# What happens if Bill Barr is fired or resigns? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [February 13, 2020, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906 "2020-02-13T22:24:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/21 "2020-02-14T13:19:30Z")
Barr is competent and about as bad as public officials get, from a sense of morality, decency, and honor, but he only seems so bad because the rest of the Trump team are so incompetent. Barr is an average professional cabinet-level public servant lawyer with what appears to be an ugly combination of neocon and paleocon views. Most of the rest of Trump’s cabinet and advisers are incompetent clowns, so someone with the skills and experience of an average cabinet official seems like an evil genius. IMO, anyway. I suspect he’s trying to subtly signal to Trump that Trump’s tweets are making it harder for Barr to use the DOJ to protect him, but I’m not sure if Trump is capable of detecting this kind of subtlety. We’ll see in the next couple of days if Trump responds with a Barr-bashing tweet. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/22 "2020-02-14T13:27:23Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I suspect he’s trying to subtly signal to Trump that Trump’s tweets are making it harder for Barr to use the DOJ to protect him, but I’m not sure if Trump is capable of detecting this kind of subtlety. That’s pretty much it, IMO. Barr is begging Loser Donald to please stop saying the quiet part loud, to which he will invariably respond “I have an Article 2 that gives me the absolute right to do anything I want”. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/23 "2020-02-14T14:09:33Z")
Yeppers. Here’s [Laura Ingraham](https://www.mediamatters.org/laura-ingraham/laura-ingraham-barr-was-basically-telling-trump-dont-worry-i-got) getting it: > [@](#): > > the media sees this sexy story of Trump versus Barr but, they missed the fact that Barr was basically telling Trump, ‘don’t worry, I got this.’ ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/24 "2020-02-14T14:23:54Z")
> [@74westy](#): > > Nothing to do with any moral centre. He’s just trying to get Trump’s guy off as lightly as possible and Trump’s big mouth is making it hard to do that. I’m actually somewhat sympathetic to Barr in this instance. I’ve been in a position where someone asked my help to manage a delicate situation. I knew it would be tricky, but I thought I could make it work - right up until the person who asked for my help blew it all up because they couldn’t keep their stupid mouth shut. There’s no worse feeling than having someone like that joggle your elbow after they asked for your help. Of course, Barr should have known this would happen, so it’s not a lot of sympathy. ---
**Author:** ![tripthicket](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripthicket/32/297_2.png) [@tripthicket](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tripthicket)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/25 "2020-02-14T14:37:47Z")
But why go so public with this? Why not convey the message in a phone-call or a face-to-face? This is a show for the Great Unwashed, not the president. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/26 "2020-02-14T14:56:32Z")
> [@tripthicket](#): > > But why go so public with this? Why not convey the message in a phone-call or a face-to-face? This is a show for the Great Unwashed, not the president. Nope. Trump gets his ideas from the TeeVee. So, Barr goes out in public and makes statements. The statements get amplified by the talking heads and skirts on Fox. Trump watches and absorbs. Same as it ever was. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/27 "2020-02-14T23:52:13Z")
From the Votemaster (actually from Zenger): > [@](#): > > \*t’s even possible that Trump himself is concerned about the optics of the whole situation, and that the President and the AG sat down and cooked up this bit of political theater to give themselves both some cover. Given how often Barr has been willing to do Trump’s dirty work, and given that he got the job in the first place because of all the manure he toted on behalf of Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush after Iran-Contra, our money is on the interpretation that Barr isn’t actually upset. We should know pretty soon, though. When Trump administration insiders fall from grace, they tend to fall fast. My only argument against this interpretation is that it is hard to see the orange menace allowing public criticism from one of his pee-ons, no matter how mild. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2020, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/28 "2020-02-15T00:05:16Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > From the Votemaster (actually from Zenger): > My only argument against this interpretation is that it is hard to see the orange menace allowing public criticism from one of his pee-ons, no matter how mild. I agree with others who’ve guessed that Barr cleared this in advance with Trump’s handlers, who are now working to reassure Trump that Barr HAD to utter some fairly-strong criticisms or the scam wouldn’t work. HANDLER: Don’t worry, Daddy, Barr knows you must be President-for-Life. But we’re not there yet. If we aren’t careful, the people will catch on and protest in the streets. TRUMP: I’ll just send in my troops to mow them down if they try that! HANDLER: Daddy, you can’t do that. Not until we have full control of all communications media and have full buy-in from all armed forces. You can’t declare yourself President-for-Life until then. Barr is working on it. You have to let him do his job. TRUMP: I don’t want to wait! What is wrong with you people, asking me to wait! HANDLER: (In low tones, to attendant) Bring in Hope Hicks with the bag of cheeseburgers _now._ ---
**Author:** ![MikeG](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikeg/32/4329_2.png) [@MikeG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeG)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2020, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/29 "2020-02-15T00:18:13Z")
It means Trump lost the election and it’s the day after the new president has been sworn in. No way in Hell Barr is going, he’s doing just as he’s told. Including a nice little dog and pony show to distract folks. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2020, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/30 "2020-02-15T03:26:42Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Collins will express “severe concerns” and then vote to confirm anyway. With a chorus of “tut-tut” from other Republican Senators. ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2020, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/31 "2020-02-15T20:38:12Z")
So Barr _might_ join the [list of former Tramp minions](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Trump_administration_dismissals_and_resignations).\* I have no idea who Tramp might choose as a replacement minion or how long they’ll last, no matter how repulsive they are - I avoid the gossip. But we can be sure Barr will take a break, dictate a memoir, hit the gabfest circuit, and take a partnership at some white-shoe powerhouse. But if he’s out as AG involuntarily, he likely won’t join the [list of Tramp’s pardons](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_granted_executive_clemency_by_Donald_Trump).\*\* Will a future DoJ or a state AG find charges to bring against him? - This looks current. \*\* Needs updating. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2020, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/32 "2020-02-16T21:29:00Z")
This is all over the news right now: [Over 1,100 ex-Justice Dept officials call on Barr to resign for doing Trump’s ‘bidding’](https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/483291-over-1100-ex-justice-dept-officials-call-on-barr-to-resign-for-doing). > [@](#): > > “Barr’s actions in doing the President’s personal bidding unfortunately speak louder than his words,” the group of ex-officials wrote in a letter shared on Sunday by Protect Democracy, a nonprofit watchdog group. “Those actions, and the damage they have done to the Department of Justice’s reputation for integrity and the rule of law, require Mr. Barr to resign.” The entire letter can be found here: [DOJ Alumni Statement on the Events Surrounding the Sentencing of Roger Stone](https://medium.com/@dojalumni/doj-alumni-statement-on-the-events-surrounding-the-sentencing-of-roger-stone-c2cb75ae4937). > [@](#): > > We, the undersigned, are alumni of the United States Department of Justice (DOJ) who have collectively served both Republican and Democratic administrations. Each of us strongly condemns President Trump’s and Attorney General Barr’s interference in the fair administration of justice. > > As former DOJ officials, we each proudly took an oath to support and defend our Constitution and faithfully execute the duties of our offices. The very first of these duties is to apply the law equally to all Americans. This obligation flows directly from the Constitution, and it is embedded in countless rules and laws governing the conduct of DOJ lawyers. The Justice Manual — the DOJ’s rulebook for its lawyers — states that “the rule of law depends on the evenhanded administration of justice”; that the Department’s legal decisions “must be impartial and insulated from political influence”; and that the Department’s prosecutorial powers, in particular, must be “exercised free from partisan consideration.” > > All DOJ lawyers are well-versed in these rules, regulations, and constitutional commands. They stand for the proposition that political interference in the conduct of a criminal prosecution is anathema to the Department’s core mission and to its sacred obligation to ensure equal justice under the law. > > And yet, President Trump and Attorney General Barr have openly and repeatedly flouted this fundamental principle, most recently in connection with the sentencing of President Trump’s close associate, Roger Stone, who was convicted of serious crimes. The Department has a long-standing practice in which political appointees set broad policies that line prosecutors apply to individual cases. That practice exists to animate the constitutional principles regarding the even-handed application of the law. Although there are times when political leadership appropriately weighs in on individual prosecutions, it is unheard of for the Department’s top leaders to overrule line prosecutors, who are following established policies, in order to give preferential treatment to a close associate of the President, as Attorney General Barr did in the Stone case. It is even more outrageous for the Attorney General to intervene as he did here — after the President publicly condemned the sentencing recommendation that line prosecutors had already filed in court. > > Such behavior is a grave threat to the fair administration of justice. In this nation, we are all equal before the law. A person should not be given special treatment in a criminal prosecution because they are a close political ally of the President. Governments that use the enormous power of law enforcement to punish their enemies and reward their allies are not constitutional republics; they are autocracies. > > We welcome Attorney General Barr’s belated acknowledgment that the DOJ’s law enforcement decisions must be independent of politics; that it is wrong for the President to interfere in specific enforcement matters, either to punish his opponents or to help his friends; and that the President’s public comments on DOJ matters have gravely damaged the Department’s credibility. But Mr. Barr’s actions in doing the President’s personal bidding unfortunately speak louder than his words. Those actions, and the damage they have done to the Department of Justice’s reputation for integrity and the rule of law, require Mr. Barr to resign. But because we have little expectation he will do so, it falls to the Department’s career officials to take appropriate action to uphold their oaths of office and defend nonpartisan, apolitical justice. > > For these reasons, we support and commend the four career prosecutors who upheld their oaths and stood up for the Department’s independence by withdrawing from the Stone case and/or resigning from the Department. Our simple message to them is that we — and millions of other Americans — stand with them. And we call on every DOJ employee to follow their heroic example and be prepared to report future abuses to the Inspector General, the Office of Professional Responsibility, and Congress; to refuse to carry out directives that are inconsistent with their oaths of office; to withdraw from cases that involve such directives or other misconduct; and, if necessary, to resign and report publicly — in a manner consistent with professional ethics — to the American people the reasons for their resignation. We likewise call on the other branches of government to protect from retaliation those employees who uphold their oaths in the face of unlawful directives. The rule of law and the survival of our Republic demand nothing less. So there is some public pressure, at least. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2020, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/33 "2020-02-16T22:19:24Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > So there is some public pressure, at least. Prediction: it’ll be totally ignored by Barr and of course, Trump. ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2020, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/34 "2020-02-17T05:15:49Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > This is all over the news right now: [Over 1,100 ex-Justice Dept officials call on Barr to resign for doing Trump’s ‘bidding’](https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/483291-over-1100-ex-justice-dept-officials-call-on-barr-to-resign-for-doing).The entire letter can be found here: [DOJ Alumni Statement on the Events Surrounding the Sentencing of Roger Stone](https://medium.com/@dojalumni/doj-alumni-statement-on-the-events-surrounding-the-sentencing-of-roger-stone-c2cb75ae4937). That’s way too many words for Tramp to read or have read to him, and Barr likely has a good supply of toilet tissue anyway, so we know where that letter will go. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2020, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/35 "2020-02-17T15:20:54Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > Prediction: it’ll be totally ignored by Barr and of course, Trump. They’ll all be portrayed as ANGRY RADICAL SOCIALIST DEMOCRATS looking to undo an election by going on a WITCH HUNT! And the Trump base will believe them. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/36 "2020-02-18T01:09:48Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > They’ll all be portrayed as ANGRY RADICAL SOCIALIST DEMOCRATS looking to undo an election by going on a WITCH HUNT! And the Trump base will believe them. Yes, that attempt will be made. But it’s now over _ **2,000** _ ex-Justice Dept. officials who have called on Barr to resign. The number doubled from Sunday (when the letter was released) to Monday: > [@](#): > > More than 2,000 former prosecutors and other DOJ officials call on Attorney General Bill Barr to resign > CNN Digital Expansion 2017 > By Laura Jarrett, CNN > Updated 5:29 PM ET, Mon February 17, 2020 > …The statement’s signatures, which numbered 1,100 when the post was initially published, had risen to 2,003 signatures as of Monday afternoon. > The rare statement from the officials – mostly former career prosecutors, but also some former political appointees – came in the wake of an extraordinary week at the Justice Department. In just one week, career prosecutors withdrew from a case after Barr overruled their sentencing recommendation, the attorney general pushed back against the President in an unusual interview and separately ordered an examination of politically charged cases involving those close to President Donald Trump. > The statement went on to say career attorneys should report any troubling actions they see to the department’s Inspector General. … [https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/16/politics/prosecutors-doj-officials-barr-resign/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/16/politics/prosecutors-doj-officials-barr-resign/index.html) Of course it’s true that the Trump base will believe anything they’re told—but that doesn’t really help Bill Barr conduct business at a DOJ that is increasingly appalled by his Trump-handmaiden shenanigans. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/37 "2020-02-18T01:41:05Z")
[slight hijack] I’ve been meaning to ask about this quote: > [@Bill Barr](#): > > …make it impossible for me to do my job and to assure the courts and the prosecutors in the department that we’re doing our work with integrity. How successful might a motion for mistrial in federal court be right now, given that the defense team has a public statement that it is impossible to assure the courts that work is being done with integrity by the prosecution? ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/38 "2020-02-18T02:26:21Z")
> [@Snowboarder Bo](#): > > How successful might a motion for mistrial in federal court be right now, given that the defense team has a public statement that it is impossible to assure the courts that work is being done with integrity by the prosecution? With a judge appointed by Tramp and ramrodded by Moscow Mitch, not much chance. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/39 "2020-02-18T02:42:50Z")
[This](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/02/17/roger-stone-sentence-judges-worried-political-interference/4788155002/) will bring some additional pressure to bear. (USA Today) > [@](#): > > A national association of federal judges has called an emergency meeting Tuesday to address growing concerns about the intervention of Justice Department officials and President Donald Trump in politically sensitive cases, the group’s president said Monday. > > Philadelphia U.S. District Judge Cynthia Rufe, who heads the independent Federal Judges Association, said the group “could not wait” until its spring conference to weigh in on a deepening crisis that has enveloped the Justice Department and Attorney General William Barr. > > “There are plenty of issues that we are concerned about,” Rufe told USA TODAY. “We’ll talk all of this through.” ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906/40 "2020-02-18T02:55:04Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > [slight hijack] > > I’ve been meaning to ask about this quote:How successful might a motion for mistrial in federal court be right now, given that the defense team has a public statement that it is impossible to assure the courts that work is being done with integrity by the prosecution? No one is asserting that any taint attached to the trial process, so there is no basis for a motion for mistrial. Barr is trying to subvert the sentencing proceeding, not the trial. Also, why would the defendant bring such a motion? Barr’s pique arises from not being able to go _easy_ enough on the defendant. That’s as topsy-turvy as it gets in the legal world. Barr is not Stone’s defense attorney. Barr’s corruption is already creating problems that will reverberate throughout our criminal justice system. I heard a noted criminal defense attorney say today that he had tucked Barr’s 4-page memorandum to the sentencing judge advocating for a lighter sentence into his briefcase in order to use it as a basis to argue for lighter sentences for his own clients in the future. I’m sure he’s not the only one who will use this tactic. And why should they not? Sauce for the goose… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-bill-barr-is-fired-or-resigns/847906.md?page=3)