# What Happens if I Fib to the Health Insurance Police? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 18, 2002, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666 "2002-12-18T22:14:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Igloo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Igloo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Igloo)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/1 "2002-12-18T22:14:28Z")
Don’t get me wrong. I am an upstanding citizen. I return things that aren’t mine; I pay when no one is looking. Still, my husband and I are looking into new health insurance but are at different steps in the process. He applied and was asked to provide the usual myriad of extremely personal questions and sometimes embarrassing health history, which he did. Then they asked if he was a smoker (this was on the phone) and he answered that he had smoked about two cigarettes in the past year – absolutely true; I was with him both times. He’s not a smoker, never has been. This, of course, threw the entire process into a frenzy and resulted in a higher rate and, more annoying, a bunch of phone calls and re-doing of paperwork. For my part, I smoke on occassion but am not habitual. In the past year, I have probably smoked a total of four packs. This has pretty much been my history (I’m in my mid-thirties) Seeing what my husband went through, I want to fib on this detail but certainly don’t want to do screw up the bigger picture of insurance. I’m really unsure as to whether or not it’s just one of those idiotic routines that begs to be subverted or if I might place my insurance in jeopardy by not admitting this. Any advice? ---
**Author:** ![Rug\_Burn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a87d85/32.png) [@Rug\_Burn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rug_Burn)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/2 "2002-12-18T22:32:20Z")
Would you be pissed if they raised your rates because of it? Would you feel incredibly guilty if you lie about it? Seems like a fairly easy answer to me, but only you know what you can live with. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/3 "2002-12-18T22:33:33Z")
I would think it depends on how the question is phrased. “Are you a smoker?” Do you consider yourself a smoker? If not, say no. “Have you smoked tobacco in the last \_\_\_ months?” Tell the truth. “How many cigarettes have you smoked in the last \_\_\_\_ months?” Again, tell the truth. Should the insurance company discover that you lied it can deny the policy. Depending on the regs in the state in question, the company may or may not be able to deny claims later if it determines that the underlying illness is related to something about which you lied. IANAL but I did work for two different insurance companies. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/4 "2002-12-18T22:35:04Z")
I think it might technically be fraud. It also might give them an easy ‘out’ of paying up if the truth came out. ---
**Author:** ![Igloo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Igloo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Igloo)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/5 "2002-12-18T22:40:33Z")
I don’t think it’s really a matter of being pissed about raised rates. I think my connundrum is more that _we are being totally honest_ if someone says, have you smoked in the last 12 months, and we answer “yes” but maybe the question is based more on people that smoke their asses off and only admit to a small amount, when we truly have not been “smokers”?. In other words, are we shooting ourselves in the foot by being completely honest when “honesty” may be interpreted as a giant red flag by the insurance company? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/6 "2002-12-18T22:43:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Rug Burn \* > \*\*Would you be pissed if they raised your rates because of it? Would you feel incredibly guilty if you lie about it? Seems like a fairly easy answer to me, but only you know what you can live with. \*\* If you lie and they find out you have perjured yourself and the contract is void. Can you live with that? Haj ---
**Author:** ![Igloo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Igloo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Igloo)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/7 "2002-12-18T22:45:01Z")
Mangetout – that’s really the gist of my question. _How_ does the truth come out? Do they interview people at remote vacation locations that have seen me light up after a few drinks? I would guess that any exposure to second hand smoke is _far_ worse than anything I have been doing intentionally. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/8 "2002-12-18T23:06:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Igloo \* > \*\*Then they asked if he was a smoker > \ > He’s not a smoker, never has been. \*\* There’s your answer. I believe that ‘smoker’ defines someone who smokes cigarettes every day, not once every few weeks or months. If not, then **everyone** who has ever put lips to cigarette is a ‘smoker’, which is obviously nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![SylverOne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c0e974/32.png) [@SylverOne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SylverOne)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/9 "2002-12-18T23:51:21Z")
I work for one of the biggest health insurers in the nation. As for what to put on your application, I can’t tell you that. I can tell you what will happen if it is determined that you falsified information. Your claims can be denied, and your coverage can be yanked. I’m not talking higher premiums, i’m talking no coverage what-so-ever. If payments were made by the insurer, previous to the errant insured information being discovered, the insurer does have legal recourse. I’ve only worked here for about 5 years, but fraud is still one of our biggest problems. This is of course, all dependant on the insurer finding out and determining what their definition of ‘smoker’ is compared to yours. I wouldn’t consider your husband a smoker. He probably inhales more second-hand smoke just in every day living, which isn’t what they are asking for. You must decide between your guilty conscience and possible higher premiums. Not to mention, keeping up the falsehood with your doctor, who will ask the same questions if it pertains to diagnosing an ailment, which is then coded on an insurance form, and sent to the payer, _every time you go see the doctor_. How much are those 4 packs worth to you? Good Luck, Syl ---
**Author:** ![Igloo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Igloo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Igloo)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/10 "2002-12-19T13:43:25Z")
Apparently I am missing something because there is nothing about this that gives me a “guilty conscience.” Zip. Zero. Nada. I would feel badly if I fibbed and it was somehow discovered that I tend to get tipsy on vacations and suck down marlboro lights. I would feel badly for _me and my husband,_ not the insurance company. My question is really still _how_ do they find out? ---
**Author:** ![Igloo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Igloo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Igloo)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/11 "2002-12-19T13:54:46Z")
**Cheesesteak** that’s part of the issue. They don’t ask, “are you a smoker?” They ask something to the effect of “Have you smoked in the last 12 months?” My husband answered this honestly and then was classified as a “smoker” which is bull…umm…inaccurate. ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/12 "2002-12-19T14:16:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Igloo \* > \*\*Apparently I am missing something because there is nothing about this that gives me a “guilty conscience.” Zip. Zero. Nada. > > I would feel badly if I fibbed and it was somehow discovered that I tend to get tipsy on vacations and suck down marlboro lights. I would feel badly for _me and my husband,_ not the insurance company. > > My question is really still _how_ do they find out? \*\* Hon, the SDMB isn’t here to help you perpetrate insurance fraud. Your asking us how to do so really tarnishes the Board’s reputation and credibility. No one who has read your posts has any doubts about your moral/ethical position or lack of a “guilty conscience.” The “fibs” you glibly speak of are actually felonies. If and when you’re caught, will you blame us? ---
**Author:** ![Igloo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Igloo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Igloo)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/13 "2002-12-19T14:25:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Country Squire \* > \*\*Hon, the SDMB isn’t here to help you perpetrate insurance fraud. Your asking us how to do so really tarnishes the Board’s reputation and credibility. > > No one who has read your posts has any doubts about your moral/ethical position or lack of a “guilty conscience.” The “fibs” you glibly speak of are actually felonies. If and when you’re caught, will you blame us? \*\* Oh, please. I in _no way_ am asking for “help” in committing insurance fraud. It’s a question that concerns Corporate America and its inability to pile us all into the “correct” slots. I would take more time to respond but I have to go be herded into my coral. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/14 "2002-12-19T15:24:59Z")
> [@](#): > > I have to go be herded into my coral. By tiny cowboys riding seahorses? Just a little joke, which no one will pay attention to because apparently I’m invisible in this thread again… To reiterate: **your answer depends on the phrasing of the question.** “Are you a smoker?” No. “Have you smoked tobacco in the last \_\_\_ months?” Yes. “How many cigarettes have you smoked in the last year?” 80. Did we as a nation learn _nothing_ from Bill Clinton’s deposition? ---
**Author:** ![Igloo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Igloo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Igloo)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/15 "2002-12-19T15:48:01Z")
**Otto** , thanks. After eating some hay in my coral, I realize that the advice I am receiving is to just _tell the truth._ I was getting caught up in the fact that telling the truth somehow doesn’t seem to be _interpreted_ as the truth, and was wondering how they could _know/find out_ the truth if it wasn’t really the truth. But I guess that’s relatively speaking and splitting hairs. Sometimes you just gotta deal with the fact that it’s black/white, not gray. I understand that the way the thread was going, it could look like I wanted to scam but that honestly was not my intention. Thanks for all the advice and I will say “80 cigarettes” when the question is posed. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/16 "2002-12-19T16:03:23Z")
Otto is definitely right on this one, it really does depend on how they phrase it. My insurance, IIRC, asks if I’m a ‘smoker’ or not, but doesn’t go into that type of detail. The right thing to do is answer as truthfully as possible, because they WILL nail your ass if you lie. Perhaps your answer will be to go to a different insurance carrier, one that isn’t quite as anal about the smoking question. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/17 "2002-12-19T16:11:08Z")
I have a friend who’s husband quit smoking for insurance purposes. He’s been doing Nicorette, which will still show up on a blood test, so I don’t know how they’re able to tell if he’s a smoker or a quitter. But they seem to think this is a bad thing. Like they take blood tests or something to determine if you’re a liar. If that’s the case, I’ll bet a couple cigarettes a month won’t show up, and therefore, wouldn’t be considered a “smoker”. ---
**Author:** ![SylverOne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c0e974/32.png) [@SylverOne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SylverOne)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/18 "2002-12-19T17:02:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Cheesesteak \* > \*\*Perhaps your answer will be to go to a different insurance carrier, one that isn’t quite as anal about the smoking question. \*\* With the amount of litigation going on with the tobacco companies, and the fight over who gets the monies won in those court cases, I can say, with a fair amount of certainty, that you will have trouble finding a carrier that won’t take your smoking, non-smoking status into consideration. Even the VA wants a medical/health histories on it’s applicants, even if they are assured health benefits. Igloo, I apologize for the term ‘guilty conscience.’ It wasn’t said with the intent to offend. Good luck still though… Syl ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/19 "2002-12-19T17:22:25Z")
It’s not necessarily that another company won’t care, so much as they may not use the same critera to designate someone as a smoker. My insurance co didn’t ask that specific a question, at least, not that I can recall. ---
**Author:** ![shelbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3d9bf3/32.png) [@shelbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shelbo)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666/20 "2002-12-19T17:50:00Z")
In my book, 4 packs a year makes you a smoker. Your husband, not really; you, yes. The question on my life insurance policy was, “have you ever used tobacco products?”. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-i-fib-to-the-health-insurance-police/143666.md?page=2)