# What, if anything, is wrong with Starbucks' coffee? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** coffee\ **Created:** [December 1, 2004, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452 "2004-12-01T04:35:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![aaslatten](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f14d63/32.png) [@aaslatten](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aaslatten)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/61 "2004-12-03T00:25:50Z")
> [@Athena](#): > > An article in Smithsonian Magazine this summer on coffee growers included a quote from one person, saying “Starbucks is in the milk business, not the coffee business.” > > I agree with that sentiment, and it’s not only Starbucks. Far too many coffee shops make a crappy cup of coffee, preferring instead to make the frou-frou drinks that probably bring in more cash. That pretty much sums it up for me, along with the inflated prices, and I think that’s what the OP’s friend meant when he joked, “Don’t you like coffee?” Pretty who really like coffee (black coffee, or just the actual taste of coffee) generally prefer a hot cup of joe from the corner diner. I’ve found that Starbucks often doesn’t even have fresh regular coffee available (without having to brew it), because they’re so busy selling the speciality drinks. ---
**Author:** ![aaslatten](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f14d63/32.png) [@aaslatten](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aaslatten)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/62 "2004-12-03T00:29:56Z")
> [@aaslatten](#): > > That pretty much sums it up for me, along with the inflated prices, and I think that’s what the OP’s friend meant when he joked, “Don’t you like coffee?” Pretty who really like coffee (black coffee, or just the actual taste of coffee) generally prefer a hot cup of joe from the corner diner. I’ve found that Starbucks often doesn’t even have fresh regular coffee available (without having to brew it), because they’re so busy selling the speciality drinks. I meant to say, “People who really like coffee …” ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/63 "2004-12-03T00:30:50Z")
> [@Lamar Mundane](#): > > Whenever I hear someone say “Starbucks sucks”, I assume they are under 35 or so. They just don’t know what bad coffee is. You just reminded me of how, when I was in college in the '70s, I used to buy coffee from a vending machine that squirted the stuff into a paper cup, and also dispensed hot chocolate and chicken soup (through separate nozzles, thank Og). Now that was some…uh…adventurous coffee. ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/64 "2004-12-03T00:42:33Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > Starbucks always says they are using Arabica, so if they’re using robusta, you should get them on false advertising. Well, they could be using… both. When I go to any coffee shop in general, I usually go for the iced mocha with a shot of mint. Mmm, iced grasshopper… is that a standardized term for it? It’s what another coffeeshop in town calls it. Before tests, I’ll sometimes go get an iced “4 shots of espresso with a bit of cream”. I’m vibrating for the next 30 mins. ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/65 "2004-12-03T01:06:57Z")
> [@lightingtool](#): > > They were a bit more than “kind of snotty.” Here’s what happened the first (and last) time I went to a Starbucks. > > Me: Hi. Can I have a small coffee, please? > Other guy: One tall coffee. > Me: (Thinking “tall” must equal “big”) Uh, no, a small please. > Other guy: (smirk) Yeah, a tall coffee. > Me: Um, that’s that size, right? (pointing to the smallest cup). > Other guy: (exasperated sigh) When you’re in a Starbucks, that’s a tall, that one’s a grande, that one’s a ventricle, and that one’s a walla-walla-bing-bang. Try reading the menu. And here’s your _ **Tall** _ coffee. > Me: (Something about where he could stick that tall coffee) > > That was in Boston in 1999. Haven’t been into one since, so I can’t really comment on their coffee. In other words, you were being a dick and assuming that the vender was too stupid to understand the difference between small and large. I’d have given you an exasperated sigh and told you to read the huge menu that looms over the entryway and the counter, too, if you had treated me like that. > [@aaslatten](#): > > I’ve found that Starbucks often doesn’t even have fresh regular coffee available (without having to brew it), because they’re so busy selling the speciality drinks. Which Starbucks is this? And at what time? I’ve never been to a Starbucks that didn’t have plain coffee brewing right behind them - with the beans they are using that day written in colorful marker on a large white or blackboard right under the menu. > [@chaoticdonkey](#): > > Well, they could be using… both. Could be, but they’re advertising that they use 100% arabica. ---
**Author:** ![aaslatten](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f14d63/32.png) [@aaslatten](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aaslatten)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/66 "2004-12-03T01:42:58Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > Which Starbucks is this? And at what time? I’ve never been to a Starbucks that didn’t have plain coffee brewing right behind them - with the beans they are using that day written in colorful marker on a large white or blackboard right under the menu. Well, to be fair, this has usually happened to me in the Starbucks located in Barnes and Noble, which I understand are really just licensed vendors, not actual Starbucks. ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/67 "2004-12-03T02:08:12Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > Could be, but they’re advertising that they use 100% arabica. Ok… I didn’t research it, but the person I was quoting just said that starbucks claims that it “uses arabica beans”. Sorry bout that. ---
**Author:** ![look\_ninjas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b2d939/32.png) [@look\_ninjas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/look_ninjas)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/68 "2004-12-03T02:44:00Z")
> [@Lamar Mundane](#): > > Whenever I hear someone say “Starbucks sucks”, I assume they are under 35 or so. They just don’t know what bad coffee is. Hey, I’m 25, and I’ve had some bad coffee in my time. Unless Starbucks gets their beans from GFS, makes the coffee in a drip machine that’s cleaned approximately once a decade, and lets it sit on the burner for three hours before they’ll serve it to you, their coffee cannot be described as “bad.” It may not be great coffee, but it’s pretty far from bad. And those NesCafe machines they have at roadside rest stops (and in at least one hospital that I’ve been to) don’t serve coffee. I’m not sure what they’re serving, but it’s not coffee. In the interest of full disclosure, I have never been in a Starbucks. They simply haven’t come up here, for whatever reason. But I do buy their beans, because they’re better than Folgers and easier to come by than the cinnamon-flavored free trade organic stuff that is my favorite coffee of all time, and I like them just fine. It’s not the best coffee of all time, but it makes a decent cup, and that’s all I care about. ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/69 "2004-12-03T04:31:11Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > Actually, I’ve found that the farther away I am from Pike Place, the lower in quality it will be. Luckily, I live really, really close. > (Of course, this is a very, very small sample, and perhaps I’ve gotten really crappy baristas when I’ve been away from home.) > > Still, I like the coffee. Gee, I lived in Seattle in 1991-92. There was a pushcart on every corner and in every office building lobby selling Starbucks out of pump thermoses. It wasn’t bad, but proximity to Pike Street didn’t noticeably help. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/70 "2004-12-03T07:20:38Z")
THere’s a 12 mile stretch of Ventura Blvd that averages 1 Starbucks per mile. I’be been in plenty of Starbucks. I always get a cup of black coffee. And it’s always good. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 9:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/71 "2004-12-03T09:40:48Z")
Starbucks has: 1. Increased the overall quality of coffee available. 2. Educated the consumer about good (though maybe not _great_) coffee. 3. Muscled out a lot of the small local players who gave the coffeehouse its character and individuality. 4. Indulged in a growth frenzy that makes Topsy, kudzu, and the Australian rabbit population look like rank amateurs. Starbucks Event Horizon has been reached on fashionable Robson Street in Vancouver, BC. Here there are two Starbucks _directly kitty-corner from one another._ You can sit in one and watch the people in the other. (Maybe that’s the point…) :dubious: I like their coffee fine, but my all-time fave is Philip’s in NYC. ---
**Author:** ![SkeptiJess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@SkeptiJess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkeptiJess)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/72 "2004-12-03T12:18:16Z")
> [@](#): > > Some friends of my wife sort of ridiculed me the other day for saying I go to Starbucks’ pretty regularly. “Don’t you like coffee?” they jokingly asked, implying that one can only like Starbucks’ coffee if one doesn’t care about one’s coffee’s quality. My husband loves Starbucks – it’s his absolute favorite and he’s never has coffee from any other coffee house he likes better. He doesn’t drink frou-frou drinks, BTW, he takes his coffee with just a bit of half & half – about half a tablespoon per large cup. He likes his coffee strong and somewhat bitter, and Starbucks serves it just the way he likes it best. Personally, I’m not especially fond of coffee – and, when I _do_ drink it, I like it pretty mild. Even at home, the coffee I make to suit my husband is stronger than I like. If I’m going to drink coffee I usually brew myself a second pot after he leaves for work. And if we’re at Starbucks (or any other coffee shop that serves that strong, black stuff) I just drink tea. So, as I said, I’m no expert on coffee. I’m a lot closer to being an expert on etiquette and I’d like to say that people who ridicule your preference on _anything_ with the snippy disclaimer “Don’t you _like_ whatever-it-is” as if _they_ possess the real, true, skinny on the properties of whatever-it-is while _you_ are just a dumbass poser, hopelessly deluded and sucking at the corporate tit are pigs. Pretentious, obnoxious, elitist asshole-pigs. ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/73 "2004-12-03T12:45:57Z")
Starbucks has great ambiance, but it way overpriced for my proletariat pocketbook. Now, **Tim Horton’s** is mighty, mighty fine. Smooth coffee, excellent sandwiches. Reasonably priced for the commonwoman. But, the coffee I prefer is at my local **Shell Station**. 99cents for a cup of joe. And I can mix it with the hot chocolate mechanical dispenser and make a coffee mocha without the smug pricing. Comfort drink and caffeination for under a buck. What more could you ask for? ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/74 "2004-12-03T12:47:04Z")
I just wanted to welcome **Beware of Doug**. and give props to his user name. Great Far Side ref. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/75 "2004-12-03T13:07:51Z")
> [@Shirley Ujest](#): > > Starbucks has great ambiance, but it way overpriced for my proletariat pocketbook. I’m with you on the overpriced, but “ambiance”? Really? To me, it has about as much ambiance as a Mc Donalds. I’m a self-proclaimed coffee snob, and I have worked three years in a family-owned coffeeshop, but I do think Starbucks makes a decent product. I absolutely loathe their espresso drinks, but their drip coffee is perfectly decent. I’m not sure where these accusations of burnt and bitter come from, because my experience (and I drink my coffee black) is that while Starbucks puts out a strong brew (as it should be), it’s neither bitter nor burnt. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/76 "2004-12-03T14:09:18Z")
> [@Shirley Ujest](#): > > Now, **Tim Horton’s** is mighty, mighty fine. Smooth coffee, excellent sandwiches. Reasonably priced for the commonwoman. > > But, the coffee I prefer is at my local **Shell Station**. 99cents for a cup of joe. And I can mix it with the hot chocolate mechanical dispenser and make a coffee mocha without the smug pricing. Tim Horton’s. Well, it’s not _bad_ coffee; but I wouldn’t call it ‘mighty, mighty fine’. It’s okay. The doughnuts are just okay as well. Better than Krispy Kremes. (But that’s a pretty low standard.) Not as good as Winchell’s or Spudnuts. I like 7-11 coffee. It’s cheap, and they have flavoured creams you can put in. (I like the amaretto.) Good hot dogs, too. ---
**Author:** ![lightingtool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/57b2e6/32.png) [@lightingtool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lightingtool)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/77 "2004-12-03T17:30:23Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > In other words, you were being a dick and assuming that the vender was too stupid to understand the difference between small and large. I’d have given you an exasperated sigh and told you to read the huge menu that looms over the entryway and the counter, too, if you had treated me like that. How was I being a dick? Where did I assume the vendor “was too stupid?” I’m asking this in all seriousness. I thought he misunderstood me, (say it yourself: Small, Tall. See? They sound alike) so I was clarifying what size I wanted: > [@me](#): > > Me: Um, that’s that size, right? (pointing to the smallest cup). There was no need for him to jump on the snotty train and take off running. Granted, it’s hard to see the attitude I received from this guy when I write out the exchange, but he was being obnoxious. Your saying that I acted like a dick has really gotten under my skin for some reason. I don’t mean to hijack the thread, but I would like some clarification. ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/78 "2004-12-03T17:43:56Z")
Their espresso is too watery and not very ritch in flavour, as it is the basis of most of their coffee drinks it means most their drinks are lacking in taste. Unfortunately they aren’t cheap to compensate for this lack of quality espresso. Most small Itallian coffee shops arround here do much better espresso for a very similar price. ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/79 "2004-12-03T18:12:45Z")
> [@lightingtool](#): > > How was I being a dick? Where did I assume the vendor “was too stupid?” I’m asking this in all seriousness. I thought he misunderstood me, (say it yourself: Small, Tall. See? They sound alike) so I was clarifying what size I wanted:There was no need for him to jump on the snotty train and take off running. The first time, correct. You ask for a small, he calls back for a tall, you question whether a tall is the same as a small so far so good. He then says, that yes, a small is called a tall and then you resort to pointing out the item you want like he can’t speak English and you need to use sign language is what I generally consider a customer being a dick. > [@](#): > > Granted, it’s hard to see the attitude I received from this guy when I write out the exchange, but he was being obnoxious. Fair enough. He shouldn’t have been obnoxious. Keep in mind that this was in 1999, when every half-baked comedian looking for material with the whole “Why can’t they just call it a small? I always go in there and ask for a small, just to be a dick, then they try and correct me and then I yell at them” schtick. Wouldn’t surprise me if the guy had some wise-ass coming in every half hour to do his own variation on this in real life. Of course, you still shouldn’t get obnoxious with the customers. ---
**Author:** ![Phedre\_no\_Delaunay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/839c29/32.png) [@Phedre\_no\_Delaunay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phedre_no_Delaunay)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2004, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452/80 "2004-12-03T18:20:08Z")
I’m with the “over-roasted, burnt” people. Starbucks roasts their coffees to the point that varietal differences are burned away. If I want a cup of Java, it shouldn’t taste the same as a cup of Columbian. Deeply roasted coffee is great, but burnt coffee is nasty. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-anything-is-wrong-with-starbucks-coffee/277452.md?page=5)