# What Good are Gag Orders against Trump? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [October 18, 2023, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753 "2023-10-18T14:21:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2023, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/41 "2023-10-19T12:57:50Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Whatever it’s called, it’s all about stringing along the rubes. Then leaving them hanging. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2023, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/42 "2023-10-19T13:09:45Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > He has been collecting “rope” his entire life, and this "rope’ doesn’t seem to be magically making a noose and slipping itself around his neck all by itself. At some point, the rope actually become too long to hang himself with. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2023, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/43 "2023-10-19T13:36:59Z")
To be fair, Trump’s used to having something excessively long and dangling knotted around his neck. Have you seen his neckties? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/44 "2023-10-20T15:21:18Z")
Someone is checking up on their Big Scout Book of Knot Tying: > **[Judge Chastises Trump For 'Blatant Violation of the Gag Order' on His Clerk,...](https://themessenger.com/politics/trump-gag-order-blatant-violation-judge-engoron)** > > New York Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron is upset Trump failed to delete a post attacking his clerk on his campaign page, weeks after the imposition of a gag order. > [@](#): > > After Trump’s lawyers provided their account of what transpired, Engoron and Greenfield whispered to each other and left the development on a cliffhanger. Engoron said he would take the matter “under advisement.” I do like the standard Trump lawyer defense of pleading incompetence on behalf of themselves and their client, though. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/45 "2023-10-20T20:22:27Z")
Trump fined $5K for violating gag order. Gift link: > **[Trump Fined $5,000 for Breaking Gag Order by Leaving Abusive Post Online](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/20/nyregion/trump-fraud-trial-gag-order-fine.html?unlocked_article_code=1.4Ew.IkvG.JCoY1JWj_8KY&smid=url-share)** > > The former president used social media to attack a clerk for the judge in his civil fraud case, and left a copy of the post online for weeks. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/46 "2023-10-20T20:28:47Z")
Trump uses gag order fine to raise funds. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/47 "2023-10-20T20:28:47Z")
Yes, it is mostly symbolic - 5 grand is morning hamberder money for Trump. However as I said in the thread on this case: > Judge Engoron gives Trump a symbolic $5000 fine, and accompanied that with a rather stern warning: > > > “Make no mistake: future violations, **whether intentional or unintentional,** will subject the violator to far more severe sanctions, which may include, but are not limited to, steeper financial penalties, holding Donald Trump in contempt of court, **and possibly imprisoning him.** ” > > Bolding mine ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/48 "2023-10-20T21:59:46Z")
Gotta build that record for appeal. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/49 "2023-10-20T22:13:42Z")
Exactly. Especially here, where he’s slagged the judge’s law clerk. Judges have to be protective of their staff, but they also have to be careful not to let their personal interest in protecting their staff cloud their judgment, or even _appear_ to cloud their judgment. That way lies a successful Trump appeal. So start with a fine and a reprimand. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2023, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/50 "2023-10-21T16:23:14Z")
Do you really think his nibs can stop? [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/4cf4O-hUg78/maxresdefault.jpg "Bugs Bunny (Crossing the Line)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cf4O-hUg78&t=25s) ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2023, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/51 "2023-10-21T18:10:49Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Judges have to be protective of their staff, but they also have to be careful not to let their personal interest in protecting their staff cloud their judgment, or even _appear_ to cloud their judgment. That way lies a successful Trump appeal. Having said that, I have a feeling he’s going to appeal on that basis anyhow because he loves pushing the narrative that the justice system is out to get him. Would any judges from any appeals court be sympathetic to the idea that Engoron is protecting his staff too fiercely in this specific scenario? In my opinion that’s a hard sell but IANAL. Also speaking of appeals, they aren’t free are they? Like, he has the absolute right to an appeal of whatever but he still has to pay his lawyers to do it, right? I feel like I have seen a few headlines here and there over the years where Trump said he was going to appeal but later on quietly decided not to, probably because it was going to cost him money just to get smacked down again. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2023, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/52 "2023-10-21T20:30:24Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats2](#): > > See, this is what I don’t understand. Why are we so terrified of the MAGA crowd? All Si\_Amigo said was that the Judge has to be _extremely fair._ And this is true for any high profile suspect. > [@Aspenglow](#): > > I get the feeling lots of people in this country are only just noticing how long it takes to bring complex cases involving precedent-setting issues to completion within our justice system. None of this is new or novel. Yeah, I told the Garland haters her shit like this takes time. Lost of time. The wheels for Federal Whitecollar crimes grind slowly. Even for non-whitecollar crime. I was on a Joint Organized Crime task force. When I joined, the TF had been up and running for about a year already, and after a year later, they decided to go for it, kinda based upon the Ironclad “99 counts of money laundering and wire fraud”, even tho we all _knew_ those guys were murdering drug dealers. Thats a bit over two years for a drug cartel. (note several local and state arrests had been done and failed, mainly due to juror and witness intimidation and killing. ) > [@Icarus](#): > > When an arsonist sets fire to a house, first we put out the fire, then we catch the arsonist AND STOP HIM FROM STARTING MORE FIRES. trump aint gonna try to fix any more presidential elections for over a year now. > [@Aspenglow](#): > > Have you got a lot of experience with gag orders and judges? Because I do. And I can tell you that judges are in fact cautious in handing out sanctions for violating gag orders. A graduated approach is not uncommon. Remember Paul Manafort? He got a graduated approach for violating his conditions of release, too. > > I will say again, for maybe the 10th time, that as much as you and others want to pretend Trump’s cases are like anyone else’s, they’re not. Exactly. > [@Gyrate](#): > > I do like the standard Trump lawyer defense of pleading incompetence on behalf of themselves and their client, though. Well, it’s true, anyway. I mean it’s their only true point, aint it? ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2023, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/53 "2023-10-21T21:20:13Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > Like, he has the absolute right to an appeal of whatever but he still has to pay his lawyers to do it, right? Why should he start paying his lawyers now? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2023, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/54 "2023-10-22T02:08:00Z")
> [@Kent\_Clark](#): > > Why should he start paying his lawyers now? A couple have wisely demanded payment up front. Many of the rest are either MAGA koolaid drinkers, or inexperienced bunglers who just want the publicity. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2023, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/55 "2023-10-22T02:53:13Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > inexperienced bunglers who just want the publicity. Yes, facing bar discipline proceedings does tend to generate publicity. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2023, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753/56 "2023-10-27T20:12:33Z")
Legal Eagle just posted a video about the gag orders, and Trump’s violations. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/mIb5njx3rK0/maxresdefault.jpg "Trump Gagged; Immediately Violates Gag Order") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIb5njx3rK0) I found it pretty compelling. Devin, who narrates these videos, he’s clearly not a fan of Trump and that comes through in any video about him. However, he does concede when some of Trump’s objections have an iota of merit, and I think he does a pretty good job of explaining why some of these gag orders have been restrained and more narrow than what prosecutors have asked for. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-good-are-gag-orders-against-trump/991753.md?page=2)