# What international upsets are comparable to the 1980 Miracle on Ice? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 2, 2022, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602 "2022-06-02T22:41:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2022, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/1 "2022-06-02T22:41:17Z")
Trying to find similar examples for perspective/get an idea of the thing (I was born quite a few years after the 1980 Olympics.) What’s a comparable non-hockey example of some nation upsetting a heavily favored foe to the same extent? ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2022, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/2 "2022-06-02T23:11:54Z")
**(Football)** **Leicester City win the English Premier League** Finished 14th in the 2014-15 season. 5000-1 chances to win in 2015-16. Won by 10 points. **(Rugby Union)** **Japan beat South Africa** Japan beat the Springboks 34-32 in the 2015 World Cup. Even if you know nothing about rugby, simply as a sporting drama the final couple of minutes will bring chills [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/-1KtaiDmkp4/maxresdefault.jpg "The Miracle of Brighton | Japan v South Africa 2015") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1KtaiDmkp4) **(Tennis)** **Mark Edmondson wins the Australian Open** Australian Mark Edmondson was ranked 212th in the world, and with several countrymen ahead of him. He did much better than expectations when making the final rounds. He beat number 1 seed Ken Rosewall in the semi-final, then the top ranked Australian John Newcombe in the final. **(Cricket) Headingley 3rd Ashes Test 1981** Replying to Australia’s 9/401 England are dismissed for 174, the follow-on is enforced and ENG are over the precipice and holding on by a fingernail at 7-135 before Botham scores 149no to finish the innings at 356 setting Australia 130 to win. Australia get to 1-56 before Willis takes 8-43 for England to win by 18. Still too painful to discuss further. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/3 "2022-06-03T18:29:26Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Trying to find similar examples for perspective/get an idea of the thing The Russian team were seasoned professionals of the highest caliber. If I recall correctly, just before the Olympics they had humiliated the NHL All-Star squad in an exhibition game. Just crushed them. (Google says it was a 3-game series that did go to game 3, but the Russians won the final game 6-0.) The USA was still sending amateur athletes to the Olympics, so the American team was a bunch of college kids. I’ve always thought that hockey was similar to baseball where the college game wasn’t even remotely close to the pro league. It’s really hard to come up with similar upsets because the difference between the two squads was so vast. The Americans were essentially two full tiers below the Soviets. It would be like the Superbowl winning NFL team losing a game not just to a college team, but a college team in the second division, 1-AA or whatever they call it, with the weight of national pride against a mortal enemy at stake. Just unthinkable. Saw an interview a while back with one of the Soviets who was asked about the reaction when the team got home to Russia. He said it wasn’t anger or threatening, the general response they got was a confused “Were you drunk?” ---
**Author:** ![Teuton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/teuton/32/3864_2.png) [@Teuton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Teuton)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/4 "2022-06-03T19:26:18Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > Australia get to 1-56 before Willis takes 8-43 for England to win by 18. > Still too painful to discuss further. New Zealand losing to Bangladesh in a test match at home, soon after winning the Test Championship mace, is probably a bigger ‘giant-killing’. > **[Ebadot rips through New Zealand as Bangladesh complete historic win](https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/bangladesh-in-new-zealand-2021-22-1288977/new-zealand-vs-bangladesh-1st-test-1288979/match-report)** > > Fast bowler takes six as Bangladesh beat reigning champions for their first win in the country across formats ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/5 "2022-06-03T19:53:18Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > It would be like the Superbowl winning NFL team losing a game not just to a college team, but a college team in the second division, 1-AA or whatever they call it, with the weight of national pride against a mortal enemy at stake. Just unthinkable. More like an NFL All-Star team composed of Pro Bowlers from both conferences that were playing for keeps. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/6 "2022-06-03T20:06:26Z")
Vietnam vs U.S.A.? (You only specified “non-hockey”…) ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/7 "2022-06-03T20:46:56Z")
> [@bump](#): > > More like an NFL All-Star team composed of Pro Bowlers from both conferences that were playing for keeps. But that’s just it, the Soviet team wasn’t an All-Star team, it was the professional national team with tons of experience playing together as a team. They just beat the NHL All-Stars probably because the NHL guys didn’t normally play together. The only modern-day equivalent that comes to mind is the US women’s national soccer team. I would say any national soccer team, but I get the feeling the US women’s team plays a lot more games together than a typical men’s national team. Likewise I think the Soviets had a ton of experience as a team. As a general rule, I would expect the Superbowl champions to absolutely dominate against an all-star squad, but in fairness, the advantage they have from experience is largely a factor of coaching. As in, they get their actual coach and an actual game plan. The All-Stars are just tossing something together probably not much more advanced than a preseason game plan the first year of a new system. The analogy is starting to break down comparing to hockey, though. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/8 "2022-06-03T22:07:37Z")
The [US beating England in the 1950 World Cup](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v_England_(1950_FIFA_World_Cup)) was an enormous upset, since soccer was a tiny niche sport here at the time and England was considered one of the world’s powerhouses. But it was just a group stage game, so nowhere near the impact of the Miracle on Ice. ---
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/9 "2022-06-04T00:51:04Z")
How about Steven Bradbury winning Australia’s first Winter Olympic gold medal by skating around in a comfortable fifth for most of the race until the other four guys wiped out at the very end? (The same thing happened to him in the semifinal, I believe. It must have been kismet.) ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/10 "2022-06-04T01:23:11Z")
Billy Mills beats Ron Clarke(world record holder at the time), Mohammed Gammoudi in the 10,000m run in the 1964 Olympics. Mills ran 50 seconds faster than his previous best for the distance. Still the only American to win gold in the event. (Galen Rupp took silver in 2012) Check out his finishing kick. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/mUt-ccwtpjo/hqdefault.jpg "BillyMills 1964 Olympics") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUt-ccwtpjo) ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/11 "2022-06-04T07:00:57Z")
That was amazing! Fun to watch. Near the beginning of that final lap, in the first turn, he was shoved outboard a couple of lanes. And Billy Mills is a US Marine too. He was a 1st Lieutenant when he ran in the Olympics. Very cool. ---
**Author:** ![NetTrekker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nettrekker/32/2909_2.png) [@NetTrekker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NetTrekker)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/12 "2022-06-04T16:27:50Z")
> **[Basketball at the 1988 Summer Olympics – Men's tournament](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basketball_at_the_1988_Summer_Olympics_%E2%80%93_Men%27s_tournament)** > > The men's tournament in basketball at the 1988 Summer Olympics in Seoul began on 17 September and ended on 30 September. > The Soviet Union won their second gold medal, defeating Yugoslavia 76–63 in the gold medal match. > This was the last Olympic basketball tournament where NBA players were not allowed to participate; FIBA instituted a rule change in 1989 that lifted that restriction, leading to the dominance of 1992's Dream Team. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/13 "2022-06-04T16:37:59Z")
Sweden defeating the USA in the women’s hockey semifinal at the 2006 Olympics was a much, much bigger upset than the Miracle on Ice. I can’t think of a greater single game upset in modern sports history. The extent to which Canada and the USA have dominated women’s hockey is really without comparison in any other well organized international sport you can name. That game is the only Olympic hockey game ever in which either Canada or the USA have lost against anyone except each other. (At the annual World Championships, I can think of one game in which Canada lost to Finland. Other than that Olympic shocker, that’s it, so far as I know.) It’s not just that they beat every other team in the world every time; they usually DESTROY every other team. It was just an unbelievable shock. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/14 "2022-06-04T17:06:58Z")
The USA Men’s basketball team’s sixth-place finish at the 2002 World Basketball Championship was a shock to many, although it shouldn’t have been. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/15 "2022-06-04T17:13:51Z")
Sort of the reverse of the 1980 Olympic hockey match is the 1972 Olympic men’s basketball final. Much like in hockey at that time, the U.S. team was made up of amateurs (college players), while the Soviet team was technically amateurs, but they had “jobs” with the Soviet army, etc., and were effectively professionals, who had played together for years. Even so, the U.S. had never lost an Olympic men’s basketball game up until that point; they were 63-0 going into the final. In '72, the U.S. team was the youngest Olympic basketball team in history, but was still heavily favored. The ending of the game was controversial, with the game officials making rulings which led to an in-bounds play with three seconds left in the game to be played three separate times; after the third run of that play, the Soviets won the game on a last-second shot. There were numerous accusations afterwards that the game had been “fixed” by the officials in favor of the Soviets, the U.S. team protested the results of the game, and the players refused to accept their silver medals (50 years later, those medals are apparently still in a vault in Switzerland). > **[1972 Olympic Men's Basketball Final](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1972_Olympic_Men's_Basketball_Final)** > > Pages for logged out editors learn more > > The 1972 Olympic men's basketball final was the last game of that year’s Olympic basketball tournament, and became one of the most controversial events in Olympic history. With the ending mired in controversy, the Soviet Union defeated Team USA by one point, marking the latter's first ever loss in the event. Both the U.S. and the Soviet Union won their first eight games of the tournament, with the US team having its overall Olympic record at 63–0... ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/16 "2022-06-04T18:15:52Z")
It’s really hard to compare, but an upset that was as historically significant for Germany as the Miracle On Ice for the USA was “Das Wunder von Bern”, the miracle of Bern, the 3-2 win for West Germany over Hungary in the 1954 World Cup final. At the time, Hungary was called the “wonder” team, had been unbeaten for three years. had beaten England at Wembley as the first team ever shortly before and had the biggest stars in their squad of all teams, including one of the best strikers of all time, Ferenc Puskas, Real Madrid star. Germany OTOH was a crass underdog, still struggling mere nine years after the war to regain a national standing, also in sports. They had lost 3-8 against Hungary in the group stage, and nobody, German or other, expected a German win, not even a close match. It was a match that made history in Germany, not only in a sports context. It was the first event after the war for Germans to be proud of and infused the country with a new self-consciousness. > **[Germany Is Born: The Miracle of Bern](https://www.spiegel.de/international/germany-is-born-the-miracle-of-bern-a-420110.html)** > > Every nation has a founding legend. For modern Germany it is the 3-2 victory over Hungary in the 1954 World Cup. After World War II, the championship became a sign of being accepted by the world again. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2022, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/17 "2022-06-05T19:52:22Z")
I always had the impression that the Soviet team was basically their equivalent of the 1992 “Dream Team”- the best players from the top Soviet hockey league. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2022, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/18 "2022-06-05T20:55:12Z")
Same, but for some reason I feel like they were an experienced national team with a bunch of exhibition games, like the USWNT in soccer, who are also the all-stars of their league. The Dream Team never did anything in between Olympics, I don’t think. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2022, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/19 "2022-06-05T21:12:01Z")
Missed the edit window. Here’s what the previous post would say if I didn’t spend 16 minutes rewriting it. Doh! At least now I can quote it since it’s not the very next post anymore. * * * > [@bump](#): > > I always had the impression that the Soviet team was basically their equivalent of the 1992 “Dream Team”- the best players from the top Soviet hockey league. The Dream Team is an excellent comparison. The key difference is the Soviet team had extensive history playing together as a team, but the talent level comparisons are right on point. It would be like the Dream Team losing to a Chinese college team or whatever their equivalent amateur league would be. (Who is the #2 bball country? Is it China?) [The wikipedia page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle_on_Ice) describes them thusly: > [@](#): > > The Soviets were led by legendary players in world ice hockey, such as [Boris Mikhailov](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boris_Mikhailov_(ice_hockey)) (a top line [right winger](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winger_(ice_hockey)) and team captain), [Vladislav Tretiak](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladislav_Tretiak) (the consensus best goaltender in the world at the time), the speedy and skilled [Valeri Kharlamov](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valeri_Kharlamov), and talented, dynamic players such as defenseman [Viacheslav Fetisov](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viacheslav_Fetisov) and forwards [Vladimir Krutov](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Krutov) and [Sergei Makarov](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergei_Makarov_(ice_hockey)). From that team, Tretiak, Kharlamov, Makarov, and Fetisov were eventually enshrined in the [Hockey Hall of Fame](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hockey_Hall_of_Fame). Clicking on the first name, Boris Mikhailov, describes his career with the national team: > [@](#): > > On the Soviet national team, he played 14 seasons, most of them as captain. He scored over 200 goals with the national team, second only to [Alexander Maltsev](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Maltsev). He led his team to the Olympic gold medal in [1972](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_hockey_at_the_1972_Winter_Olympics) and [1976](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_hockey_at_the_1976_Winter_Olympics), a silver medal in [1980](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_hockey_at_the_1980_Winter_Olympics), eight [IIHF World Championships](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IIHF_World_Championships) (1969,1970,1971,1973,1974,1975,1978,1979), and nine [Izvestia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channel_One_Cup_(ice_hockey)) championships. Mikhailov’s last game with the Soviet National team was played in front of 14,000 people at [Luzhniki Ice Palace](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luzhniki_Ice_Palace). His teammates carried him around the rink on their shoulders to a thunderous ovation. I doubt they all have the same amount of experience on the team but for sure every single one of them had way more team experience with that particular team than anyone on the Dream Team, who were essentially a pack of mercenaries who had never played together before. These weren’t _just_ all-stars at the top of the sport. They were also a seasoned, professional team. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2022, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602/20 "2022-06-05T22:06:10Z")
I think the possibility of a great game from a goalie negates comparisons to NFL teams losing to D2 teams or whatever. I’d take a longshot bet for a hockey team with a hot goalie or in a lower scoring sport like soccer, or a baseball team with a promising pitcher. An NFL team losing to a D2 college team is impossible absent throwing the game or the team dying in a plane crash and forfeiting. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-international-upsets-are-comparable-to-the-1980-miracle-on-ice/965602.md?page=2)