# What famous works of fiction, popular with readers and critics both, do you not care for? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 22, 2019, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659 "2019-09-22T20:28:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/41 "2019-09-23T05:45:53Z")
I’ve always loved Neil Gaiman’s comics. I’m on the fence about his novels, especially the ones that (A) he did with Terry Pratchett or (B) are intended for children. There’s a great literary tradition of English writers talking down to younger readers, and he hasn’t shaken it. I kind of love **American Gods** , though. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/42 "2019-09-23T10:22:54Z")
Jack Kerouac’s _On The Road_ is often listed among the great book’s of the 20th Century and I loved it when I read it in my 20s. A couple of years ago I read Scott Alexander’s [Slate Star Codex](http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/12/02/book-review-on-the-road/) review of the book. It begins: > [@](#): > > There’s a story about a TV guide that summarized The Wizard of Oz as “Transported to a surreal landscape, a young girl kills the first woman she meets, then teams up with three complete strangers to kill again.” > > It’s funny because it mistakes a tale of wonder and adventure for a crime spree. Jack Kerouac’s On the Road is the opposite; a crime spree that gets mistaken for a tale of wonder and adventure. > > On The Road is a terrible book about terrible people. Kerouac and his terrible friends drive across the US about seven zillion times for no particular reason, getting in car accidents and stealing stuff and screwing women whom they promise to marry and then don’t. and then gets really scathing. What is most shocking about it is that, on reflection and attempting to reread the book, it is a perfectly fair precis of the work. ---
**Author:** ![kitap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b9e5f3/32.png) [@kitap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kitap)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/43 "2019-09-23T10:49:48Z")
> [@Llama\_Llogophile](#): > > I actually liked a lot of what we read in high school, with the exception of Gatsby. I’m from Long Island originally, and I had the same reaction to Gatsby as I did to Seinfeld - I grew up around some of these people and they weren’t funny or interesting, they were assholes. But you’re not **supposed** to like the characters in **The Great Gatsby**. They’re horrible people and Fitzgerald knew it. My list: \*\*Lord of the Rings. Also The Hobbit and the Silmarillion. Game of Thrones Heart of Darkness Tess of the D’Urbevilles Everything I have read by P D James A Thousand Acres \*\* I cheated when I read Moby Dick: I read Richard Armour’s retelling/skewing of it in **American Lit Relit**. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/44 "2019-09-23T11:08:42Z")
> [@don\_t\_ask](#): > > Jack Kerouac’s _On The Road_ is often listed among the great book’s of the 20th Century and I loved it when I read it in my 20s. A couple of years ago I read Scott Alexander’s [Slate Star Codex](http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/12/02/book-review-on-the-road/) review of the book. It begins: > > and then gets really scathing. What is most shocking about it is that, on reflection and attempting to reread the book, it is a perfectly fair precis of the work. I’ll agree. I recently finally got around to reading _On the Road_, and it bothered me how these guys were having sex with women who they promised to marry, then didn’t, and all the other irresponsible things they did. Granted, they did a lot of exploration and even some good stuff, but it was hard for me to empathasize with these lazy liars. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/45 "2019-09-23T11:13:32Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > **Dhalgren** - At the risk of getting all sorts of PC flak, this novel is famous because Chip is black. Cuz the novel is shit…\* Don’t be silly. Chip was already considered on of the top writers in the genre when the book came out, a multiple Hugo and Nebula winner. Granted, **Dhalgen** is complex and doesn’t have a conventional plot and I can understand not getting it, but it was genuinely popular with readers and critics. ---
**Author:** ![Jet\_Jaguar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jet_jaguar/32/3562_2.png) [@Jet\_Jaguar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jet_Jaguar)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/46 "2019-09-23T12:02:24Z")
More votes for **Catcher in the Rye** and **Catch 22**. With Rye, I’ve been told I don’t like it because I was in my 30’s when I first read it, and had I read it in high school I would think it’s amazing. I don’t know, I remember what I was like in HS and I think I would have still thought Holden was a whiny bitch. Also, I don’t care for **Harry Potter**. It’s alright, but I don’t get the huge phenomenon it has become. I was probably too old to be in it’s target market when it came out. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/47 "2019-09-23T12:09:15Z")
Well I like **Catcher in the Rye**. Okay, “like” isn’t the right word - the protagonist is a little shit - but I understand why it’s held in high regard in many circles. Jane Austen, however, can suck it. Fanny Burney’s _Evelina_ was far better than Austen’s _Emma_, and was written forty years earlier. Austen’s parade of stupid, simpering Regency twits all need a good slap. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/48 "2019-09-23T12:12:36Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Don’t be silly. Chip was already considered on of the top writers in the genre when the book came out, a multiple Hugo and Nebula winner. Granted, **Dhalgen** is complex and doesn’t have a conventional plot and I can understand not getting it, but it was genuinely popular with readers and critics. And the title of this thread is…? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/49 "2019-09-23T12:22:20Z")
> [@kitap](#): > > But you’re not **supposed** to like the characters in **The Great Gatsby**. They’re horrible people and Fitzgerald knew it. Yeah, I guess that’s my problem with a bunch of the ‘classics’: if there’s no character I can relate to, I’m not going to like the book. My list includes: **Catcher in the Rye The Great Gatsby The Sun Also Rises Anna Karenina Crime and Punishment** (though I like Dostoevsky generally) **Dune** What gets me about _Catcher_ is all the crap I read _about_ it before I read it, not just once but in abundant references over the decades, about how Holden Caulfield sees through the phoniness of blah blah blah. Then I read the book, and all he’s doing is calling shit ‘phony’ just because. I’d like to have words with all those people who thought that Holden saw through anything more challenging than a plate-glass window, and a very clean one at that. _Dune_: has any book been stuffed with characters who took themselves (and every last little hand-signal or facial expression) as overseriously as **Dune**? ‘Terrible purpose,’ my ass. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/50 "2019-09-23T12:23:23Z")
Another non-fan of _Gatsby_ and _Confederacy_. Also not a fan of Gaiman in general. And the _Good Omens_ collaboration was just … bad. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/51 "2019-09-23T12:40:59Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > \*\*Catcher in the Rye > > A Separate Peace > > Gaslight > > The Manchurian Candidate > > Lord of the Flies > > Tom Sawyer > > \*\* (and I really like most of Twain’s works) _Tom Sawyer_ is certainly one of Twain’s lesser works. Tom’s not a bad kid, but you know he’s going to grow up to be one of the Chamber of Commerce types in their town. And while I love most of _Huck Finn_, the book really could have done without the part that involves Tom Sawyer. Reading through that part is almost painful. I plan on skipping past it when I re-read _Huck Finn_ in the future. I liked _A Separate Peace_ and _Lord of the Flies_ when I had to read them in school. I have no idea whether I’d like them now. Which reminds me of an author that I loved in my late teens, and on reading him later, I had to wonder what had gotten into me and my friends that had us devouring his books. That would be **Herman Hesse**. ---
**Author:** ![kitap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b9e5f3/32.png) [@kitap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kitap)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/52 "2019-09-23T12:56:34Z")
I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again : Thomas Hardy was reincarnated. He is George R R Martin. Nothing happy ever happens is the motto of both. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/53 "2019-09-23T13:01:09Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > I read _The Three Musketeers_ a few years ago – in part because I’d enjoyed various movie adaptations, and in part because I decided that I wanted to expand my horizons, and read some classic literature. > > It was…OK. I struggled with some of the names and references, but mostly what I remember being surprised about (and not in a good way) was how much of the book revolved around the heroes worrying about how much (or, more precisely, how little) money they had, and coming up with schemes to make money. I’d read the (very abridged) Junior Library version when I was a kid, and loved it. And the 1970s movie version with Michael York, Oliver Reed, etc. stuck pretty close to that abridgment. One thing about the abridged version is that, throughout, Cardinal Richelieu is the Bad Guy operating behind the scenes for nefarious purposes who we rarely see directly. When, at the end, he gives D’Artagnan his lieutenant’s commission in the Musketeers, it’s really not clear why; it’s something of an admission that he’s been outplayed by D’Artagnan, but really, just letting him go would suffice. A few years ago, I read the unabridged version, just for fun. You see a lot more of Richelieu and are much more privy to his thoughts there, and not only does he make a lot more sense there, but his giving D’Artagnan that commission does too. The abridged version feels almost cartoonish by comparison. ---
**Author:** ![divemaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/divemaster/32/78_2.png) [@divemaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/divemaster)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/54 "2019-09-23T14:30:18Z")
I’ll second (third?) **Catch-22**. Found it tedious and unfunny. I’ll also second (third?) **Dune**. When you have to have a glossary and a character schematic just to keep track of the plot, your book is too complicated to relax and enjoy. I worked harder at reading \*\*Dune \*\*than most of my assigned readings and term papers. I like sci-fi (mostly from the “Golden Age”), and like a lot of Heinlein’s work. Back in the day it seemed that everyone and his brother was either reading or recommending **Stranger in a Strange Land** and **Time Enough for Love**. TEfL–I couldn’t make it all the way through. One of the few books I’ve put down, promising myself I’d “pick it back up a little later” and never did. And don’t feel compelled to. There’s only so much kiddie-diddling I can handle. I did manage to finish SiaSL. But it was just a bunch of hippy-dippy New Age crapola. Bleah. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/55 "2019-09-23T14:56:44Z")
Charles Dickens. A Christmas Carol is marginally readable, nothing else is. I find Terry Pratchett and George R.R. Martin boring. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/56 "2019-09-23T15:05:03Z")
> [@divemaster](#): > > I like sci-fi (mostly from the “Golden Age”), and like a lot of Heinlein’s work. Back in the day it seemed that everyone and his brother was either reading or recommending **Stranger in a Strange Land** and **Time Enough for Love**. > > TEfL–I couldn’t make it all the way through. One of the few books I’ve put down, promising myself I’d “pick it back up a little later” and never did. And don’t feel compelled to. There’s only so much kiddie-diddling I can handle. > > I did manage to finish SiaSL. But it was just a bunch of hippy-dippy New Age crapola. Bleah. Yeah, _Time Enough For Love_ was crap from the get-go, and while I enjoyed _Stranger_ back in the day, I’m almost afraid to re-read it: even without opening it, I can tell that it won’t have worn well. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/57 "2019-09-23T15:27:48Z")
Heinlein hasn’t aged well. Unfortunately neither has Asimov. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/58 "2019-09-23T15:34:41Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > Heinlein hasn’t aged well. Unfortunately neither has Asimov. I’m just gonna say that Asimov sucked as a fiction writer: having read the _Foundation_ trilogy and the _I, Robot_ trilogy back in the day, he couldn’t create a decent character to save his life, AFAICT. His nonfiction is quite good, though. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/59 "2019-09-23T15:36:13Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > while I enjoyed _Stranger_ back in the day, I’m almost afraid to re-read it: even without opening it, I can tell that it won’t have worn well. Given that the antagonists in the books are religious cultural conservatives who prioritize beliefs over facts and are wielding their political power, you might be surprised. ---
**Author:** ![Wrenching\_Spanners](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecb155/32.png) [@Wrenching\_Spanners](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrenching_Spanners)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659/60 "2019-09-23T15:44:59Z")
Add me to the Heinlein list. I was into science fiction when I was in high school, especially classic science fiction. Heinlein seemed like an author I should enjoy. I liked his writing style and character development well enough. But it seemed like every book I read, 3/4 of the way through the book, he just threw away the plot. I think I read four of his books and permanently gave up after that. In each one, it just seemed like he took a dump on the plot just when he should have been building towards a climax. Also Arthur C. Clarke, although with him, I just found the novels boring and put them down after a couple of chapters. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-famous-works-of-fiction-popular-with-readers-and-critics-both-do-you-not-care-for/840659.md?page=4)