# What happened to JonBenet Ramsey? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 11, 2010, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577 "2010-01-11T23:41:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/341 "2010-01-14T22:39:15Z")
But this was all presumed to have been done while the parents were sleeping? So, again, why wouldn’t the perpetrator have taken the body with him, if he intended to try for a ransom for her, or do you think that was ‘misdirection’ on the killer’s part? Why would the killer even need to misdirect the investigation, if nobody had a clue who he was anyway? ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/342 "2010-01-14T22:42:52Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > But this was all presumed to have been done while the parents were sleeping? So, again, why wouldn’t the perpetrator have taken the body with him, if he intended to try for a ransom for her, or do you think that was ‘misdirection’ on the killer’s part? Why would the killer even need to misdirect the investigation, if nobody had a clue who he was anyway? Maybe hoping that the police will suspect the Ramseys and not focus their efforts on an intruder? Which pretty much is what happened. As for why not take the body–wouldn’t it be safer to leave it? The longer he has the body on him, the more likely he is to be caught. If he leaves it, he has nothing tying him to the crime. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/343 "2010-01-14T22:43:42Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > But this was all presumed to have been done while the parents were sleeping? So, again, why wouldn’t the perpetrator have taken the body with him, if he intended to try for a ransom for her, or do you think that was ‘misdirection’ on the killer’s part? Why would the killer even need to misdirect the investigation, if nobody had a clue who he was anyway? Theory: He originally intended to kidnap the kid, wrote the note (probably as misdrection, intending to abduct the kid, but not to give her back), went and got the kid, brought her down to the basement, got out of control and killed her before he meant to, panicked and left, either forgetting about the note he’d already left or not caring. Bear in mind, it is hardly plausible at all that the ramseys would have had anything to gain by faking a ransom note if they’d known the body was in the house and would certainly be found. ETA why the hell would he take the body? ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/344 "2010-01-14T22:44:07Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > How calm do you have to be to wipe a vagina? After you’ve just beaten and strangled the person said vagina belonged to, and bearing in mind it was a 6 year old girl, I’d say you was thinking pretty clear-headedly. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/345 "2010-01-14T22:45:08Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Theory: > > He originally intended to kidnap the kid, wrote the note (probably as misdrection, intending to abduct the kid, but not to give her back), went and got the kid, brought her down to the basement, got out of control and killed her before he meant to, panicked and left, either forgetting about the note he’d already left or not caring. > > Bear in mind, it is hardly plausible at all that the ramseys would have had anything to gain by faking a ransom note if they’d known the body was in the house and would certainly be found. But they did have the most to gain by misdirecting the case. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/346 "2010-01-14T22:45:59Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > After you’ve just beaten and strangled the person said vagina belonged to, and bearing in mind it was a 6 year old girl, I’d say you was thinking pretty clear-headedly. No you don’t. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/347 "2010-01-14T22:46:22Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > ETA why the hell would he take the body? Because no-one will pay a ransom when they’ve already got the dead body. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/348 "2010-01-14T22:46:53Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > After you’ve just beaten and strangled the person said vagina belonged to, and bearing in mind it was a 6 year old girl, I’d say you was thinking pretty clear-headedly. OK, by that rationale, you can say that it’s bizarre that John and Patsy Ramsey were level headed enough to both kill their daughter and then write a detailed ransom note. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/349 "2010-01-14T22:47:48Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > But they did have the most to gain by misdirecting the case. There was no chance they could have succeeded at misdirecting the case with a ransom note, and why would an intruder have any less to gain? ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/350 "2010-01-14T22:48:41Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > No you don’t. 😕 Come again? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/351 "2010-01-14T22:49:48Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Because no-one will pay a ransom when they’ve already got the dead body. He never cared about a ransom in the first place, and even if he’d originally wanted one, he wasn;'t going to get one with a dead body, plus lugging a dead toddler around is a pretty suspicious thing to do. That could lead to unpleasant questions from the police. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/352 "2010-01-14T22:51:30Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > 😕 Come again? Sure. You don’t have to be clear headed to wipe a vagina. Incidentally, your own weak reasoning would work just as well agaionsy the Ramseys. If an abductor would be too flustered to wipe tjhe body, then why wouldn’t the Ramseys be too flustered? ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/353 "2010-01-14T22:52:02Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > There was no chance they could have succeeded at misdirecting the case with a ransom note, and why would an intruder have any less to gain? Because nobody knew who he was anyway. If the police dont know who they are looking for, why point them in any direction? The only person who could want the police to look in a specific direction, is someone who doesn’t want them looking in one that is hazardous to their being caught. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/354 "2010-01-14T22:52:41Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I don’t think there is any meaningful difference between saying a piece of evidence does not exclude either the parents or an intruder and saying there is no evdience against the parents. anything consistent with an intruder can’t be held as evidence against the parents. even a lack of foreign DNA? Heh heh. Anyone who can see past you on this one isn’t trying. That you can’t see something doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. I’m done here. ---
**Author:** ![Lamar\_Mundane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lamar\_Mundane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamar_Mundane)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/355 "2010-01-14T22:57:50Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > What is your basis for saying Crime Library is biased? Just because it doesn’t say what you want it to say doesn’t mean it’s biased. Because I read the damn thing. It is a 38 page defense of the Ramseys. The ransom note, the single best piece of physical evidence in the case, gets one sentence of coverage. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/356 "2010-01-14T22:57:57Z")
Btw, DtC, do you also have some sort of proof that the ransom note was written before she died? ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/357 "2010-01-14T22:59:22Z")
America is back to (pre-9/11) normal. Bickering fecklessly about a decades-old unsolved murder. Say, hundreds of non-beauty pagent winning, non-rich, non-Caucasian little girls have been murdered. Do you have equal concern for _their_ unsolved murders. Or is this a sick hobby, like the gladiatorials the ancient Romans drooled over? ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/358 "2010-01-14T23:11:29Z")
> [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](#): > > America is back to (pre-9/11) normal. > > Bickering fecklessly about a decades-old unsolved murder. > Say, hundreds of non-beauty pagent winning, non-rich, non-Caucasian little girls have been murdered. > > Do you have equal concern for _their_ unsolved murders. > > Or is this a sick hobby, like the gladiatorials the ancient Romans drooled over? We care about them, sure, but we don’t know about them–there hasn’t been any coverage. Plus, this is objectively speaking a fascinating unsolved crime. As someone pointed out for every evidence for the parents there’s a piece of evidence that makes it seem like there’s no way they could have done it. I don’t see what’s so wrong with trying to figure it out. People like murder mysteries–is that so bad? ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/359 "2010-01-14T23:13:07Z")
If it’s so distasteful, you know where the door is. ---
**Author:** ![UTejas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UTejas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UTejas)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577/360 "2010-01-14T23:14:57Z")
> [@Lamar\_Mundane](#): > > Because I read the damn thing. It is a 38 page defense of the Ramseys. The ransom note, the single best piece of physical evidence in the case, gets one sentence of coverage. Why, exactly, is a three-page rambling screed the best piece of evidence? I am asking this in earnest. It seems to me as if the single best piece of physical evidence is two DNA samples in different locations from the same unknown caucasian male. To go along with, you know, duct tape and cord from not inside the house. The the other half of the paintbrush removed from the house. The signs of forced entry along the window. The bootprints on the floor from boots not belonging to anyone in the family. The hair. The signs of stun gun use on the body. How is all of that less important than a note written by a crazy person? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-jonbenet-ramsey/524577.md?page=19)