# What \[I\]would\[/I\] it take to disable a Nimitz class supercarrier? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 3, 2014, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453 "2014-02-03T21:17:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/61 "2014-02-05T04:25:04Z")
I once read about an entire DC-10 jumbo jet being dismantled all because someone stole a jar of concentrate garlic oil in his baggage and it ruptured. One gallon of garlic oil for a carrier then? Re: igniting the fuel stores. The Nimitz is nuclear-powered, I hope no one forgets that. As to the jet fuel and the crude oil refinery, I think a carrier’s fire fighting system is equipped enough to handle fires from those places. ---
**Author:** ![obbn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/d6d6ee/32.png) [@obbn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obbn)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/62 "2014-02-05T07:27:06Z")
> [@Tibby or Not Tibby](#): > > A 911-style airliner impact may do the trick. I’m sure a Nimitz class aircraft carrier is made of stronger stuff than the Twin Towers, but I believe enough damage would be sustained to dock the ship for repairs for at least 6 months, particularly if you knock the bridge and control tower into the ocean. And, it will cost you next to nothing, because you’re not going to buy your weapon, you’re going to high-jack it (well, **you** want to be safely on the ground while your recruited Jihadist Kamikaze-bomber does the wet work—just tell him it’s in the name of Allah and guarantee him lots of virgins in heaven). Best of all, there will be retaliation, but not against you…it’ll be against those damned Talibaners again. > > There may be a couple of kinks to work out with this plan: are commercial airliners permitted to fly over combat-ready carrier strike forces? Would an airliner have enough time to dive from normal flight altitude to evade detection and anti-aircraft measures? If so, perhaps the plan should be to have the airliner dive into the carrier at takeoff or landing, while the carrier group is close shore, near a commercial airport. Interesting idea. To make it work, you would need to make it a legitimate charter flight. Have the pilot issue a radio mayday and claim he has to make an emergency water landing. This he will attempt to do near the carrier group do they can assist in rescuing the survivors. This gives your a plausable story to get your aircraft near the carrier. Let down like you’re going to ditch, at the last moment you change course and ram the carrier near the water line with your large commercial aircraft. Make sure your aircraft is loaded to the holds with high explosives. If you try a suicide attack without the cover of an emergency, you’ll never get close enough to the carrier group before they shoot you down. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/63 "2014-02-05T07:37:46Z")
How 'bout this for cost efficiency and elegance: Only a few hours after the carrier left known port, or is at sea of known location, a commercial airliner flies above, along a well-traveled route. But SEALs parachute from it at night, guided by GPS and some other communication. What I know is SEALs land on water, inflate a motorized raft, and pursue the ship. But this is iffy for a 30+ knot carrier. Heck, they’ll land right on the flight deck. They’ll plant explosives where they can: parked planes, fuel and ordnance, elevators, detonate, and either jump ship or simply surrender. ---
**Author:** ![Reply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/reply/32/15952_2.png) [@Reply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reply)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/64 "2014-02-05T07:57:20Z")
> [@Tibby or Not Tibby](#): > > I’m going to stick with my airliner scenario because I think it is lowest cost, lowest risk and will get the job done, with a little tweaking. On reflection, having a high-jacked plane dive bomb into a carrier from normal flight altitude will give the carrier group enough time to scramble and vaporize the aircraft before impact (especially if they got word from traffic control that it’s a high-jacked plane headed their way). And, while a quick impact from a taking-off or landing plane may work, the idea of attacking the carrier in blue water is more fun and challenging. > > 5 years is enough time to train and place a few operatives in key airliner positions (e.g. chief mechanic, hanger security, etc.) at a well-located commercial airport hub. 5 years is also enough time to develop a state-of-the-art preprogrammed automatic pilot system (APS) that can be installed stealthily into an airliner before it takes off on a flight plan taking it near the carrier group. This rogue APS will not take the place of the plane’s installed auto-pilot (that would no doubt be easily detected by the pilots or traffic control). It will work in tandem with the plane’s APS and will only kick in a set number of miles before nearing the carrier group. The rogue APS will, at first, act only as a critical fault device (creating normal catastrophic failures causing the plane to lose altitude and putting it at risk of crash). The pilot will call mayday and plans will be made with traffic control for a water crash landing. > > I’m confident traffic control would quickly learn of the proximity of the carrier group and contact the Pentagon to say, “don’t shoot down that plane!” (If the public learned that the navy shot down a crashing airliner, mayday voice box conversation and all, there would be hell to pay). And very probably they would ask for the carrier group to head toward the plane for the pending rescue operation. They’d also tell the airline pilot to head toward the carrier group as best he can (not unlike a Trojan Horse scenario). > > As the airliner gets close to the carrier, at low altitude, that’s when the second phase of the rogue APS kicks in. It was preprogrammed with the carrier bridge/control tower as it’s visual target and it locks on. At the last couple of seconds, the plane banks hard toward the target and impacts before any counter measures can transpire. > > The only problem with this plan is that innocent American passengers must be sacrificed. So, I suggest we install the device in an Air France plane! > > \*I’m just kidding, some of my favorite pastry chefs are French. There are so many potential problems with this. Programming your rogue APS system and making sure nobody catches the back door. Installing it on the relevant planes of the right airlines. Finding the carrier group’s location and rerouting a civilian airliner with enough fuel there at the right time. Assuming that you won’t be escorted by fighters on your way to the ditching and won’t be blown out of the sky if you stray off-course and towards the carrier. Assuming that the carrier group will let you get anywhere near it instead of sending you to a predesignated patch of ocean away from itself, and then sending another ship or a bunch of helicopters to rescue you. Assuming the CIWS won’t shred you once you get close. Etc. Maybe if you put all that effort into embedding an actual rogue Navy pilot instead, he can kamikaze into the control tower during landing? ---
**Author:** ![bahimes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e36b37/32.png) [@bahimes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bahimes)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/65 "2014-02-05T08:15:24Z")
> [@gnoitall](#): > > That would be called a “laying a minefield.” It’s already doable with an existing system: > [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark\_60\_CAPTOR](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_60_CAPTOR) also from Wikikpedia: **Torpedo Mine** The torpedo mine is a self-propelled variety, able to lie in wait for a target and then pursue it e.g. the Mark 60 CAPTOR. Other designs such as the Mk 67 Submarine Launched Mobile Mine[36] (which is based on a Mark 37 torpedo) are capable of swimming as far as 10 miles through or into a channel, harbor, shallow water area and other zones which would normally be inaccessible to craft laying the device. After reaching the target area they sink to the sea bed and act like conventionally laid influence mines. Generally, torpedo mines incorporate computerised acoustic and magnetic fuzes. The U.S. Mark 24 “mine”, code-named FIDO, was actually an ASW homing torpedo. The mine designation was disinformation to conceal its function. 5 years to plot standard routes and waypints, lay the mines and wait for the Carrier Batlte Group to pass by. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/66 "2014-02-05T08:42:46Z")
> [@Habeed](#): > > That may be some James Bond tactics there…but given there are over 6000 people on the boat, this doesn’t sound impossible. If the infiltration team had well forged badges and uniforms…it doesn’t sound as impossible as one might assume. People see what they want to see. I would suspect that if your uniform looked legit, and you were “moving with a purpose” through the carrier, you just might make it to a critical system. Not if Steven Seagal was the cook. ---
**Author:** ![AndrewL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@AndrewL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AndrewL)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/67 "2014-02-05T14:51:14Z")
> [@Tibby or Not Tibby](#): > > The rogue APS will, at first, act only as a critical fault device (creating normal catastrophic failures causing the plane to lose altitude and putting it at risk of crash). At which point the pilot pulls the circuit breakers, killing power to the rogue autopilot, and then proceeds to land the plane manually. In an emergency the pilots can even kill all electrical power to the flight controls and land with nothing more than hydraulic power provided by the engines. There’s really no way to override the flight controls in a way that can’t be worked around, at least without massively altering the flight control system in a way that would be impossible to hide. ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/68 "2014-02-05T14:58:02Z")
> [@AndrewL](#): > > At which point the pilot pulls the circuit breakers, killing power to the rogue autopilot, and then proceeds to land the plane manually. **In an emergency the pilots can even kill all electrical power to the flight controls and land with nothing more than hydraulic power provided by the engines.** There’s really no way to override the flight controls in a way that can’t be worked around, at least without massively altering the flight control system in a way that would be impossible to hide. I would assume there’s a version of that statement which would be true of current-generation fly-by-wire airliners? ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/69 "2014-02-05T15:08:20Z")
> [@Ex\_Bubblehead](#): > > Uh, I know that. However, for this discussion, it’s not relevant 😉 > > (former STS here) 😕 STS? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/70 "2014-02-05T15:10:28Z")
Sonar technician, submarine. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/71 "2014-02-05T15:11:17Z")
> [@the\_diego](#): > > I once read about an entire DC-10 jumbo jet being dismantled all because someone stole a jar of concentrate garlic oil in his baggage and it ruptured. One gallon of garlic oil for a carrier then? > > … Cite? Sounds weird. ETA: thanks, **rnatb** , quick. ---
**Author:** ![Ex\_Bubblehead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ex_bubblehead/32/3397_2.png) [@Ex\_Bubblehead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ex_Bubblehead)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/72 "2014-02-05T15:16:24Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > 😕 STS? STS = SONAR Technician, Submarine. ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/73 "2014-02-06T05:55:35Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > I’m not convinced the US would nuke an entire country anyway if all they did was possibly use one underwater nuke to sink a carrier. Destroying a U.S. Carrier by any means would be an immediate act of war. Destroying any U.S. lives or infrastructure via nuclear means would be an excellent way to turn your entire country into a radioactive parking lot. (North Korea, Iran, I’m lookin’ at you both…) ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/74 "2014-02-06T06:20:06Z")
Build, buy, or refurbish a suitably [heavy mortar](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_heavy_mortars), get it into range of the carrier’s homeport, and hit the ship while it’s tied up at dock? Bonus in that you’d implicitly threaten all the _other_ carriers’ ports, at least as long as it would take to make a security check of everywhere in artillery range of the docks, without actually _having_ to move any weapons into the US or Japan. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/75 "2014-02-06T07:01:24Z")
^ Get a Davy Crocket launcher instead and come within 1.1 miles of that carrier while at anchor. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/76 "2014-02-06T14:41:34Z")
> [@Desert\_Dumpster](#): > > Some people are irony-proof. Yes, I didn’t get the irony, because irony is a device used to highlight the contrast of the literal meaning of something with the figurative meaning of that same thing. But I will admit that there was as much irony present in the “dropping a match in a fuel tank” statement as there is irony in situations such as: 1) a black fly in your Chardonnay; 2) rain on your wedding day; and 3) a free ride when you’ve already paid. I reject being irony-proof, but I can be difficult. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/77 "2014-02-06T15:40:28Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Yes, I didn’t get the irony, because irony is a device used to highlight the contrast of the literal meaning of something with the figurative meaning of that same thing. > > But I will admit that there was as much irony present in the “dropping a match in a fuel tank” statement as there is irony in situations such as: 1) a black fly in your Chardonnay; 2) rain on your wedding day; and 3) a free ride when you’ve already paid. > > I reject being irony-proof, but I can be difficult. These were almost all annoying lyrics, for an album I really like (mainly due to the producer). Only #3 is ironic. Isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Baffle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dec6dc/32.png) [@Baffle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baffle)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/78 "2014-02-07T14:53:42Z")
Writing a song called ‘ironic’ without a single example of irony – now that’s ironic. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/79 "2014-02-07T15:41:43Z")
> [@Tibby or Not Tibby](#): > > I’m going to stick with my airliner scenario because I think it is lowest cost, lowest risk and will get the job done, with a little tweaking. How do you make sure that your sabotaged airplane flies anywhere near the carrier group? ---
**Author:** ![buddy431](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@buddy431](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddy431)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453/80 "2014-02-07T17:56:05Z")
> [@Tibby or Not Tibby](#): > > A 911-style airliner impact may do the trick. I’m sure a Nimitz class aircraft carrier is made of stronger stuff than the Twin Towers, but I believe enough damage would be sustained to dock the ship for repairs for at least 6 months, particularly if you knock the bridge and control tower into the ocean. And, it will cost you next to nothing, because you’re not going to buy your weapon, you’re going to high-jack it (well, **you** want to be safely on the ground while your recruited Jihadist Kamikaze-bomber does the wet work—just tell him it’s in the name of Allah and guarantee him lots of virgins in heaven). Best of all, there will be retaliation, but not against you…it’ll be against those damned Talibaners again. > > There may be a couple of kinks to work out with this plan: are commercial airliners permitted to fly over combat-ready carrier strike forces? Would an airliner have enough time to dive from normal flight altitude to evade detection and anti-aircraft measures? If so, perhaps the plan should be to have the airliner dive into the carrier at takeoff or landing, while the carrier group is close shore, near a commercial airport. U.S. naval forces have shown they are perfectly willing to [shoot down civilian](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655) airliners that aren’t doing anything at all suspicious. You’ve got no chance. But seriously, anti ship missiles are the way to go. They’re cheap, easy to launch, and especially the more advanced ones, will get though often enough to make them viable. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-i-would-i-it-take-to-disable-a-nimitz-class-supercarrier/680453.md?page=5)