# What happened to the gang of neo-cons that helped steer us into the Iraq mess? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 21, 2006, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612 "2006-08-21T17:16:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/1 "2006-08-21T17:16:13Z")
People like [Richard Perle](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Perle) & [Paul Wolfowitz](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Wolfowitz) etc. Are they still considered fonts of wisdom? How the hell do you punish these guys professionally? > [@](#): > > [Neoconservatives](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservative) won a landmark victory with the Bush Doctrine after September 11th. Thomas Donnelly, a resident fellow at the influential conservative thinktank, American Enterprise Institute (AEI), which has been under neoconservative influence since the Reagan Administration, argued in “The Underpinnings of the Bush doctrine” that > > “the fundamental premise of the Bush Doctrine is true: The United States possesses the means—economic, military, diplomatic—to realize its expansive geopolitical purposes. Further, and especially in light of the domestic political reaction to the attacks of September 11, the victory in Afghanistan and the remarkable skill demonstrated by President Bush in focusing national attention, it is equally true that Americans possess the requisite political willpower to pursue an expansive strategy.” > > In his well-publicized piece “The Case for American Empire” in the conservative Weekly Standard, Max Boot argued that “The most realistic response to terrorism is for America to embrace its imperial role.” He countered sentiments that the “United States must become a kinder, gentler nation, must eschew quixotic missions abroad, must become, in Pat Buchanan’s phrase, ‘a republic, not an empire’,” arguing that “In fact this analysis is exactly backward: The September 11 attack was a result of insufficient American involvement and ambition; the solution is to be more expansive in our goals and more assertive in their implementation.” > > President Bush has expressed praise for Natan Sharansky’s book, The Case For Democracy, which promotes a foreign policy philosophy nearly identical to neoconservatives’. President Bush has effusively praised this book, calling it a “glimpse of how I think”.[8] ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/2 "2006-08-21T17:24:28Z")
[QUOTE=astro] How the hell do you punish these guys professionally? [/QUOTE] You can’t. They’ve got tenure. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/3 "2006-08-21T17:25:35Z")
[THE ARCHITECTS OF WAR: WHERE ARE THEY NOW?](http://thinkprogress.org/the-architects-where-are-they-now/) > [@](#): > > Where He Is Now: Bush promoted **Wolfowitz** to head the World Bank in March 2005. > … > Where He Is Now: Currently, **Perle** is a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute where he specializes in national security and defense issues. He has been investigated for ethical violations concerning war profiteering and other conflicts of interest. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/4 "2006-08-21T17:30:20Z")
Wolfowitz is now head of the World Bank. Oddly enough, Robert Mcnamara also became head of the World Bank after leading the U.S. into a disasterous pointless war. I don’t think Perle had an official post in the Bush Administration. I think he still works for AEI and PNAC. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/5 "2006-08-21T18:38:23Z")
Rumsfield and Cheney are employed in the administration too. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/6 "2006-08-21T19:52:24Z")
No…really?? Rumsfield AND Cheney, huh? I hadn’t heard. Do you have a cite for that… 😛 -XT ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/7 "2006-08-21T20:41:25Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] Do you have a cite for that… [/QUOTE] Dagnabit XT, lookat the link I supplied. It’s got Rumsfeld, Cheney and (as a special bonus) Bush Too. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/8 "2006-08-21T20:51:11Z")
Squink…you know I love ya. But are you SERIOULSY claiming BUSH is in the Administration??? :dubious: 😛 -XT ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/9 "2006-08-21T21:14:22Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] are you SERIOULSY claiming BUSH is in the Administration??? :dubious: [/QUOTE] So **Landru** , _being_ the body, is not also _of_ the body? I’m going to have to watch that episode again. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/10 "2006-08-21T21:46:10Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] Squink…you know I love ya. But are you SERIOULSY claiming BUSH is in the Administration??? :dubious: 😛 -XT [/QUOTE] Nah, as with most Admins (with the notable exception of Nixon’s), a clone had to take over within the first three months. ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/11 "2006-08-21T22:01:56Z")
[QUOTE=astro] People like [Richard Perle](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Perle) & [Paul Wolfowitz](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Wolfowitz) etc. Are they still considered fonts of wisdom? How the hell do you punish these guys professionally? [/QUOTE] What happened to them? They got the Medal of Freedom and moved on to cushy jobs. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/12 "2006-08-21T23:13:02Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] So **Landru** , _being_ the body, is not also _of_ the body? [/QUOTE] Decider, Decider, what is _Decider_ ??? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/13 "2006-08-21T23:20:06Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Nah, as with most Admins (with the notable exception of Nixon’s), a clone had to take over within the first three months. [/QUOTE] No, it’s Kevin Kline. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2006, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/14 "2006-08-21T23:20:13Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] Decider, Decider, what is _Decider_ ??? [/QUOTE] \< Points at **ElvisL1ves** \> You are not of the Body ! ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2006, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/15 "2006-08-22T00:35:32Z")
C’mon, people. What part of getting the Presidential Medal of Freedom don’t you understand? ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2006, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/16 "2006-08-22T01:05:41Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] [QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] Decider, Decider, what is Decider ??? [/QUOTE] \< Points at **ElvisL1ves** \> You are not of the Body ! [/QUOTE] Ye be strangers. In town for Festival? ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2006, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happened-to-the-gang-of-neo-cons-that-helped-steer-us-into-the-iraq-mess/369612/17 "2006-08-22T01:15:12Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] So **Landru** , _being_ the body, is not also _of_ the body? I’m going to have to watch that episode again. [/QUOTE] That’s the one where Mr. Sulu looks…strange.