# What If I am Actually right? \[movements of poles\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 4, 2011, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125 "2011-02-04T06:08:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/101 "2011-02-09T21:31:52Z")
And as to my second question – What say you? ---
**Author:** ![N8N8N8N](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@N8N8N8N](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N8N8N8N)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/102 "2011-02-09T21:50:29Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > Then what conclusion should I draw? And what can I reasonably do to stop the Earth’s crust from shifting about? The Climate is going to continue to change As Europe goes North and North America goes south. What can stop it? Nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/103 "2011-02-09T21:58:04Z")
> [@N8N8N8N](#): > > It can’t work both ways either there was an ice age or there was not no 1/2 ages permitted. Wrong. Some places get covered all year by glaciers, other places don’t. Africa wasn’t covered by glaciers during the ice age, was it? Or, to take a look at a current example, Greenland is covered by a permanent ice cap, yet northern parts of Canada, Alaska, Scandinavia, Iceland, and Siberia at the same latitude aren’t, and haven’t been for hundreds of years. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/104 "2011-02-09T22:11:28Z")
> [@N8N8N8N](#): > > No the movement has been increasing since 1914 not 40km a year since then total movement since then has been just under 400KM but the rate of movement has been doubling ever year. so next year 80km ect. if it does not accelerate at a faster pace. Which could very well happen. > > And just because you haven’t noticed it does no mean its not happening. Are you winetrs like here getting much milder? It’s not that I haven’t noticed the daylight changing. It’s that I’ve noticed that the daylight hasn’t changed. IT IS EXACTLY THE SAME. Exactly. 400 Kilometers of movement would put Fairbanks farther south than Anchorage. Here’s a yearly daylight chart for Anchorage: [http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/anchorage-alaska.html](http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/anchorage-alaska.html) Here’s the chart for Fairbanks: [http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/fairbanks-alaska.html](http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/fairbanks-alaska.html) And here’s the chart for Barrow: [http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/barrow-alaska.html](http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/barrow-alaska.html) Note that if Barrow had traveled south 400 kilometers, it could not possibly have the pattern of daylight given in the chart. Barrow is still 515 km north of the Arctic Circle, and has been since the first research station was established there by the Army in 1881. You may be familiar with Barrow because it was the setting for the movie “Thirty Days of Night”, where Vampires decide to move there because in the winter it has, well, thirty days of night. Note that this is only possible if Barrow is 500 km north of the Arctic Circle, and would not be physically possible if Barrow were actually only 100 km north of the Arctic Circle. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/105 "2011-02-09T22:34:11Z")
**N8N8N8N** , I’m neither a specialist in plate tectonics nor a geologist, but I suspect that if I were educated enough in either field to be one, I’d be even less inclined to take your hypothesis seriously than I already am. May I ask if you are an autodidact, or, if not, where your academic C.V. tends to be heaviest? P.S. **Lemur** , I bet those vampires got FAT! ---
**Author:** ![N8N8N8N](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@N8N8N8N](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N8N8N8N)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/106 "2011-02-09T22:59:14Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > It’s not that I haven’t noticed the daylight changing. It’s that I’ve noticed that the daylight hasn’t changed. IT IS EXACTLY THE SAME. Exactly. > > 400 Kilometers of movement would put Fairbanks farther south than Anchorage. > > Here’s a yearly daylight chart for Anchorage: [http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/anchorage-alaska.html](http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/anchorage-alaska.html) > > Here’s the chart for Fairbanks: [http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/fairbanks-alaska.html](http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/fairbanks-alaska.html) > > And here’s the chart for Barrow: [http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/barrow-alaska.html](http://www.gaisma.com/en/location/barrow-alaska.html) > > Note that if Barrow had traveled south 400 kilometers, it could not possibly have the pattern of daylight given in the chart. Barrow is still 515 km north of the Arctic Circle, and has been since the first research station was established there by the Army in 1881. You may be familiar with Barrow because it was the setting for the movie “Thirty Days of Night”, where Vampires decide to move there because in the winter it has, well, thirty days of night. Note that this is only possible if Barrow is 500 km north of the Arctic Circle, and would not be physically possible if Barrow were actually only 100 km north of the Arctic Circle. That informatio is not helpful its sunrises for different days of the year Pick one day and get the sunrises from 1940 until now. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/107 "2011-02-09T23:01:06Z")
On a hunch, I checked my mom’s blog. Here are her pictures of noon in Fairbanks on Dec 23rd this year. > **[Year's End and the Midday Sun](http://akelaine.blogspot.com/2010/12/years-end-and-midday-sun.html)** > > The last week in December in Fairbanks has the sun rising only a little above the horizon. The shot below shows the sun near its zenith on D... So, N8N8N8N8, are you gonna call my mom a liar? ---
**Author:** ![N8N8N8N](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@N8N8N8N](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N8N8N8N)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/108 "2011-02-09T23:03:41Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > **N8N8N8N** , I’m neither a specialist in plate tectonics nor a geologist, but I suspect that if I were educated enough in either field to be one, I’d be even less inclined to take your hypothesis seriously than I already am. > > May I ask if you are an autodidact, or, if not, where your academic C.V. tends to be heaviest? > > P.S. **Lemur** , I bet those vampires got FAT! autodidact first time I ever saw that word had to look it up. And yes I am one of those. I only have a grade four education. Although I took up space until grade nine I guess they didn’t want people in class with a beard 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![N8N8N8N](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@N8N8N8N](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N8N8N8N)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/109 "2011-02-09T23:06:30Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > On a hunch, I checked my mom’s blog. > > Here are her pictures of noon in Fairbanks on Dec 23rd this year. > > [Arctic View: Year's End and the Midday Sun](http://akelaine.blogspot.com/2010/12/years-end-and-midday-sun.html) > > So, N8N8N8N8, are you gonna call my mom a liar? Hey great pictures. But a picture of noon on one day does not help like I say times of sunrises on the same day from 1914 or as far back as you can get will show. Sunrises for everyday this year shows nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/110 "2011-02-09T23:08:44Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > What kind of a timeframe do you suppose we’re looking at? Doesn’t matter if you have enough Settlers to manage the pollution and change it all back to grassland. ---
**Author:** ![AshenLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/94ad74/32.png) [@AshenLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AshenLady)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/111 "2011-02-09T23:10:19Z")
Maybe you should submit your ideas to a journal and try to get it published so that your theory can be examined by a peer review. Maybe you could be the next Carl Sagan or something.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![N8N8N8N](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@N8N8N8N](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N8N8N8N)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/112 "2011-02-09T23:17:50Z")
> [@AshenLady](#): > > Maybe you should submit your ideas to a journal and try to get it published so that your theory can be examined by a peer review. > > Maybe you could be the next Carl Sagan or something.:rolleyes: Well I just had a thought and decided to put it out there and see what happened Not claiming to be right just asked what if? And if an idea can’t hold up to criticism its not a good idea. SO I put out my idea now I’m defending it and perhaps sombody has a better one. That would be the best scenario is getting my idea shot down by a better one not me defending a stupid idea just because I thought of it. But just an opinion is not a good reason to abandon it. A good critic is better than a follower any day. And as for Carl I like being me 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/113 "2011-02-09T23:21:01Z")
> [@AshenLady](#): > > Maybe you should submit your ideas to a journal and try to get it published so that your theory can be examined by a peer review. Where are they going to find _ **peers** _ for someone with his level of education, who are capable of refereeing an academic paper? ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/114 "2011-02-09T23:22:40Z")
> [@N8N8N8N](#): > > Hey great pictures. But a picture of noon on one day does not help like I say times of sunrises on the same day from 1914 or as far back as you can get will show. Sunrises for everyday this year shows nothing. But does it help you to realize that Fairbanks is currently 130 miles from the Arctic Circle? And do you realize that, if Fairbanks had traveled south 400 miles in the last hundred years, it would have been above the arctic circle when it was founded in 1901? And do you realize that Fairbanks was NOT above the arctic circle when it was founded in 1901? Because the good citizens of my home town would have noticed the midnight sun in midsummer, and the lack of sunrise in midwinter? And that, in fact, this has not changed in 100 years? And that if Fairbanks had drifted north or south it would have changed? I know that for you southerly types, the amount of sunlight you get doesn’t seem to change that much throughout the year, and it’s easy to not pay attention. Will you admit, that in a northern city like FAIRBANKS ALASKA people do, in actual fact, notice? Because on the solstice the sun is up for only three and a half hours? And when you get only three hours of daylight, you fucking notice? You didn’t realize that your theory was incompatible with the fact that northern localities haven’t changed their latitude. Now that you have learned this important fact, your theory must change to match the facts. Or instead, you could attempt to deny the facts. Except, the facts don’t change just because they don’t match your theory. It is a simple fact that anyone who has lived in a northern place near the arctic circle can see with his own eyes that you are wrong. So please take the time to digest this information. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/115 "2011-02-09T23:28:33Z")
If you are Actually right, then please have my mail forwarded to me c/o Gringott’s Bank. I’m off to Ollivander’s to obtain a wand. As for my future movements: check the newpapers. ---
**Author:** ![N8N8N8N](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@N8N8N8N](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N8N8N8N)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/116 "2011-02-09T23:29:48Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Where are they going to find _ **peers** _ for someone with his level of education, who are capable of refereeing an academic paper? I answer with honesty and you attack my education? Is it really relavant that I got out of school beofre my brain rotted and others stayed for the whole programming? ---
**Author:** ![N8N8N8N](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@N8N8N8N](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N8N8N8N)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/117 "2011-02-09T23:37:11Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > But does it help you to realize that Fairbanks is currently 130 miles from the Arctic Circle? And do you realize that, if Fairbanks had traveled south 400 miles in the last hundred years, it would have been above the arctic circle when it was founded in 1901? And do you realize that Fairbanks was NOT above the arctic circle when it was founded in 1901? Because the good citizens of my home town would have noticed the midnight sun in midsummer, and the lack of sunrise in midwinter? And that, in fact, this has not changed in 100 years? And that if Fairbanks had drifted north or south it would have changed? > > I know that for you southerly types, the amount of sunlight you get doesn’t seem to change that much throughout the year, and it’s easy to not pay attention. > > Will you admit, that in a northern city like FAIRBANKS ALASKA people do, in actual fact, notice? Because on the solstice the sun is up for only three and a half hours? And when you get only three hours of daylight, you fucking notice? > > You didn’t realize that your theory was incompatible with the fact that northern localities haven’t changed their latitude. Now that you have learned this important fact, your theory must change to match the facts. > > Or instead, you could attempt to deny the facts. Except, the facts don’t change just because they don’t match your theory. > > It is a simple fact that anyone who has lived in a northern place near the arctic circle can see with his own eyes that you are wrong. So please take the time to digest this information. Ahhhhhh thats the problem… The arctic circle and north pole are just imaginary lines on the globe for navagation purposes they are stationary points if the world flipped upside down they would reamain. If you were on say the 40th parrellel and the sun rose at 6am it should rise at 6am all aroung the 40th parralle (Anyody knowhow to spell that word?) but it will not. because the planet isspinning atound the magnetic axix not the true north axes. Stick a compass in magnetic north and draw a circle and check the times around that and they will probably match and if you had a grid and used the pole as the center you will have moved based on those degrees. But your right the true north never changes. But I was never talking about true north. ---
**Author:** ![N8N8N8N](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@N8N8N8N](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N8N8N8N)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/118 "2011-02-09T23:39:40Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > If you are Actually right, then please have my mail forwarded to me c/o Gringott’s Bank. I’m off to Ollivander’s to obtain a wand. As for my future movements: check the newpapers. Well I hope i’m wrong and counting on you of higher learning and knowledge to set my theory to rest but so far… (wand, me I would bring a shovel) ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/119 "2011-02-09T23:44:26Z")
> [@N8N8N8N](#): > > I answer with honesty and you attack my education? Is it really relavant that I got out of school beofre my brain rotted and others stayed for the whole programming? Oh, dear Lord. :headdesk: It’s probably relevant to the fact that you appear to be making up the field of geology as you go along, and by this point it looks like your payoff is that it gives you a way to declare the AGW issue to be unworthy of anyone’s attention, much less worthy of being considered a public policy topic. Listen: Thank you for your candor. I appreciate that I can now save myself the trouble of opening the thread again. ---
**Author:** ![N8N8N8N](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@N8N8N8N](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N8N8N8N)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125/120 "2011-02-09T23:59:11Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Oh, dear Lord. :headdesk: > > It’s probably relevant to the fact that you appear to be making up the field of geology as you go along, and by this point it looks like your payoff is that it gives you a way to declare the AGW issue to be unworthy of anyone’s attention, much less worthy of being considered a public policy topic. > > Listen: Thank you for your candor. I appreciate that I can now save myself the trouble of opening the thread again. Ahhh Perhaps if I had lied and told you I was the Head Professor of Plate techtonics at Oxford you would hang off my every word as if I were the pope maybe? Not even next time would I. You should have been so lucky to get out of the programming I have the benefit of my own thought not being filled with the thoughts of others. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-am-actually-right-movements-of-poles/570125.md?page=7)