# What happens if Trump wins in 2024? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [August 20, 2023, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811 "2023-08-20T01:13:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/41 "2023-09-01T21:04:15Z")
> [@velomont](#): > > > [@Loach](#): > > > > He’s totally inept and ineffective > > Sadly he wouldn’t have to be “ept” and effective to take the US out of NATO and, notwithstanding the rest of NATOs determination and strength, I still think that that would be catastrophic. > > And remember, his ineptitude and ineffectiveness resulted in half a million dying from a fairly easily preventable virus. > > > [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > > > there’s no telling how thoroughly his maladministration would crater the country. > > And this. How many died because of him is very much up for debate. I was in a hot zone. I was pulling bodies out of houses. But I’m in a blue state that followed all recommendations and rules. People were going to die whether he was in office or not. His administration also helped push through research on vaccines that he wants to take credit for. He’s been booed at his own rallies for that. The confusion he sowed made things worse and worse for the future no doubt. > [@velomont](#): > > > [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > > > appointing a slew of people as malevolent as he is > > This, and he didn’t fail to overturn the 2020 election through ineptness, he failed to overturn the 2020 election because of a few people who did the right thing at the right time. Your memory is turning him into a brilliant supervillain. Relying on people like the Proud Boys to storm the capitol and actually accomplish anything? The parade of absolutely ridiculous lawsuits? Four Seasons Landscaping? The fucking Pillow Guy? His attempt at overturning the election was because it was based on his narcissism. He found it inconceivable that he lost. He had no plan. He was hoping someone like Rudy would come up with something on the fly. If we had a smart evil person in the White House the outcome might have been different. He’s the worst president in history and can do a lot of damage but not because of evil plans. If he was capable of making plans it would be much worse. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/42 "2023-09-01T21:17:31Z")
> [@SuntanLotion](#): > > Handwriting analysis books say sharp lines are written by violent people. He’s also a Gemini which indicates a duality of his nature. Palmistry says that small hands are a sign of sadism. Without cutting that ridiculous hair, I can’t see the bumps on his head to make a judgement on phrenology. /s ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/43 "2023-09-01T21:40:27Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > There’s also the fact that he’d be appointing a slew of people as malevolent as he is, and no doubt at least some of them would be ept and effective enough to do major damage Yep, just google Project 2025. ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/44 "2023-09-01T22:12:29Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Your memory is turning him into a brilliant supervillain Ok, two things - I just invented “ept” so that should count for something 😁. But seriously, I don’t think that he and his ilk are some kind of brilliant supervillains, and I will stress that his COVID response did not take any grand effort on his part except for his own moronic and stupid outbursts. And everything he said (and possibly believed but I honestly don’t know) to overturn the election was not particularly smart. But if someone greedier, more power-hungry, or less ethical than Raffensperger or Pence had been in place, things could have been completely different, could they not? And seriously, correct me if I’m wrong here. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/45 "2023-09-01T22:21:07Z")
One thing that is likely to come up very soon, is can a president pardon himself. That alone, if it is allow to stand by SCOTUS (which while not completely a forgone conclusion, I wouldn’t bet against), would be a big nail in the coffin of US democracy. Also I’m sure he’s learned his lesson from last time, and won’t be satisfied with appointing anyone has any actual legal experience and the remotest bit of respect for the rule of law as attorney general, etc., no matter how much of a toady they are, the next Trump attorney general will have one qualification and one qualification alone: “Will you do what I say when I demand to have someone prosecuted (or charges dropped”) ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/46 "2023-09-01T22:34:37Z")
> [@velomont](#): > > > [@Loach](#): > > > > Your memory is turning him into a brilliant supervillain > > Ok, two things - I just invented “ept” so that should count for something 😁. > > But seriously, I don’t think that he and his ilk are some kind of brilliant supervillains, and I will stress that his COVID response did not take any grand effort on his part except for his own moronic and stupid outbursts. > > And everything he said (and possibly believed but I honestly don’t know) to overturn the election was not particularly smart. But if someone greedier, more power-hungry, or less ethical than Raffensperger or Pence had been in place, things could have been completely different, could they not? And seriously, correct me if I’m wrong here. I found this post to be very ept. ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/47 "2023-09-01T22:37:44Z")
And there are many times during which if all he did was STFU things might be much different now. ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/48 "2023-09-01T22:38:39Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > “Temporary” postponement of elections due to the wartime emergency. [Here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_United_States_military_operations) is a list of the wars America has fought so far. When was a war ever used to postpone or cancel a presidential election or elections to Congress or the Senate? I believe never (I may be wrong). Not denying that tanTrump would try, but what are the chances? > [@Dorjan](#): > > What would actually happen IMO is that we’d have our first Presidential assassination since 1963. Historically, we are overdue for another one. That too. I believe the Second Amendment cuts both ways, although the ones that shout out loudest do not seem to realize it. > [@velomont](#): > > Ok, two things - I just invented “ept” so that should count for something 😁. May I thow _inapt_ into the ring? Like in: tanTrump is inapt to be President of the United States. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2023, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/49 "2023-09-02T02:12:44Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > One thing that is likely to come up very soon, is can a president pardon himself. That alone, if it is allow to stand by SCOTUS (which while not completely a forgone conclusion, I wouldn’t bet against), would be a big nail in the coffin of US democracy. Sovereign immunity has pluses and minuses, but does not destroy democracy. If SCOTUS rules that a self-pardon ability only applies to federal charges, it hardly matters. If SCOTUS rules that state charges can also be self-pardoned (maybe due to the tremendous overlap, in today’s U.S., of state and federal illegalities) that is good for Trump, but also good for the next Democratic President, who red states will be desperate to indict on state charges. As for how hard it would be to convict a normal, even good, Democratic president of violating the law – not hard. There is a [federal law against violating the constitution](https://www.justice.gov/crt/deprivation-rights-under-color-law). And it is probably impossible to do the POTUS job, signing executive orders, without literal violation of the poorly worded tenth amendment ("powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States . . . "). Yes, federal law, federal constitution, but many states have similar laws and constitutions – and a similar GOP-controlled high court. I mildly prefer that a series of lock 'em ups not happen, and so will be pleased if the Supreme Court rules in favor of a broad self-pardon power. If it goes the other way, I’m not saying Trump going to prison – maybe the day he leaves office in 2029 – would be a disaster. But it won’t save democracy by a long shot. It just would mean a period of time during which being POTUS usually means a spell in minimum security, with the VP jumping in to continue the same policies. Eventually we would collectively realize that locking them up doesn’t do any good. Good government depends on who is elected, not who is convicted. ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2023, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/50 "2023-09-02T02:16:19Z")
If POTUS can pardon themselves for Federal crimes, could a Governor (or can they already) pardon themselves for State crimes? ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2023, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/51 "2023-09-02T02:26:17Z")
Depends on the respective state’s constitution, I would think. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2023, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/52 "2023-09-02T02:48:47Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > One thing that is likely to come up very soon, is can a president pardon himself. That alone, if it is allow to stand by SCOTUS (which while not completely a forgone conclusion, I wouldn’t bet against), would be a big nail in the coffin of US democracy. I think even if there was a law that specifically stated that a President could not under any circumstances pardon themselves, Trump would not care and would do it anyway. The long story short on this thread is that if Trump wins in 2024, there are no rules anymore. None. Electing Trump means that the United States as a country accepts everything Donald Trump did and everything he will do in the future. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2023, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/53 "2023-09-02T03:27:50Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > If POTUS can pardon themselves for Federal crimes, could a Governor (or can they already) pardon themselves for State crimes? My web search fails to find an instance of a state governor self-pardoning, although a territorial governor once tried it: [https://journals.lib.washington.edu/index.php/WHQ/article/view/8829/7864](https://journals.lib.washington.edu/index.php/WHQ/article/view/8829/7864) Normally, crooked state governors are only indicted on federal charges and/or after leaving office. So they may never have had a good opportunity to attempt a self-pardon. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/54 "2023-09-28T22:57:03Z")
Things get more confusing. > **[Opinion | Hail to the Fraudster in Chief](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/28/opinion/donald-trump-fraud-case.html)** > > But Trump supporters probably won’t admit they were fooled. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/55 "2023-09-29T02:59:44Z")
Would you be able to summarize for us non-subscribers? ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/56 "2023-09-29T03:13:17Z")
I’ll do better - [here’s a gift link](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/28/opinion/donald-trump-fraud-case.html?unlocked_article_code=k35RERObxYWGMofsPkuOjh6jzYy5XWD9GUZ1TSQMhPvrx59Adr43DYS-d3yUAKqD2F0do4aoIyWpGCI8cfBeQjnE0cIrqLbjzvNbjhjEZNt08zOxPk0LbCDlm4oVT26uYy-DU57mPo-77kONGvI3Q0w1iuVmXSd0wOJY1ccMvm7Rlkbz8I1DnuFNAQdvtJFrdBOvzstkobOd_fAAAC6klIE4tjNbohXzPx7ATvgE-xyU_FhKWJqxYaRbIgMzyiquF2z2jqZ1k9XawWE5bJsvRsEGaLW8AbcWKc_9pbcwqhAQt53wBFZNA29rKw2Y0l6wDTy-zuBnzRWA85A6GCcKsiA&smid=url-share) so you and everyone else can read it for yourselves. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/57 "2023-09-29T03:55:27Z")
Thank you: I did, and it was worth a read. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/58 "2023-09-29T04:01:44Z")
Definitely worth a read—thank you! ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/59 "2023-09-29T22:37:19Z")
Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![loriloolee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/5fc32e/32.png) [@loriloolee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/loriloolee)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-happens-if-trump-wins-in-2024/988811/60 "2023-09-30T00:46:03Z")
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