# What industry is most built on bluff and bull feathers? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 1, 2020, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994 "2020-08-01T16:20:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2020, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/101 "2020-08-09T17:30:30Z")
I’d be impressed if the typical wine connoisseur could accurately distinguish top-rated wines from run-of-the-mill stuff in a blind taste test. I’d be even more impressed if they could repeat the feat, say, a couple months later with the same wines (especially if you described the wines they raved about on the first go-round as ordinary vintages). No harm in wine buffs boasting of their superior and refined abilities. It supports an industry, gives them pleasure and provides entertainment for the rest of us. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2020, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/102 "2020-08-09T20:10:29Z")
Yes, there is even a middle ground. Stuff like Orvis clothing is made with all the quality needed, not just cheap disposable Chinese crap. And it _is_ more expensive. But like twice or thrice, not 100X. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2020, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/103 "2020-08-09T22:41:38Z")
Regarding expensive clothing, I thought [this ten-year-old article](https://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/29/fashion/29ROW.html) (New York Times paywall warning) was interesting. It describes a pair of men’s khaki slacks that retailed for $550 at Bergdorf Goodman (a luxury department store in Manhattan). The trousers are made of about two yards of an imported cotton gabardine fabric (no idea what that is) that costs $24 per hard plus three bucks per yard to import it. They were made in a union factory in Brooklyn where people made $13 per hour (remember, this was ten years ago) and it took about four hours of labor. So $56 in labor and $54 in materials cost for a total of $110. The clothing brand doubles that to $220 which is what it costs the retailer. The retailer marks it up by 2.5 times (apparently a standard factor) to arrive at a retail price of $550. Now, that’s more than I spend; khaki trousers cost me about fifty bucks. But they are probably the product of an overseas sweatshop. ---
**Author:** ![Bacon\_Cheeseburger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ebca7d/32.png) [@Bacon\_Cheeseburger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bacon_Cheeseburger)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2020, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/104 "2020-08-09T22:49:45Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > f you’re acknowledging that the materials, hardware and workmanship of the luxury brand are better than the discount store brand, you’re admitting that the price difference is more than just bullshit. a price difference might be warranted, but not a 1000% markup. Let’s say the better materials, extra labor, cost twice as much. You are still paying 10X as much just because it’s got the fancy label on it. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2020, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/105 "2020-08-09T23:00:40Z")
Coincidentally, my second post, right above yours, explains how a pair of khaki trousers could cost ten times what another pair costs. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/106 "2020-08-10T00:04:48Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > … that’s more than I spend; khaki trousers cost me about fifty bucks. But they are probably the product of an overseas sweatshop. In a way, it is lamentable that we allow that kind of uncontrolled importing. My mother used to make some of her own clothes to save money (I remember standing on a stool draped in one of her dresses so that she could get a straight hem), but these days it is more expensive to do that. I believe it is a net negative, because people being able to make their own stuff and save money is an emotional gain both personally and for society at large. ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/107 "2020-08-10T00:05:37Z")
Business consulting. There are two purposes to business consulting: 1. Tell the management what they already know 2. Take the blame when management does something unpopular, then disappear ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/108 "2020-08-10T00:08:55Z")
Here are 100 [Bullshit Jobs…And How To Get Them](https://www.amazon.com/100-Bullshit-Jobs-How-Them/dp/0060734809) ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/109 "2020-08-10T00:09:50Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > > [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > > > … that’s more than I spend; khaki trousers cost me about fifty bucks. But they are probably the product of an overseas sweatshop. > > In a way, it is lamentable that we allow that kind of uncontrolled importing. My mother used to make some of her own clothes to save money, but these days it is more expensive to do that. I believe it is a net negative, because people being able to make their own stuff and save money is an emotional gain both personally and for society at large. I’m not about to make my own clothing but I’ve been trying to be more conscious of how and where the clothing I purchase is made. Where possible, I buy stuff made in the US. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/110 "2020-08-10T00:15:57Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > My mother used to make some of her own clothes to save money, but these days it is more expensive to do that. I believe it is a net negative, because people being able to make their own stuff and save money is an emotional gain both personally and for society at large. The hours my stay-at-home mother spent toiling over her sewing machine are not something I’d wish on anyone not doing it for a living. Few mothers have that kind of spare time. I’ve never seen many fathers taking up the sewing slack. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/111 "2020-08-10T00:58:01Z")
Self-reliance is a great virtue. But no economist would consider it a net negative to import things from countries that can work more efficiently while concentrating on higher priced manufacturing or services. But any right minded person does not equate efficiency with lax labour laws that barely pay a survival wage or take advantage of children, women, the elderly and the uneducated. It is worth paying a little more to import things from countries, or favour companies, that treat workers with a degree of respect. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/112 "2020-08-10T03:45:07Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Now, that’s more than I spend; khaki trousers cost me about fifty bucks. But they are probably the product of an overseas sweatshop. I can’t imagine that you can’t get bespoke khaki slacks made for yourself for less than $550 a pair in NYC. That seems absurd for off-the-rack khakis. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/113 "2020-08-10T04:53:27Z")
Bills and I believe Orvis Khakis are made here in the USA, super quality materials, they run about $100 retail. So, the very best quality made in the USA chinos are $100. Everything higher is 100% bullfeathers and hype. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/114 "2020-08-10T14:17:52Z")
Sure, if you want to declare that Bills (whatever that is) and Orvis make the “very best quality made in the USA chinos”, then yes, anything more expensive is overpriced. But surely that is a value judgement? One would need to examine samples of various products to say that (and I assume have the expertise to judge such things, which I do not). ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/115 "2020-08-10T22:55:54Z")
sez you & your judgemental call of what diminishing returns are. In any type of racing - bike, car, boat, that last bit of performance, weight reduction, &/or aerodynamics cost the most. I don’t think anyone is going to confuse the Toyota Camry, Chevy, Dodge, or Ford that you buy in a dealership with those you see racing on a track in Daytona, Talladega or any of the other Nascar venues despite them being “stock” cars. Any clue of the budget for an America’s Challenge boat? Bladed spokes are more aerodynamic. Wireless shifters save the weight of cables. Even if you’re not racing, better equipment means you can go faster, farther, &/or be less fatigued after a ride because you expended less energy during the ride. **Political endorsements**. I could _maybe_ see if it’s from my union because _in theory_ they’re looking out for my best interests. Another politician, a celebrity, or a union other than mine? They’re just hot air. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2020, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/116 "2020-08-11T02:06:28Z")
What industry? The film industry. ---
**Author:** ![pullin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@pullin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pullin)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2020, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/117 "2020-08-11T10:32:41Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > Bladed spokes are more aerodynamic. Wireless shifters save the weight of cables. Even if you’re not racing, better equipment means you can go faster, farther, &/or be less fatigued after a ride because you expended less energy during the ride. I believe that high-end wines, bikes, and cars are actually better, but the difference is wasted on all but a few. Buying a $1000 bike to wander around the neighborhood, or an exotic car to commute is a BS waste of money for most of us. Personally, after years of training and practice, my waterskiing ability reached the level I _needed_ the high end ropes, fitted and professionally adjusted skis, an ASWA certified tournament boat and a private course to enjoy myself. But these things are comically overdone when bought by the average wally boaters. Also like wine connoisseurs presented with box wine from the Shell station, or an experienced biker offered a Walmart special, or me when relatives wanted to pull me behind their Bayliner, we decline these not due to smug superiority, but because it’s simply not enjoyable to us. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2020, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/118 "2020-08-11T16:04:18Z")
Decent wheels on a bicycle make a huge difference - worth spending a bit on them, but some other parts not quite so much, I have seen machines at well over $15000 which is silly money. Important things such as clothing need to be taken into account - this can make a big difference but again, it isn’t necassary to spend $150 on just one jersey or $200 on one pair of shorts. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/119 "2020-08-13T04:44:54Z")
> [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > I believe the vast difference in quality between a great wine and an average one exists, but not to the same degree for every person. At all. > > In “Think Like A Freak”, economists send an “application fee” to Wine Spectator for a deliberately foul wine and still wind up winning an Excellence award and an invitation to advertise it in upcoming issues. This is a remarkable example of bluff - an award you can buy. There is no reason.to think these are unusual. > > There are many good and very good wines which are reasonably priced. Not all of them would go well with spicy food, for example. You could certainly get a good or very good wine for well under forty dollars if you chose your country, year and type well. Forty dollars? ??? 😬 I just paid ten bucks for a five-liter box of perfectly drinkable sangria. I guess having no palate can really pay off sometimes. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994/120 "2020-08-13T04:52:17Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > > [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > > > So I know for me, a fine wine tastes somewhat better than a good one but not so much that I wouldn’t rather have better food > > I’m not really disagreeing with anything you’ve said, and I definitely lay no claim to being a wine connoisseur or even close, but I consume a lot of the stuff to the point that I rarely have a dinner without a glass of wine or three. Based on that, I’d say that I and my fellow wine aficionados probably appreciate a really great wine more than the average occasional wine consumer, though none of us have ever spent ridiculous amounts on a single bottle. When we really, really like something, though, it’s not unusual for any of us to spend ridiculous amounts on a case or two of good stuff. > > As for “better food”, there is a wonderful intricate linkage between the two. An appropriate wine not only enhances the food, but the food very often enhances the wine, especially robust full-bodied reds that may seem overwhelming when drank by themselves, but absolutely glow in the harmony of a matching food. It’s truly a synergy, and one of life’s pleasures. > > One of my favorite pastimes, which I don’t indulge in nearly often enough, is going to a great restaurant at a local winery, which always features a _prix fixe_ menu option with matching wines selected for each course by their sommelier. Every time I’m there I fantasize about becoming a billionaire and either buying the place or hiring away their head chef. 🙂 That seems like a lot of work. Why not just go there for dinner every day? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-industry-is-most-built-on-bluff-and-bull-feathers/916994.md?page=7)