriptions should be shied away from. I have been in situations where I walk into a room and ask who John Smith is. Someone will point to two people standing together talking, one black and one white, and they will describe John as the taller guy, or the guy with the blue blazer, or the one on the right (no their right) and do everything except to make the obvious distinction of saying the white guy or the black guy, even though that would immediately clarify things.
That’s how absurd things have gotten. There is nothing demeaning about describing a person. American Dad lampooned the shit out of this trope in an episode where Stan does everything to try to describe the white girl and finally says that she is the one where if you were handing out sunscreen you would give it to her first.
These “rules” make no sense other than to further the divisions between the races, increase hostility, and to keep those who pretend to be offended in power.
I will go on tour as long as I can go dressed as David Bowie.
Thanks for the compliments, everyone.
No, whiteface wasn’t the problem Americans had with the skit. It was what Australians felt deserved an apology.
Just don’t pad your pants because people shouldn’t be defined by their physical characteristics.
Actually, looks like you focused on the word black there
Moorish people were Muslims in Spain and italy not Africans as it would imply in our context.
Palamedes would have been Arab as well.
Actually reminds me of something that really strikes me odd, seems like a lot of the same people who go around quoting Bible verses are the same ones who would have a terrible attitude towards the people they’re quoting because they’re Arab and all the Bible movies seem to never include an Arab.
As far as the native movie thing goes no i don’t see some big objective difference between legend of the sword and if I were to do the legend of Unktomi tanka ( giant magic spider and a brave) with white people or black people instead of natives. Except that Arthurian legends have so much representation that you could do it however the hell you want and nobody is gonna care. Everybody has their own twist and the stories themselves aren’t even consistent. So whatever , no need to make up all your own characters to do a fantasy medeival type film.
The only reason I would say doing Unktomi you would want to stick with natives is the lack of representation. I mean there were white braves as far back as 500 years ago but why select the minority there to represent a traditional native story that hardly anyone has heard of.
Though I bear in mind my understanding is pretty much limited to what I’ve read in this thread and a few blogs as these things go.
I had more or less the same thing happen. Strange racist remarks including flat out “I don’t like black people”.
It was embarrassing and weird, because until then one of his black uncles was his big hero and roll model.
I figured it was something he picked up in school. We live in a very, very white rural area and in general people here aren’t too crazy about strangers (my family and I included).
I further ignored it, because that is how I handle most every situation with my kids and it turns out to be a great parenting tool.
By now he is 8 and I think he is over it. May have helped that I put him in another school and that I brought him to the boxing gym where every kid of color from the whole wide area trains.
He’s also developing a strange fascination for blues music (strange for his age), which might put things in the proper perspective.
I live in the Netherlands and they have a remarkable blackface tradition here surrounding the celebration of St. Nicholas in December. This Santa-type character is assisted not by elves, but by blackface acrobats called “Zwarte Piet” (Black Pete). Since a few years part of the black community is protesting this tradition, which leads to totally incomprehensible discussions in newspapers, television and public debate. Promotors of either side of the debate receive death threats and protestors require police protection. The country seems on the verge of civil war when before Christmas the whole thing dies down and is forgotten about for another year.
I think it is inevitable that they move away from the blackface thing. The local PBS, that appears to be in charge of broadcasting everything related to the event, has already started to introduce White Petes (or actually various gradations ranging from black to white).
It’s kind of an interesting spectacle. The outrage with the traditionalists (roughly half the country) is remarkable. I find it hard to believe that these are all racist people. I suspect that they are mostly conservatives who feel threatened by a rapidly changing society and made this their last stand. Come to think of it, this may well be the Dutch border wall. (but let’s not go there).
My Netherlands experience:
In high school, a bunch of us kids did a tour of Europe,and Amsterdam was one of the cities we visited. We were a performing arts school, so naturally we performed (string orchestra and a performing troupe that did singing and dancing numbers). We were based in Atlanta, GA, so a lot of us were melanistic. Being naive teenagers, we didn’t know that this made us unusual in any way.
After our performance at the international school in Amsterdam, a little white girl from the school came up to one of us back stage and demanded that she get out of her make-up. At first, we were all very confused. And then she pointed to my schoolmate’s skin and we realized she thought she–and no doubt most of us–were wearing brown make-up. My schoolmate’s immediate reaction was to clapback at the little girl, which in retrospect wasn’t the kindest response. But it was kind of hilarious. We experienced a couple of other “racially weird” incidents while we were there. But I liked Amsterdam other than that.
Oy. She must have been *really *young or *really *sheltered:smack:
BTW, can we agree that it’s acceptable, nay, compulsory, for any persons of any color to put on orange face when dressing as Mr. Trump?
I’m glad I’m not the only one.
His brother never did anything like that so we’ve been puzzling over it.
I know I wouldn’t care a bit. Though if we’re promoting a similar standard, from the responses here it seems like a mask would be the way to go?
I’ve seen several 2 year olds assume something along those lines the first time they notice a black person up close.
A grocery store clerk once noticed my cousin at about 2 giving her a strange look and knew immediately. She responded by showing her that was her color and invited her to touch her hand saying go ahead, it won’t rub off. My cousin did and then was perfectly comfortable.
Kids are really wild.
When I was a kid, my very blonde best friend’s very blonde mother loved to tell the story of said friend referring to the first black man she saw as “a chocolate man”. I wasn’t sure if my friend was stupid or the mother was a liar. Apologies to both of them, wherever they are.
I think all of the questions, concerns and confusion over blackface makes it abundantly clear that white culture values the color of one’s skin much more than anyone is comfortable admitting.
There are people in this thread who seem to imply that they cannot judge a cosplayer by the content of their character until after they have judged them by the color of their skin. If a black person cannot avoid being judged by the color of their skin in a room full of people playing dress up and make believe then what expectation of fairness and equality does the black doctor/lawyer/accountant/engineer ever hope to have in the real world?
It feels like we aren’t even allowed to pretend we are seen as equals.