Hey there is a poem about this very subject.
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I suspect if we had abandoned poetry way back when then literature would not be far behind. Your arguements against poetry could be applied to some of our most cherished books as well. Ultimately you’ll wind up with a society that can only read and write technical manuals.
I’m not saying poetry is “magical” I’m just saying that there are benefits to studying it in school.
Marc
I can’t imagine a better way to understand grammar than to read the works of those who made the best use of the English language. A student who reads will come to an understanding of grammar even if they are never taught the terms to vocalize the rules they are following.
Some of the teaching of literature is unnecessarily tedious in the American high school, but that doesn’t change the necessity of reading to develop an understanding of English. More teaching of pure grammar would have bored me to death. A basic understanding of grammar followed by an examination of how those rules are used and broken in much more enriching.
As to the subject of poetry, I quite enjoyed reading the better poets. I still find John Donne to be a revelation. I, however, dreaded the writing of poetry. All poetry written by a high schooler is bad. My only gift was the knowledge of just how bad my poetry was. Forced readings of poetry in class was one of the more painful experiences I can remember from my youth.
That’s an interesting theory, but all that required reading sure didn’t seem to help any of my classmates. Perhaps because Watership Down and A Separate Peace are nowhere near “the best use of the English language”.
I can think of no better reason than the following poem to keep poetry in the schools. And not only keep it there, but spend more time on it.
The Snowman
One must have a mind of winter
To regard the frost and the boughs
Of the pine-trees crusted with snow;
And have been cold a long time
To behold the junipers shagged with ice,
The spruces rough in the distant glitter
Of the January sun; and not to think
Of any misery in the sound of the wind,
In the sound of a few leaves,
Which is the sound of the land
Full of the same wind
That is blowing in the same bare place
For the listener, who listens in the snow,
And, nothing himself, beholds
Nothing that is not there and the nothing that is.
— Wallace Stevens
Has it occurred to you that perhaps the reason you’ve had to wade through ‘versified drivel’ is that there is not enough time spent on poetry in schools? That the failure to develop and encourage critical perception (by which I mean the ability to tell the difference between good, mediocre and bad writing) in the minds of students by not making poetry accessible and enjoyable shows clearly in what is produced by many who go on to try writing poems?
I’d rather schools stopped teaching grammar and devoted that time to poetry and other literature. As fruitbat has already pointed out, reading is the best way to learn how to write. And reading fine writing is the best way to learn how to write well.
As for poetry being “meaningful” … well, it’s meaningful in the same way a flat black harbour spiked with city lights is, or a mirror is, the same way a crow is against an evening sky, the same way ‘The spruces rough in the distant glitter’ are meaningful. The meaning is in the viewer. The poem is a catalyst and a frame for that meaning.
While I agree with you that studying literature does show grammar in action, I disagree strongly with this sentence. Some kids, very bright kids with a facility for language, will pick it up as if by osmosis. Most kids won’t. They need to be taught.
Combining the actual teaching of grammar, worksheets and all, with exposure to literature.
Some of the opponents of poetry in school simply dislike poetry. Others got more of poetry they read on their own time instead that they read in school. But many kids are not going to be exposed to poetry by family or friends, and many kids are not going to stumble across it on their own. For these kids, English class is going to be their first exposure to poetry. Maybe it will be their only exposure, and maybe it will start them off on it.
I didn’t read “Let the Love Song of Alfred J. Prufrock” in English class, but I was introduced to it in junior high by a friend who had studied it in her English class. We both loved it. It was my favorite poem for a while. Now, while I am neither quite middle-aged nor an English teacher, I’m closer than I was then, and the poem leaves me cold–just not much of an Eliot fan.
But then it did something for me: I thought I couldn’t relate to being a middle-aged man, but I could relate to the sense of lonliness and terrible, crippling self-consciousness that the poem expressed. “Prufrock” showed me that such feelings were not exclusive to 13-year-old girls. “Prufrock” opened my mind.
And there’s enough time in English to study both “Prufrock” and cummings. Study a variety of poetry.
Oddly enough I was one of those kids who disliked poetry for the most part. I did enjoy “To a Louse” by Robert Burns for some strange reason. I also remember having to write a lengthy report “Ode to a Grecian Urn” during my senior year that really did help me appreciate the poem a bit more.
Another thing to consider is that literature, television, movies, and other forms of media do not communicate their point literally. Uh, that is to say they use a lot of symbolism, metaphors, and other vague clues to make a point. Being able to recognize such things might prevent Spielberg from feeling like he has to knock us over the head with whatever he wants to say. Hell, maybe if I had more poetry I could see the genius in Verhoeven. Well, ok, I never said poetry was magical.
I can’t help but think of how much I could appreciate the Iliad (which I just read this past summer) because I was able to look beyond his words. There’s a scene where Hector leaves the hurly burly of battle and goes to visit with his wife and infant son. His son is terrified of Hector, that is until Hector removes his helmet.
So what does that mean? I took it that Homer was trying to say something other then the child was scared of his father. When men go to war they shed their humanity and become monsters. By taking off his helmet Hector was able to regain his humanity and connect with his child. Or maybe I’m just full of crap and the baby had gas, who knows?
Marc
We would save a lot of time.
I had 4 years of English literature in high school. I admit I lke some poetry and have some of Shakespeare’s plays on videotape. But it wasn’t worth 4 years and the teachers emphasize “good poetry” too much. I like what I like.
Whether someone is a Shakesperean actor or a physicist they still have to deal with money and financial decisions. ONE YEAR OF ACCOUNTING/PERSONAL FINANCE mandatory.
Dal Timgar
I don’t know where you “poetry has no relevance in today’s society” have been for the last twenty years, but hip hop and rap are the dominant musical styles in our society today. I hate to break it to you, but rap is poetry.
i think it should be like art and drama is at my school, in grade 8 you had to take it for half a semester, then the next year you pick one, so for poetry i think you should do a small amount in grade 8, as in 2 weeks or something you learn the basics of poetry, then in the older grades you can choose to enter an english class the has alot of poetry or one without
I would submit, timgar, that a working knowledge of poetry by the accounting auditors would have prevented a lot of the ‘poetic licenses’, that inundated the scandalous record books, from passing through the auditors’ checks with a rubber stamp.
To me, asking whether or not poetry is necessary is asking what the purpose of language is. Is it simply a means to an end, a way of telling each other what our wants and needs are? Or is it something that can be beautiful in and of itself, as well as being useful? Because that’s what poetry really is. It isn’t just a tool for communication. It’s about learning to appreciate words for their own sake, for their own unique beauty. To take that out of education… to me, anyway, it’s taking some of the vibrancy out of language and reducing it to something sterile and utilitarian.
Granted, I spent enough time in school to realize that nearly everything is rendered sterile and utilitarian there. But that doesn’t mean we should eradicate poetry, or any art, from our schools. It simply means that we need to change the way we teach it. I think Heart of Dorkness phrased this better than I could, however, so I’ll just refer you to his comments.
And one last thing that bothered me:
Technically, Shakespeare was a dramatist. However, most of his plays had passages in verse. So how he, a poet himself, can be more accessible than a lot of poetry, I’m not really certain.
Kids need poetry. They need to be stretched, and they need to be able to recognise the depth and weight that certain phrases, words, expressions etc have. They need to know about metaphor and imagery. Simply, it makes them smarter. Language is like a mental sea; it’s the element in which we think. To understand it, it’s necessary to study the most precise, compact form; poetry.
Added to which, I’m an English teacher and, in my experience, kids LOVE this stuff.
A question for people of the “well-rounded” theory of education:
What difference does it make if I take a poetry class if the skills I learn can’t get me a job?
As far as I am concerned, education, basic education, should be solely devoted to making people able to work and be productive. Everything else is extraneous, and can be offered for people who really care one way or the other about art and culture and stuff like that.
In fact, I think we should do away with the Liberal Arts model of education and send everyone to Vo-Tech. Or better yet, just make every school some form of Vo-Tech. 6 hours of focused study on a job every day, and another 2-3 for the people who care about foo-foo stuff like art appreciation, the kind of stuff that makes you sound intelligent but very rarely gets you a job except as a teacher of art appreciation.
Eek! So the only fit purpose of education that you can conceive of is to improve job opportunities? Criminy! WTF does “foo-foo” mean, my education is lacking?
I don’t remember reading nothing but poetry in high school. Mostly, we read novels and wrote papers about them. But anyway, citizens need to be educated for democracy to work. The people can’t rule if the people don’t have a clue. Without studying poetry, people would be a little less wise, a little less thoughtful, and a little less able to rule themselves well–just as if we stopped teaching music, or art, or algebra, or any other important intellectual pursuit. Getting a job is important for practical reasons, but can’t our kids grow up to be something besides economic, producing, consuming animals?
Up to a point, I agree with you, Airman Doors, USAF. I like the British model of education, which as I understand is that general education is over at 16: then it’s college prep, vo-tech, or work.
As far as your universal vo-tech idea, at which grade do you recommend implementing it? So few people end up doing what they intended to do when they were 18. A well-rounded education can help a young adult switch gears.
Other posters both serious and whimsical have listed the indirect lessons of poetry. Studying poetry is more than studying poetry; critical thinking, interpretation, problem solving, and social adjustment are taught through a variety of classes. We all bring skills to our jobs that we did not learn during specific job-training.
We all know that most kids do not read and write at their full adult level at the age of 12 or 14. Further learning is needed. For most kids, this means that further teaching is needed.
And I am terrified of an entire generation of voters being unleashed on society knowing even less about science and history than the average person already does.
I think this is the crux of the issue. I’d argue that education should be devoted to preparing people for life, and work is only a part of life (and it’s usually the part people wish they had spent less time on, at the end of the day). Besides, how would anybody know whether they cared about “art and culture and stuff like that” if they’d never been exposed to any?
I’d argue that the mission of a school is to bring children into contact with as many facets of human experience as possible. Sure, not all children are going to like or care about literature (or art or history or higher mathematics); not all of them are even going to remember anything about it in ten years; but they should all at least know it’s out there so they can make up their own minds about it.
But if you don’t like that explanation, cultivating a love of poetry does make economic sense, in a way. It’s one of the cheapest hobbies out there, and not a bad thing to have in reserve if you’re going to go through a period of unemployment – which most people do, no matter how good their vocational training may be
I’ve learned more about life from poetry than I ever did from, say, chemistry or physical education.
I’ve learned how to look at ordinary objects and situations in extraordinary ways.
I’ve learned that there are hidden connections between many, many things which can be seen through the right eyes, and that these connections can lead to other connections, and that sometimes these can be very valuable indeed.
I’ve learned that some experiences are common to more people and over more time than I had previously thought possible, and found comfort in knowing that others had trod the same paths I now walked.
And most of all, I’ve learned the power of the right word in the right place at the right time, and, even moreso, the power of the unsaid word in the right place at the right time.
Will any of this get me a job? Not really; it’s not the sort of thing that goes on one’s CV. But it does mean that the employee that someone does hire will be more than a drone who can’t think beyond tonight’s TV and next weekend’s drunken party.
Are you going to tell me that’s not worth anything?
Maybe it’s because as a poet he was often in disguise?
Airman Doors, you don’t think the ability to use language well, reading comprehension, and writing skills have any use in the workforce? Or you don’t think an acquaintance with poetry develops those abilities?