# What if \[I\]nobody\[/I\] had any privacy. Could society function? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 26, 2015, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826 "2015-10-26T23:02:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2015, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/1 "2015-10-26T23:02:53Z")
Hypothetically, in some future world, cameras and sound record equipment exists everywhere. At every moment of your life, from birth to death, there’s a camera and a microphone somewhere. Anybody else can access the cameras at any time - if you’re law enforcement, there’s a 6 month delay but then someone can access the recording. So yeah, people could see you in the bathroom and the bedroom and picking your nose at work. But, anyone who points out that you eat your boogers or take noisy shits is at risk of having \*their \*bathroom and bedroom and nose picking records looked at… ---
**Author:** ![WF\_Tomba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d9b06d/32.png) [@WF\_Tomba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WF_Tomba)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2015, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/2 "2015-10-26T23:09:45Z")
Why the exception for law enforcement? I’m not even sure police would be needed in this world, as there would be very little crime. Certain people would excel at looking and sounding perfect all the time, even while sleeping or on the john. These people would lord it over everyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2015, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/3 "2015-10-26T23:13:11Z")
> [@Habeed](#): > > Hypothetically, in some future world, cameras and sound record equipment exists everywhere. At every moment of your life, from birth to death, there’s a camera and a microphone somewhere. Anybody else can access the cameras at any time - if you’re law enforcement, there’s a 6 month delay but then someone can access the recording. > > So yeah, people could see you in the bathroom and the bedroom and picking your nose at work. But, anyone who points out that you eat your boogers or take noisy shits is at risk of having \*their \*bathroom and bedroom and nose picking records looked at… See Damon Knight’s “I See You” or Baxter and Clarke’s “The Light Of Other Days” - or this article [SFE: Time Viewer](http://www.sf-encyclopedia.com/entry/time_viewer) ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2015, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/4 "2015-10-26T23:26:10Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Baxter and Clarke’s “The Light Of Other Days” FANTASTIC book. A beautiful example of imagining one new piece of technology and then following the consequences through to their logical end. ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2015, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/5 "2015-10-26T23:48:21Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > See Damon Knight’s “I See You” or Baxter and Clarke’s “The Light Of Other Days” - or this article [SFE: Time Viewer](http://www.sf-encyclopedia.com/entry/time_viewer) And Asimov’s _The Dead Past._ ---
**Author:** ![dracoi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@dracoi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dracoi)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2015, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/6 "2015-10-26T23:59:18Z")
I see no reason society can’t function without privacy. We’d simply adapt culturally to that. Half of our cultural ideas about privacy only arose after we invented technology to make privacy possible. You think cave kids were harmed by seeing their parents naked? We had to invent clothes before we could invent the arbitrary idea that nakedness is harmful or undesirable. Any kind of privacy you can think of… take it away and we’d have about three weeks of giggling and awkwardness and within two months we’d wonder why we ever thought it mattered. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/7 "2015-10-27T00:15:36Z")
> [@dracoi](#): > > I see no reason society can’t function without privacy. We’d simply adapt culturally to that. . . . Agreed. After a while, we’d develop the social illusion of privacy. We’d just look the other way, and hold people in scorn who don’t. We do this already, in many ways. If we’re all out camping, and someone takes a pee against a tree…we look away. The privacy doesn’t really exist, but we allow it to exist by custom. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/8 "2015-10-27T00:20:10Z")
I think “privacy” is a construct of primitive minds. Not that I’m above that construct mind you. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/9 "2015-10-27T00:26:32Z")
> [@dracoi](#): > > I see no reason society can’t function without privacy. We’d simply adapt culturally to that. > > Half of our cultural ideas about privacy only arose after we invented technology to make privacy possible. You think cave kids were harmed by seeing their parents naked? We had to invent clothes before we could invent the arbitrary idea that nakedness is harmful or undesirable. > > Any kind of privacy you can think of… take it away and we’d have about three weeks of giggling and awkwardness and within two months we’d wonder why we ever thought it mattered. Yea, I think Privacy is actually a pretty recent development. Most people used to live in small rural villages with more or less the same group of people their entire lives, with little to do in their free time but gossip and very little unshared indoor space. Everyone knew everyones elses crap, from their birth on, and if someone new came along and wanted to know about you, they could just ask your neighbours. Even in urban settings, people often separated into relatively small and static neighbourhoods or social groups within larger cities. Of course, people still had secrets, but there’s a difference between secrets (a specific fact that you want to stay concealed) and privacy (large parts of your life are by default unknown to other people, and difficult for them to find out). Obviously the two are related, more privacy makes keeping secrets easier, but they aren’t the same thing. I think the idea that you can and should exist more or less anonymously to anyone beyond your immediate friends and family, and even have those groups segregated into different parts of your life is a very recent innovation, spurred by a mixture of social and technological innovations. And I suspect that with advancing technology, it’ll be one that won’t last long (albeit, not quite to the extent invisioned by the OP). The last few generations maybe a relatively novelty in having such an idea of privacy as an obtainable or desirable goal. I don’t think people in the past or future will agree. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/10 "2015-10-27T00:31:11Z")
> [@](#): > > What if _nobody_ had any privacy. Could society function > > > [@](#): > > My sex life with my wife would be a whole lot less interesting (based on her attitudes, not mine). ---
**Author:** ![Arrendajo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Arrendajo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arrendajo)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/11 "2015-10-27T01:08:41Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > My sex life with my wife would be a whole lot less interesting (based on her attitudes, not mine). What is it you’re doing that you don’t want to share with the rest of us? ---
**Author:** ![PatriotGrrrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9dc877/32.png) [@PatriotGrrrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotGrrrl)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/12 "2015-10-27T01:13:04Z")
Must be nice to be so very… normal… that sex and excretion are the only things you could ever imagine wanting privacy for. And even then… may I watch the recording that shows you typing in your bank password? ---
**Author:** ![DorkVader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/73ab20/32.png) [@DorkVader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DorkVader)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/13 "2015-10-27T01:18:40Z")
Yeah, if that is the only level of non-privacy, big whoop. If there were some other technology that broadcast your thoughts somehow, I think that’s where things would get tricky ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/14 "2015-10-27T01:50:43Z")
> [@PatriotGrrrl](#): > > Must be nice to be so very… normal… that sex and excretion are the only things you could ever imagine wanting privacy for. > > And even then… may I watch the recording that shows you typing in your bank password? There would be no need for passwords. When you access a computer terminal for any reasons, the same monitoring system that runs the cameras that tracks everyone just knows it’s you. Since _everyone_ is being watched all the time, there’s no way for a criminal to access your stuff. Not to mention that if a criminal does do this, you can just find them on camera and catch em almost instantly. Financial transactions would be prohibited to individuals not inside the surveillance network, and if you leave the network by visiting a country that doesn’t have one, you do get a password or something. ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/15 "2015-10-27T01:52:14Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > My sex life with my wife would be a whole lot less interesting (based on her attitudes, not mine). Please don’t take this the wrong way, but if your wife knows how to do something totally amazing, surely other women could learn from her technique? ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/16 "2015-10-27T13:02:11Z")
> [@beowulff](#): > > And Asimov’s _The Dead Past._ I left that one out, because the story ends before society has to deal with lack of privacy. Barry Malzberg did write a sequel to the Dead Past, though - it’s called “The Present Eternal”. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/17 "2015-10-27T15:26:50Z")
Sooner or later privacy would be reinvented, maybe not so much on the part of people trying to keep part of their lives private, but more on the part of people getting fed up with having too much information about everyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/18 "2015-10-27T16:20:37Z")
What about George Orwell’s _1984_? And Ira Levin’s homage to it _This Perfect Day_? ---
**Author:** ![dracoi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@dracoi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dracoi)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/19 "2015-10-27T16:43:37Z")
> [@PatriotGrrrl](#): > > Must be nice to be so very… normal… that sex and excretion are the only things you could ever imagine wanting privacy for. > > And even then… may I watch the recording that shows you typing in your bank password? See, this is what I’m getting at. At first we’re like “No passwords?! How do we function!” And then you realize: if there’s no privacy and everyone knows everything, then no one could ever take your money because everyone else would know. You might as well go into the bank and just leave your money on the counter - as long as someone is watching, it’s safe. It might take us a few weeks to figure that out if it was suddenly implemented tomorrow. Some dim-witted types would try to steal things and then get caught. After two months, we’d be arguing that privacy and passwords are such dangerous things, because only in the absence of information is theft even possible. ---
**Author:** ![stillownedbysetters](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@stillownedbysetters](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stillownedbysetters)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2015, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826/20 "2015-10-27T16:57:37Z")
We’ve already come close to this situation in many of the overpopulated countries where several generations are living in the same home and sharing bedrooms. They have learned to cope under these circumstances, I’m sure the rest of us could do so as well. Those of us who’ve known personal privacy might find it a tough transition to make, but the generations that followed us would take it for granted that it had always been that way. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-i-nobody-i-had-any-privacy-could-society-function/735826.md?page=2)