# What IF Noah's Ark was found? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 13, 2000, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821 "2000-03-13T19:14:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![pashley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pashley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pashley)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/101 "2000-03-14T21:45:00Z")
Esprix: > [@](#): > > that your original intent was just to try to get people to admit that the Bible might be true in some way… I kinda thought this was a discussion board…and yes, when people argue a case, they usually try to persuade people to see their point of view. I guess I’m not allowed to do this? * * * Patrick Ashley “For those who believe, no evidence is necessary; for those who don’t believe, no evidence is enough.” -Unknown ---
**Author:** ![GLWasteful](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f05b48/32.png) [@GLWasteful](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GLWasteful)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/102 "2000-03-14T21:47:00Z")
Patrick: > [@](#): > > Can’t a guy come in here that believes in God, and not get slaughtered? Sure, happens all the time. As I pointed out to you once before, Tom, of tomndebb is Catholic. I’ve yet to see anyone give him too much crap because of it. Polycarp (who I’ve not seen about lately, where in hell is he?) is some Protestant denomination or another, and his posts are treated as things worthy of reading. Lots of other folk, too. Now, contrast that with you, and all that has come from you. Are you capable of seeing the difference there, Pat? Waste Flick Lives! ---
**Author:** ![Nen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Nen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nen)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/103 "2000-03-14T21:49:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by pashley: > \*\* Where did I ever start saying “Repent ye sinners?” I am not the witnessing type. I stand up for my faith, but I don’t say “Convert you heathen!”\*\* You never did directly state that people should convert or repent; however, you did insinuate that people should do _something_ when you asked: > [@](#): > > **How would you anti-religious zealots deal with this?** I think that some responded to this inquiry in the same heated manner in which it was offered. Those who did not stated precisely how it would effect them. ---
**Author:** ![pashley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pashley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pashley)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/104 "2000-03-14T21:51:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by Nen: > \*\* I think that some responded to this inquiry in the same heated manner in which it was offered. Those who did not stated precisely how it would effect them.\*\* Nen, I apologized for that, a long time ago. If I don’t like being attacked, I should not attack either. * * * Patrick Ashley “For those who believe, no evidence is necessary; for those who don’t believe, no evidence is enough.” -Unknown ---
**Author:** ![Nen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Nen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nen)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/105 "2000-03-14T21:51:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by GLWasteful: > **Polycarp (who I’ve not seen about lately, where in hell is he?)** Check the MPSIMS thread about Polycarp. He can’t come out to play right now. ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/106 "2000-03-14T21:53:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by pashley: > > Can’t a guy come in here that believes in God, and not get slaughtered? Yes, but not when he calls people idiots, ignores direct questions, and yells “anti-religion” at every turn. > [@](#): > > Now, I am a “troll”, because I ask a question that provokes discussion? What about: “What if the pope went crazy?” “Blacks Killing Whites is NOT a hate crime?” These are trolling issues too? Perhaps they are, but I’m not reading those threads. Maybe those posters got a thorough thrashing if their intent was to troll, or maybe the threads went off onto intelligent discourse - I can’t say. I’m only talking about this thread, and what you’ve already outright admitted. Furthermore, I notice you’ve obviously been reading this entire thread, but **still** have ignored many, many questions posed to you - you pick and choose which posts to answer based on which ones will give you the best opportunity to cry foul, generalize, berate and whine. C’mon, patrick - I know you’re capable of better. Esprix * * * [Ask the Gay Guy!](http://boards.straightdope.com/ubb/Forum7/HTML/001376.html) ---
**Author:** ![Nen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Nen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nen)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/107 "2000-03-14T21:54:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by pashley: > \*\* Nen, I apologized for that, a long time ago. If I don’t like being attacked, I should not attack either.\*\* I realize that you did apologize (and thank you), but I think that some still erringly felt your intention was conversion. ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/108 "2000-03-14T21:57:00Z")
Nen has a very valid point, pashley - your very first post started off with the **premise** that anyone who responded contrary to your belief on the subject was an “anti-religious zealot.” Then, when people responded to this insult with sarcasm and snide remarks, you compounded it in your second post by calling people “idiots.” How can you really expect to have a “discussion” when this is all set up from the get-go? Let’s put it this way, pash - if I opened a thread and said, “IF the Pope came out of the closet as a homosexual, what would that do to Catholics? Now let’s see how you homophobic bigots respond to that!” what kind of response do you think I would have gotten? Esprix * * * [Ask the Gay Guy!](http://boards.straightdope.com/ubb/Forum7/HTML/001376.html) ---
**Author:** ![pashley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pashley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pashley)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/109 "2000-03-14T22:02:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by Nen: > \*\* I realize that you did apologize (and thank you), but I think that some still erringly felt your intention was conversion.\*\* Nen, If anything, this board has taught me what my signature quote states. Look, I don’t hate you guys, none of you. I get angry and frustrated with you, but I try not to hold hate in my heart. If you guys don’t want to hear about God, that’s fine. That’s your choice, I’m cool with that. Can I ask that I not be treated with a condescending, mean-spirited tone if I say anything regarding God? I want to discuss, not argue. Yes, I have gotten angry, and made some regrettable posts lashing out at people **I felt** were disrespecting me. I have seen the postings of other religious folks on here, and some have been treated like me, some have been treated much better. I am willing to watch my tone, which may come across as “preachy” or “evangelical”, but expect in return that others will show a little more tact in there replies/retorts as well. ## Deal? EVERYONE WEIGH IN Patrick Ashley “For those who believe, no evidence is necessary; for those who don’t believe, no evidence is enough.” -Unknown ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/110 "2000-03-14T22:08:00Z")
That’s just it - this whole thread was a set-up by you. You posted a ‘have you stop beating your wife’ type of question to ‘prove’ that we wouldn’t accept evidence. You had absolutely no intention of actually debating the question as stated, but were simply trying to provoke the kinds of responses that would validate your personal opinion of ‘non-believers’. A lot of people saw through that, and treated the message with contempt. Some of us actually tried to engage the question, and were ignored by you. ---
**Author:** ![Nen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Nen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nen)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/111 "2000-03-14T22:09:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by pashley: > If you guys don’t want to hear about God, that’s fine. That’s your choice, I’m cool with that.\*\* I don’t have (nor do most people here, I’m guessing) a problem with discussing god. I think that the problem lies with using faith as evidence to support arguements you have offered to those who demand rational premises and conclusion. Talk about god all you want; it’s a favorite topic of mine. ---
**Author:** ![GLWasteful](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f05b48/32.png) [@GLWasteful](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GLWasteful)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/112 "2000-03-14T22:18:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Can I ask that I not be treated with a condescending, mean-spirited tone if I say anything regarding God? You weren’t. You were treated condescendingly when you created a thread that treated others the same way. Can you see the difference? > [@](#): > > I want to discuss, not argue. Then you’ve got a hell of a way of showing it. > [@](#): > > I have seen the postings of other religious folks on here, and some have been treated like me, some have been treated much better. And are you able to see the difference in posting style between you (and those of your ilk), and those who are treated much better? If not, then there’s not a whole hell of a lot else to say. Waste Flick Lives! ---
**Author:** ![pashley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pashley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pashley)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/113 "2000-03-14T22:25:00Z")
[quote] Originally posted by GLWasteful: \*\* > [@](#): > > Can I ask that I not be treated with a condescending, mean-spirited tone if I say anything regarding God? You weren’t. You were treated condescendingly when you created a thread that treated others the same way. Can you see the difference? Yes, I believe I was, and yes, I offering to be more sensitive, can YOU be? > [@](#): > > I want to discuss, not argue. Then you’ve got a hell of a way of showing it. Here I am, offering a handshake, and you throw it back at me, thanks. > [@](#): > > I have seen the postings of other religious folks on here, and some have been treated like me, some have been treated much better. And are you able to see the difference in posting style between you (and those of your ilk), and those who are treated much better? If not, then there’s not a whole hell of a lot else to say. “And those of my ilk”. Thanks again. ## Again, I will offer out my hand, even to you. Do you want to take it, or do you want to wallow in hate? Patrick Ashley “For those who believe, no evidence is necessary; for those who don’t believe, no evidence is enough.” -Unknown ---
**Author:** ![pashley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pashley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pashley)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/114 "2000-03-14T22:27:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by Sam Stone: > \*\*That’s just it - this whole thread was a set-up by you. You posted a ‘have you stop beating your wife’ type of question to ‘prove’ that we wouldn’t accept evidence. You had absolutely no intention of actually debating the question as stated, but were simply trying to provoke the kinds of responses that would validate your personal opinion of ‘non-believers’. A lot of people saw through that, and treated the message with contempt. Some of us actually tried to engage the question, and were ignored by you. > > \*\* Do you have anything to say about the “What if the Pope went insane” thread? Is that provoking as well? ## Again, my handshake out to you as well… Patrick Ashley “For those who believe, no evidence is necessary; for those who don’t believe, no evidence is enough.” -Unknown ---
**Author:** ![hardcore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@hardcore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hardcore)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/115 "2000-03-14T22:34:00Z")
pashley, I’ll bet that if your current humbleness is reflected in your future postings, you will find that most posters here will give back what they receive. There may be a residual effect for a short time, but this too shall pass. That said, I should think you would rather the flood myth were NOT true. Otherwise, you would need to explain why you worship a diety that felt the need to murder innocent animals and young children. ---
**Author:** ![pashley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pashley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pashley)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/116 "2000-03-14T22:54:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by hardcore: > \*\*pashley, I’ll bet that if your current humbleness is reflected in your future postings, you will find that most posters here will give back what they receive. There may be a residual effect for a short time, but this too shall pass. > > That said, I should think you would rather the flood myth were NOT true. Otherwise, you would need to explain why you worship a diety that felt the need to murder innocent animals and young children.\*\* Hardcore, my hand out to you as well. Regarding the flood myth, God felt that the Earth was full of sinning folks and destroyed them. The sins of the father often visit the children, regrettably. Hardcore, are you angry against God, and do you accept my handshake? * * * Patrick Ashley “For those who believe, no evidence is necessary; for those who don’t believe, no evidence is enough.” -Unknown ---
**Author:** ![hardcore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@hardcore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hardcore)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/117 "2000-03-14T23:05:00Z")
You have no need to offer me your hand – I harbor you no ill will. And I can feel no anger toward a nonexistent being. But certainly you cannot reasonably hold that an omnipotent being would need to murder innocent children in order to punish their fathers? If I did that, I most certainly would receive the death penalty. And the animals committed no sin that required retribution, don’t you think? ---
**Author:** ![pashley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pashley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pashley)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/118 "2000-03-14T23:12:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by hardcore: > \*\*You have no need to offer me your hand – I harbor you no ill will. And I can feel no anger toward a nonexistent being. > > But certainly you cannot reasonably hold that an omnipotent being would need to murder innocent children in order to punish their fathers? If I did that, I most certainly would receive the death penalty. And the animals committed no sin that required retribution, don’t you think?\*\* Hardcore, I don’t have an explanation for that. How’s that for humility and honesty. You may say this is trite, but his ways are not our ways. I am guessing there was a greater good to be had. I don’t have the answer, but that doesn’t mean there is not one. If you would grant, for a moment, the existence of God, can we also allow that this being, of infinite power and knowledge, may have ways we do not understand? ## (he says, in his new, non-preachy, easy-going tone) 🙂 Patrick Ashley “For those who believe, no evidence is necessary; for those who don’t believe, no evidence is enough.” -Unknown ---
**Author:** ![GLWasteful](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f05b48/32.png) [@GLWasteful](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GLWasteful)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/119 "2000-03-14T23:13:00Z")
Pat: > [@](#): > > I offering to be more sensitive, can YOU be? Me? Personally? No. I’m a bastard, but a surprisingly open-minded one. Just don’t use bullshit reasoning inre something with which I am familiar, and I’ll do a pretty good job of leaving you alone. > [@](#): > > Here I am, offering a handshake, and you throw it back at me, thanks. Just proud to be part of the team! > [@](#): > > Again, I will offer out my hand, even to you. To use a term with which you seem familiar, Thanks. > [@](#): > > Do you want to take it, or do you want to wallow in hate? Hate? Me? Patrick, I don’t hate you. I don’t even know you, ferchrissakes. Look, Pat, in the time you’ve been here, you have made an ass of yourself on this, as well as other, threads. I’ve seen too many people come in here who have done the same. If you want me to accept you, then you need to act like an adult. Accept that there are folk out there who will always disagree with you. And some of them will do so blisteringly. And that just because you think that you have a new angle on a question, doesn’t mean that you do. If you have something to say, please say it. If you are disagreed with, then don’t piss and moan that you are being persecuted. You’re simply being disagreed with. Waste Flick Lives! ---
**Author:** ![pashley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pashley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pashley)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2000, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821/120 "2000-03-14T23:20:00Z")
Look, Pat, in the time you’ve been here, you have made an ass of yourself on this, as well as other, threads. I’ve seen too many people come in here who have done the same. If you want me to accept you, then you need to act like an adult. Accept that there are folk out there who will always disagree with you. And some of them will do so blisteringly. And that just because you think that you have a new angle on a question, doesn’t mean that you do. If you have something to say, please say it. If you are disagreed with, then don’t piss and moan that you are being persecuted. You’re simply being disagreed with. I’m not one to “piss and moan” when it comes to a spirited debate. ## I’m asking that people don’t say i’m irrational or delustional because i bring God into the debate. Is that do-able? Patrick Ashley “For those who believe, no evidence is necessary; for those who don’t believe, no evidence is enough.” -Unknown [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-if-noahs-ark-was-found/17821.md?page=7)